Veterans Affairs Committee on Feb. 2nd, 2026

[Tatiana Auguste, Liberal, Terrebonne, QC]

Thank you for answering my question with so little time.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

Thank you very much, Ms. Auguste.

Ms. Gaudreau, you may go ahead. You have two and a half minutes.

[Marie-Hélène Gaudreau, Bloc, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

Mr. Morrow, we're having a discussion, a chat. Starting a business is tough. The greatest gift you can give an aspiring entrepreneur is information about who to turn to. That tends to be the key that unlocks helpful networks for veterans, be they young, old or highly educated. The current networks that provide support to business people are not organizations that were developed by the public service. They are chambers of commerce, business networks and such.

My sense, and I may be wrong, is that they get you ready, to a certain extent, for navigating day-to-day life when you leave the armed forces and enter the civilian world. That is one piece. Some may experience a post-traumatic reaction that the average person can't understand. Being together, being with brothers in arms, makes a major difference; it has a very positive impact. The other piece is to say that this is part of starting a business, but you need the network of contacts. My sense is that that is the only helpful piece for you, unless you face a stigma, such that you're labelled and rejected. People need to be informed about your skills, your portfolio, everything you've done; that information needs to be shared. Promoting that value can be tough because sometimes, the desire is to….

In a few seconds, can you tell me whether I'm off the mark?

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

You have 20 seconds.

[David Morrow]

I spent 15 years in the armed forces, and when I got out, I didn't have a network of contacts, because I hadn't been in the business world. I built a network thanks to my podcast. We can go after the enemy, but we need some direction. Otherwise, it's very difficult.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

Thank you, Mr. Morrow.

I'll go to Mrs. Jansen for five minutes.

[Tamara Jansen, Conservative, Cloverdale—Langley City, BC]

Thank you so much, Mr. Morrow. I really appreciate your coming here to share your challenges with us.

I want to say that entrepreneurship has not been particularly popular for the last 10 years or so. I come from an entrepreneurial background, and what I love about everything you said was that, straight out, you guys have unique qualities. You have a huge risk tolerance. That's what you need as an entrepreneur. You think outside the box, and a lot of people don't like that. They're not comfortable with that. VAC probably falls into that genre. You never give up and you want to fill a need, and that's what it takes to be an entrepreneur.

Just the fact that you've come here is awesome, because I love to see, as you said, not just veterans but all Canadians seeking to become entrepreneurs, to depend on themselves.

I was just wondering. You mentioned the fact that VAC doesn't even consider it when you're talking about changing from....

Tell me a little bit more about that process, because that kind of blows my mind. It doesn't and it does.

[David Morrow]

There's VAC, and then there's PCVRS. If we include them as one big amorphous blob, from the get-go it wasn't clear what the policies were and what I had access to. I didn't realize that moving over to PCVRS meant that I couldn't access my education training benefit. This meant that I had to go through their retraining process.

The funny thing is that I had left the forces and worked for over a decade with no follow-up. I just didn't want to talk to the military; I was done with them. I didn't open any letters, and I didn't answer phone calls. I just wanted them to get away from me.

That said, when I went back to get help, I was already well into a teaching career. I had worked a bunch of different jobs that just kept falling apart. I didn't realize it was because of my service-related injuries.

That said, they get in the way essentially because they just don't have any policy guidebook to go by. That's all they do: They follow policy, but there's nothing there for anybody who decides to become an entrepreneur. They're suspicious of it because they think we're trying to commit fraud. That is 100% my experience and some of my friends' experiences. I'm speaking anecdotally here, obviously.

To improve that.... It is just that the culture here in Canada is not entrepreneurial. This bleeds into organizations that are mandated to take care of us, because they just don't....

As I said, I tried to get a chair because I have a bad back. They said, “That'd be great, but unfortunately, you don't have a job.” I said that I do; I'm in a chair basically all day. I'm doing podcasts. I'm helping veterans. They said, “Well, you're self-employed. Sorry, we don't support that.” This means I'm being limited in my ability to get services because I decided to be an entrepreneur, and to me that just isn't fair.

[Tamara Jansen, Conservative, Cloverdale—Langley City, BC]

Could you reiterate for me what the United States is doing that we should be doing? That sounded really exciting. You had some really great points.

[David Morrow]

Well, there are a lot of things, and we could do a whole hearing on them.

One of the main things I've noticed is that the Americans, as we all know, are the masters of entrepreneurship. They're willing to take risks, and their companies—I'm talking about their major corporations—are willing to take risks and build networks because they realize that this is the engine that keeps America going.

We could have the exact same thing here. We have a much smaller population, but I'm sure our numbers are relatively the same. We need to get our numbers in place. We need to know exactly how many are in entrepreneurship. We need to know how much revenue they're bringing in and then what we can do to help.

What they've done is set up amazing events. They have individuals who are willing to put up lots of funding based on a pitch, like on Dragons' Den. This is the support we need here. I'm not talking about loans; I'm talking about literal investment. Capital investment in our companies would help us grow this community significantly, and we wouldn't always have to look to the United States to help grow our companies. Unfortunately, this is what I have to do—and what a lot of our companies have to do now—to find a market that will actually help us grow.

[Tamara Jansen, Conservative, Cloverdale—Langley City, BC]

That's wonderful.

I just met Brett Wilson from Dragons' Den this weekend, so we'll have to put a little bug in his ear about this idea.

When you go to reintegrate, does it even mention the word “entrepreneur”?

[David Morrow]

Never.

To give you an idea of what I had to do physically as part of my rehabilitation—even though I'd had six or seven jobs during the time when I wasn't being followed by VAC—they had me carry heavy buckets, put pegs into pegboards and write an Excel file. Despite everything I'd told them and all of my experience, I still had to go through this process.

I said I already had gainful employment, but that doesn't have a NAICS code, so I didn't fall into anything. They just basically assumed I wasn't doing anything to help my process along, and that was unfortunate.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

That is appreciated, Mr. Morrow.

Mr. Casey, you have five minutes.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Welcome, Mr. Morrow. Thank you for your service and for your testimony. It's absolutely fascinating.

Before putting my name on the ballot, I spent some time running a family business, and I chaired an angel financing network in Atlantic Canada, so the stories of your challenges hit fairly close to home.

I want to start with the veteran and family well-being fund. Is this a fund you've been able to avail yourself of in your business?

[David Morrow]

Yes. I'm very thankful for the fund in helping get the A.T.H.E.N.A. program off the ground. It's an online program for female veterans of the Canadian Armed Forces. It's helped over 200 women get healthier and fitter since 2022. It is quite rare for a for-profit company like mine to get funding. This is something that could help companies —especially in the entrepreneurial space—that are for-profit and are putting out good programs that could potentially help the veteran community.

Since then, however, I've heard nothing from the veteran and family well-being fund. I don't know when the next application date is. It seems very opaque, unfortunately, so I don't know if I'll ever get funding from them again. I've resorted to a B2C-type model in which individuals pay to get on the program.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Since you got the support through the program, are you aware of any other opportunities to avail yourself of it?

[David Morrow]

In Quebec, we have the Quebec Veterans Foundation, which has helped with funding. I've also reached out to my American friends to see if they're interested in building this into an international program. I'm using my entrepreneurial skills to try to build this out. The veteran and family well-being fund hasn't funded this program specifically for over a year, but there's a lot of potential for programs like it to branch out.

I'd just say one thing about the fund. I appreciate the fund, but one thing I would like to see from it is greater accountability, to know which programs that are getting funding are actually effective. If I'm doing my numbers, and I'm making sure that my program is running well and is getting results, I want to make sure that the other ones are doing that as well, so that we can rank them and determine which programs are helping veterans get the help they need and become better.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

At the very start of your presentation, you indicated that you organized an international veterans entrepreneur conference. Can you talk a little more about that?

[David Morrow]

Absolutely.

To be clear, I didn't organize the conference, but it is called the Military Influencer Conference. It happens every year in the United States. What I did was bring team Canada down to Atlanta two years ago, having built a really good relationship with the organizers in the United States. They said that this would be a great time to highlight a bunch of Canadian businesses. They had never done this before and wanted to branch out into Canada and the U.K. to build this brand.

I brought down six Canadian companies, including my own. We had Dallas Alexander play his own special set, so we did a very big splash. It landed really well with the Americans and with the Canadian entrepreneurs, who had never seen anything like it.

For the four days that you're there, you feel like a rock star. You get all the exposure. You have your booth, and there are tons of people asking you what you're doing in terms of your business and discussing how we can partner and collaborate.

Then there's a beautiful gala dinner. There are all kinds of stars—Jon Stewart, you name it—and they recognize all the support members of the veteran community, like milspouses and individuals who go out of their way to make sure the veteran community is strong and progressing.

I saw this as an opportunity to show other Canadians that it is possible. We can do this, not necessarily on that big a scale, but we can definitely bring something like it back home to Canada.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Okay. I have less than a minute.

Can you tell us a bit more about the Prince's Operation Entrepreneur and the affiliation with the University of Regina, please?

[David Morrow]

Yes, the University of Regina program with Prince's Operation Entrepreneur was great for me. It helped me get my head straight as to what I wanted to do. Unfortunately, it's now defunct, as far as I can tell. I think people are trying to save it, but from what I could tell—if I could just reiterate one point—the model didn't make sense.

The reason it didn't make sense is that you have a charity that isn't bound to market forces trying to help entrepreneurs, who are bound to market forces. It doesn't matter whether they produce a bunch of really good companies, because they get their funding regardless. If, however, you have an organization like an accelerator, which is tied to the market, you could end up creating a whole bunch of really good companies that will then move out to the free market and be successful. This was my main contention with the program.

It was a great program. I learned a lot, but it had its flaws because it wasn't tied to the market dynamics.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

Mr. Morrow, thank you for appearing before the committee today.

I'm sure all members really enjoyed hearing about the great work that you do. Again, thank you for your service, sir.

I will suspend so that we can welcome our next two witnesses.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

We are now starting our second hour.

Please be advised that we're having some technical issues with one of the witnesses in our second panel, so I may ask permission to check the audio at some point.

Joining us today is Basil Ryan, chief operating officer, Atlantic Association of Community Business Development Corporation.

Mr. Ryan, the floor is yours. You have five minutes.

[Basil Ryan, Chief Operating Officer, Atlantic Association of Community Business Development Corporations]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair, for the invitation to appear before your committee.

I'm the chief operating officer of the Atlantic Association of Community Business Development Corporations. We're a network of 41 non-profit corporations governed by volunteers from our local communities. Our work is primarily in community business development, with an emphasis on access to capital and business support. We form part of a larger network of 267 Community Futures corporations from coast to coast to coast.

With reference to the specific question on barriers to entrepreneurship, I'd suggest that my response is more anecdotal than based on any empirical evidence.

In my office, I recently had a veteran on staff. My chief financial officer has a son who is a recently retired member, and his wife also recently retired from the military. Lastly, my son-in-law is currently stationed in Edmonton, Alberta, and is getting close to retirement, so the subject matter is relevant to me.

I'd like to break my comments into two sections: first, the barriers, and second, possible solutions for consideration by the committee. I recognize that some of your previous witnesses have already provided you with commentary on the matter, and some of my testimony repeats what's already been heard.

Ex-military entrepreneurs face a combination of financial, psychological, structural and network-based barriers. I will note six of them.

The first barrier is challenges in a military-to-civilian transition. The military is regimented, as you know. Entrepreneurship can be anything but regimented. Transitioning from one to the other can be very challenging.

The second is access to capital and credit barriers. Individuals leaving the military would have a reduced income stream and may also lack specific collateral to post as security. Depending on their individual deployments, maybe in the navy, in another country, etc., they may not have a strong credit history.

The third is translating military skills into business competencies. Individuals may have excellent skill sets within the military environment that are applicable to entrepreneurship, but they may have a difficult time translating them into an entrepreneurial culture. Veterans may face gaps in business acumen, such as marketing, financial literacy and strategic planning.

Fourth, there are limited social and professional networks outside the military, depending on their individual deployments and/or assignments. Their social and professional network may not include access to mentors or small business networks.

The fifth is psychological health and stress-related barriers. Stress, identity shifts and mental health impacts of service can create additional hurdles. Entrepreneurship's inherent uncertainty can intensify stress for those accustomed to a clear mission structure, affecting decision-making and resilience.

Lastly, there is navigating fragmented support systems. Not unlike individuals outside the military seeking entrepreneurship, ex-military may struggle with understanding who can help and how to find that help.

In terms of possible solutions, we've been quite successful in targeting other marginalized groups with access to financing and business management skills development. In Atlantic Canada, we encourage our member corporations to be open to all individuals who want to pursue entrepreneurship.

In 2003, we recognized that women face different barriers than men do in starting businesses, and we introduced a risk mitigation fund to encourage our corporations to be more open to lending to women business owners—a loan guarantee, if you will. We also targeted young entrepreneurs and first-time entrepreneurs in the same fashion. The results were substantial increases in the volumes of business transacted with these targeted groups. We were able to leverage capital on an exponential basis. We dedicated a risk mitigation fund of $8 million that has leveraged over $197 million to these targeted groups.

We recently replicated this program to target other marginalized groups under equity, diversity, inclusion and accessibility. There is no reason, other than having access to financial resources, that we cannot do the same for veterans.

In contrast, we offered some direct lending support to technology-based companies back in 2004. The direct lending program had $5.7 million for capital. It lent $10 million. The leverageability of this was far less than doing it via a risk mitigation fund. We augmented the risk mitigation fund by offering business management skills training at a nominal cost to entrepreneurs, because we believe that better-trained entrepreneurs have better chances of success.

The work we do with Community Futures, based on analysis that's been done by Stats Canada, suggests that firms assisted by Community Futures have a higher five-year survival rate, employ more people and have higher sales.

That's my opening statement, Madam Chair.