Veterans Affairs Committee on Feb. 14th, 2024

[Luc Fortier]

Thank you very much for the question.

As I mentioned earlier, in 2018, I was told that I was leaving the army for medical reasons and I was asked to take the steps to obtain a health insurance card and to find a doctor.

The last time I saw a health insurance card I was 18, when I had a physical exam to join the army. That was the last entry in my civilian record. I left the army 32 years later. I am 55. That is a difference between a military member and a civilian.

Whenever something is not right, the civilian has the chance to go see a doctor, keep a medical record and have follow-up appointments accordingly. For military members, that is a bit more complicated.

I could say that is the difference right there.

[Luc Desilets, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Many legions are struggling, at least in Quebec. Yours is a bit outside the norm in the sense that it is truly very dynamic. It is a legion that is growing, that has plans. You could tell us about your motorcycle club, among other projects.

Do you believe it would be possible, for an average-sized legion in Quebec, to coordinate its operations with what is happening at the transition houses?

[Luc Fortier]

I am working on it. Two weeks ago, I started doing preliminary work on this.

Obviously, we could knock on every door and ask for all sorts of partnerships, but first we need to make sure that the ideal conditions are in place. We can present a partnership somewhere and receive a negative response. It depends on when this happens and with whom.

[Luc Desilets, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Do you have enough money to meet the more complex demands, where an unending list of forms need to be completed when a military member leaves the army?

[Luc Fortier]

When a military member leaves the army, people at the legion may be the last to take care of him. When he leaves military life, there are all sorts of services available to him. That is why we really do not become part of a veteran's life until things start to go poorly. Often, the military member does not know what the legion does and only turns to us when someone suggests that he come see us, that we might be able to help him.

By the time he lands at our doorstep, it is sometimes too late. However, there is always a way to make up for lost time because we have a good partnership with Veterans Affairs Canada, with stakeholders at OSISS, and with all the other stakeholders.

[Luc Desilets, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Fortier.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Thank you, Mr. Desilets.

I want to welcome Brandon Hanley.

I invite Ms. Rachel Blaney to take the floor, please.

You have six minutes.

[Rachel Blaney, NDP, North Island—Powell River, BC]

Thank you. I appreciate that, Mr. Chair.

I want to thank both of the folks here for testifying, not only for your amazing testimony and for showing up, which I think is really important, but also for your service to the country. I appreciate it deeply.

I'll come to you first, Ms. Riguidel, about a couple of things. I am going to lean on your expertise. Do you have any feedback or thoughts on how members who are transitioned out are screened for MST? If they aren't, could you tell us a little bit about that?

It does worry me, because I've heard a few times that some CAF members talk about military sexual trauma as a women's issue. It is not just a women's issue, and that concerns me because it brings up that stigmatization. When people are leaving, it's a good time to feel safer to disclose things.

Is there any process that happens during that time that you're aware of?

[Donna Van Leusden Riguidel]

It is entirely the responsibility of the member to self-identify if they are a survivor of MST and require support. Like you said, it's not a gendered issue. I just had a situation where I travelled out of town to help a male survivor who suffered an incident in 1987 to finally put in a claim for it and finally start to get some help. That person has been suffering with PTSD since that time and although, from many viewpoints, he's been quite successful professionally, he recognizes that he's been struggling. It's only now that he's coming through this that he's finally able to say that it had been scarring him the whole way along.

The male survivors I've worked with have issues around the question of their own gender identity at that point sometimes. They struggle a lot with that as a result of what happened. There are a lot of other pieces that come into play, especially when you're talking about the “old guard”, the biases and everything else that existed back then. It's very difficult for them to come forward.

When you talk about supports for homeless people, a lot of those are built around the male population. When you talk about support for people who have suffered sexual trauma, by and large the support is built around the female victim because, as we know, it's often biased that way, even though there are a lot of men out there who are suffering in silence and people who identify as male who are suffering in silence. They don't know where to turn.

[Rachel Blaney, NDP, North Island—Powell River, BC]

This is concerning for me for many reasons, but also because, if you do not acknowledge it at that final step, then supports at the VAC level could be blocked.

Can you give us any suggestions about how the transitioning process can be a safer process for people to come forward, so this can get captured and they can get the supports they need, regardless of where they are in their transition?

[Donna Van Leusden Riguidel]

One way would be to make it a routine to make sure that the caseworkers at transition have training on how to provide those supports and that they're open to it.

I've talked to a lot of military people who make it quite obvious. They'll have “positive space ambassador” signage on their cubicles and that sort of thing. It's not difficult to do that sort of thing and to be very open to the fact that you've had this training and that you're available and ready to listen.

I think offering service providers in all the genders as opposed to just having those who identify as men or those who identify as women being the sole point of contact is very important, because you might have a much easier time approaching somebody of a gender that you feel comfortable with. I think that there are a couple of things like that we can do to make things a lot easier for people to come forward. As lot of it is educating that it is okay to come forward, that it won't cost you everything.

For this particular survivor I'm using as my story point, it was a very uphill battle to reassure him that people didn't have to know, that this wasn't going to be something people were going to find out about and abuse or anything like that. The chain of command doesn't have access to the files of VAC.

Even when he first put the claim in, he called to make sure that they had received it, and the response back from the person was, “That's an old claim. It probably won't get approved.” I had to go and tell him that MST is different. It's not the same as breaking an ankle and then claiming 20 years later that you have ankle pain. This is a different type of injury. We need to make sure that the people who are answering the phones aren't saying things like that, which can be discouraging.

[Rachel Blaney, NDP, North Island—Powell River, BC]

That's very concerning. What a horrible thing to happen.

You also talked about your reality. I am concerned, because we know that we're having a hard time attracting people to the service. Being a reservist is another pathway. We're blocking opportunities for them, especially after they've faced trauma.

In terms of the transition process, what are your recommendations on this particular issue?

[Donna Van Leusden Riguidel]

I recommend taking a really close look at the policies. Return home moves weren't something that was really examined, because it used to be a little more of a rare occasion. Class B contracts used to not happen very often. They've become a lot more commonplace, especially if you're talking about moving to the NCR. It's very common that reservists will get moved here to take over positions to backfill for active duty people who are on deployment.

Enable them to apply for an extension on that benefit based on need. Obviously you can't necessarily throw the doors open, but when somebody has a diagnosed service-related injury, that should be a fairly easy call to make. I was surprised to find out that the policy didn't allow for it. Hopefully we can figure it out.

[Rachel Blaney, NDP, North Island—Powell River, BC]

Thank you. I know I don't have any more time. I wanted to ask you a little more about the app, because I think that was really important feedback.

If there's anything you want to add, please send it to us, because I think, if something is not working so profoundly, we really need to see that fixed.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Thank you so much, Ms. Blaney.

We will stop there today.

On behalf of the committee members and myself, I want to thank your for taking part in this meeting.

Thank you to the witnesses who were here with us.

I want to thank Luc Fortier, Vice-President, Quebec command, from the Royal Canadian Legion.

I also want to thank Donna Van Leusden Riguidel, Director of the Survivor Perspectives Consulting Group.

I also want to thank you for your leadership and for everything you do for veterans. You continue to be active. Do not give up, please.

I also want to thank the entire technical team, the interpreters and the clerk of the committee.

The meeting is adjourned.