Veterans Affairs Committee on April 20th, 2026

[Dean Allison, Conservative, Niagara West, ON]

Thank you very much.

I have about 45 seconds. I want to recap what I've heard.

Access to capital is key. We don't need to start a new program. We have a bunch of government programs. Why not set aside some funds, like we do for Black, indigenous and women entrepreneurs, as a possibility?

Then I'm hearing that regulation and red tape is killing you guys, like it's killing all entrepreneurs in Canada. We have to figure out the way to do it.

The last point I'll make, which I also heard from you, Dallas, is that we need mentorship. We need someone to walk alongside any entrepreneur but certainly our veteran entrepreneurs, and we need to try to figure out how we can make that happen.

I would also suggest to the committee that we need to reduce that cap and the dollar for dollar. It makes zero sense. It really doesn't encourage people to take risks.

That's all my time.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

Mr. Allison, congratulations. Thank you. That was amazing.

Thanks to our witnesses.

Mr. St‑Pierre, you have the floor for six minutes.

[Eric St-Pierre, Liberal, Honoré-Mercier, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Mr. Apollon, thank you for being here today and for speaking in both French and English.

I must admit that I studied law at McGill University, not at the University of Ottawa. I am also a member of the Barreau du Québec, and I worked for the firm Gowling, not Norton Rose Fulbright. So please don't judge me!

Thank you for sharing the work you do with us. It's truly impressive. I'm curious to learn more about the transition of veterans, which you're using as a catalyst for innovation and creativity.

Tell us about the program you've created.

How could it be implemented on a larger scale?

[Garrick Apollon]

I think we need to go back to the recommendation that was made. Futurpreneur Canada doesn't just provide funding. It also offers mentoring and training. You can't just provide funding. Even I was a business lawyer, and when I made the transition to entrepreneur, I saw that it wasn't the same thing. You need mentoring, a community and a lot of support.

That said, funding is one of the necessary elements. At the University of Ottawa, we would like to get $20,000 per participant, as well as $5,000 to reinvest. Participants would receive this as a micro grant upon completing the program. It would help them enormously. It would provide a solid start. It could also serve as a prerequisite for the organization—whether it's the Business Development Bank of Canada, or BDC, Futurpreneur Canada, or the Veteran Business Network Institute, or VBNI, which I mentioned—that will be responsible for managing the federal government's funding or loan program for veteran-owned businesses. This ecosystem would work well.

We'd like to start as soon as possible with a cohort of 20 participants, and then ramp things up. We'd like to start this fall, but I don't think it will happen that quickly. Given the bureaucracy, we have to be realistic, but I think we could start as early as next year. There could subsequently be hundreds of participants who would receive online training and group mentoring. They would then receive their funding.

[Eric St-Pierre, Liberal, Honoré-Mercier, QC]

Thank you and good luck.

Mr. Pittman, I will ask you a question in English, if that's okay.

Thank you for your 19 years of service. Thanks for sharing your story about suffering from PTSD and the courage involved in starting a business. I imagine it must have been challenging.

Can you speak about some of those challenges as you were going from a military service career into entrepreneurship? Can you share some of those challenges?

[Damien Pittman]

Dallas touched on it.

I will be the first to say that, while serving, we don't have to deal with a lot of the day-to-day logistics that the majority of Canadians do, because the military has a system that looks after all of those things for us, like appointments with the doctor or dentist. After coming out of the military, I said to my wife within two weeks of getting released, “I need a doctor's appointment. How do I get a doctor's appointment?” She had to walk me through that.

Coming out of the military, we have an extraordinary number of skills that will get us through the worst conditions you can imagine, and that's not just being in different countries. That could include the most stressful situations that you can imagine even right here in Canada.

The red tape and the logistical non-support makes it very difficult. Then if you add on the fact that it's an injured.... I'm not taking anything away from healthy veterans, but if you're an injured veteran, it's even more so.

[Eric St-Pierre, Liberal, Honoré-Mercier, QC]

Thank you.

I'm mindful that I have a minute and a half left. I'll ask Mr. Prince my final question.

Thanks for the work you do. When I was reading your bio, I got really excited, because my daughters went horseback riding for the first time in January. Seeing the joy of a seven-year-old on a horse in the outdoors brought me tremendous pleasure. Thank you for the work you've been doing in Alberta at FNV Ranch.

Can you quickly, in the next minute, discuss the benefits to veterans of being in the outdoors? Can you speak about how that changes their mindset and how that's positive for some of the clients you have?

[Dallas Prince]

The program we offer is a 10-day pack trip program out to the backcountry, out to the Willmore area. In terms of the benefits, just being around horses allows you to be selfless. You have more than yourself to worry about. You also have your animal. There's a partnership between the veteran or first responder and the animal.

There's also being in nature. It's been proven that nature therapy is actually a modality of psychological care. That, coupled with horse equine therapy, speaks volumes to how well it helps veterans and first responders dealing with PTSD and other stresses.

[Eric St-Pierre, Liberal, Honoré-Mercier, QC]

Great. Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

Thank you very much.

Ms. Gaudreau for six minutes.

Ms. Gaudreau will be speaking in French, so make sure you have chosen

the right language.

[Marie-Hélène Gaudreau, Bloc, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

Today's meeting is interesting because we're practically wrapping up this study. Honestly, I think we'll have all the recommendations we need to get back on track.

Actually, I spoke with the witnesses earlier. I told them that I am an entrepreneur myself and that, indeed, if you start a business after age 40, there are limitations due to your age.

That said, let's look at the situation from a different angle. What about, for example, people with reduced mobility or a disability? There are plenty of programs.

I met with veterans on the weekend. Yet again, they told me they were being forgotten. As we know, the government is going to invest in defence, which is noble and important. However, how can we encourage new entrepreneurs when, as military life ends and they transition to civilian life, there are obstacles?

Obstacles for someone who has everything they need is not the same as obstacles for someone who may need a little extra help. Seriously, we're falling. How far are we falling? I can attest to it. Some are on the streets. Others are sleeping in their cars. They have children. I can't believe it.

So that's why what we're doing today is very positive. I dare to hope—really, and I'm saying this loud and clear—that the recommendations will not only be analyzed but also implemented.

It's the same with employment insurance. We've been waiting 10 years for a promised reform. For the people watching us, it's the same for veterans.

If we really want it, we can do it. So, there is political will right now, and I thank you, because it needs to be repeated 100, 200, 300 times. Right now, we have a head start. We have three years to implement a lot of things.

I therefore invite you to send us further recommendations. I am very much on the same page regarding the fact that we need to understand veterans, understand the challenges they face following their military service, and adapt accordingly. Adaptation can also mean reducing delays. Bureaucracy is dreadful. We have everything we need then.

I'd also like to hear your thoughts on talent and expertise. I'll start with Mr. Pittman.

It's rather incredible to limit everything you've developed—qualities that are directly linked to those of an entrepreneur. I'm also an entrepreneur, and I know it takes a fighter, a warrior, someone who isn't afraid of anything and who will see it through to the end.

In your opinion, do people understand enough about what your entrepreneurial skills entail?

[Damien Pittman]

Absolutely, 100%. I believe that, as veterans, we are.... There is the common mentality out there that veterans are amazing. While we serve, we're told that when we leave, we have all of these skills and traits that businesses in Canada want. However, when we leave and start looking for these, the doors are shut on us.

If you look at most veteran entrepreneurs, you will see that the ones who are successful are successful because they don't quit. When things get tough, they don't quit. That's why they're successful, and that is what the Government of Canada did to us. It made us that way. It wanted us to never quit, to have all of these traits. It instilled all of these things. Eighteen-year-old Damien Pittman is not 49-year-old Damien Pittman. They're two totally different people, and the military did that for me.

[Marie-Hélène Gaudreau, Bloc, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

That's exactly right.

Mr. Apollon, I might come visit you, since my eldest son is studying at your university.

Truly, I think you're spot on regarding the additional support and, above all, the fact that assistance shouldn't be limited. If I understand correctly, the limit is set at $6,000 per veteran.

Can you clarify that in 30 seconds?

[Garrick Apollon]

It's simple: The bureaucrats decided that our program was just a course, not a university certification program. Arbitrarily, they decided to give us $6,000 per participant. We decided to continue the program, even though it would result in financial deficits for the university.

We wanted to be here today to talk about the opportunities we offer. We want to serve the community. There was no program left after the King's Trust in Canada ended its program, Operation Entrepreneur. So, we carried on regardless.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

Thank you very much.

You have five minutes, Ms. Wagantall.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

Thank you so much, Madam Chair.

Thank you, all, for being here today. I think this has given us a lot of information that we can certainly use to make things better in this circumstance.

Mr. Prince, you founded FNV Ranch. I assume that's facta, non verba: “deeds, not words”.

[Dallas Prince]

Yes, ma'am.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

That's an amazing name. The ranch has equine therapy for veterans. Is it a non-profit or a business?

[Dallas Prince]

It is a non-profit.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

That's great.

One thing I will mention is that it seems to me that there are an awful lot of veterans' businesses and organizations that are focused on assisting our veterans. It comes from their hearts and being part of that family.

I'm just wondering, Mr. Prince, whether you receive any funding from VAC directly.

[Dallas Prince]

No, ma'am.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

What about the veterans who come to ride on horseback and get all of the advantages to improving their lives when they come to take part in your program? Do they receive VAC support to help cover the costs?

[Dallas Prince]

Not to my knowledge, ma'am. We've talked about that with several of our participants. They've talked to their case managers, but we've been unsuccessful in getting any sort of funding, even for travel to our program.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

I find that disconcerting. When you think of the number of veterans organizations that do exist within the entrepreneurial world, with that spirit, that are not appreciated by VAC so that it's able to support those, is it because...? I'm not sure what the answer to that would be. It's very interesting.

Would that be something that you're apprehensive about because of the fear of losing that $20,000?

[Dallas Prince]

The way that it works with us, because we are a registered non-profit, is that the funding that goes into the ranch goes completely to the participants. Therefore, my personal pension and income aren't affected by the donations put towards the non-profit.