Veterans Affairs Committee on Oct. 21st, 2025

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Airdrie—Cochrane, AB]

No, that's fine. It almost makes it sound as though the minister isn't important to the operation of the department, and that would also concern me. If the ministers in this government really don't run anything at all, that is also a problem.

Let me turn to something else that I want to ask about.

We had Veterans Transition Network here as part of this study a couple of weeks ago. They talked about having to use the charitable donations they receive to pay for the attendance of clients who would be VAC eligible to do their group counselling programs, for example, because VAC cannot or will not process the funding in time. We heard from a number of service providers that they don't want to turn them away, obviously, but what happens is they get into the program for a while and then VAC won't pay, because they have already been involved in the program for some time. We've also heard from some providers that there has been about a 60% decrease in the rate of funding approvals as a result of that. There is no change in the number of clients they're serving who are VAC eligible, but they're seeing fewer and fewer being covered by VAC because of delays, I think, which is really the challenge.

What are you doing to try to increase access to those specialized mental health services, specifically for veterans who are at risk of suicide? It's obviously concerning when someone is VAC eligible but organizations are having to use charitable donations that they could have used for other things when they shouldn't have to.

[Christine McDowell]

Before I turn to my colleagues to respond to that, I want to clarify the fact that the minister has very clearly established priorities for Veterans Affairs. As she said in her opening remarks, it is around veterans employment, it is around commemorating modern veterans and it is around making sure we are delivering consistent and effective service.

With that, I'll turn it over to my colleague.

[Steven Harris, Senior Assistant Deputy Minister, Service Delivery, Department of Veterans Affairs]

Thanks very much.

We appreciate the work of Mr. Thorne and the Veterans Transition Network, along with a number of organizations that help to support veterans. We work to help pay for those veterans when they go into eligible programs, which includes the ones that are offered by the Veterans Transition Network and others. There are a large number of programs across the country that are trying to help and support veterans. We want to be able to help them in finding ones that are appropriate for them and that suit their well-being needs and their rehabilitation objectives.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

I'm sorry, Mr. Richards. Your six minutes are over. Thank you.

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Airdrie—Cochrane, AB]

We'll get back to this.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

We will. Thank you very much.

Mr. Casey, you have six minutes.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I think this first question will go to you, Mr. Harris. Mr. Richards asked the minister about the employment strategy. He left the impression that there was only one thing that mattered on the employment strategy—the number of jobs as a result of it. How do you measure success in connection with the employment strategy? Can you speak to it in a little more detail?

[Steven Harris]

We want to measure success for the employment strategy in a number of ways. Ultimately, employment is certainly one of them. We have a number of individuals leaving the Canadian Armed Forces on an annual basis, including reservists, who are already employed in one way, shape or form. The employment strategy, for us, is about supporting our four different pillars.

One pillar is for the veterans, making sure they understand their own skills and how they can gain additional skills through training, through vocational rehabilitation and through other means. It's helping employers understand where they can find veterans and help to employ them, and how to basically accommodate them and help to support them when they come into their employment and into their companies. It's helping the public service to recruit veterans. Many veterans who leave the Canadian Armed Forces want to continue to serve at public service levels, be that at federal, provincial or municipal levels or in other ways. It's helping organizations to be able to effectively train and support veterans as well. Third party organizations may be able to assist them in certain ways.

The unemployment rate for veterans is actually lower than the unemployment rate for Canadians as a whole. That doesn't mean there isn't value to add in the employment space. Underemployment can certainly be an issue for veterans, and there are other reasons.

So we are doing that. I'll give you an example of success for us. We do online career webinars. Just next week we're doing one. One thousand veterans have signed up to be part of the career webinar next week, which includes 50 employers coming to recruit them.

These are things we can do to help connect throughout the delivery of the employment strategy.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Thank you, Mr. Harris.

I think this one is for you, Mr. Freeman. Mr. Richards was looking for some specific numbers with respect to the homeless strategy. I think that's under your bailiwick. Can you give us some more detail around the homeless strategy and the facts and figures associated with it?

[Mitch Freeman, Acting Assistant Deputy Minister, Strategic Policy, Planning and Performance Branch, Department of Veterans Affairs]

Certainly.

I would highlight a couple of things. First and foremost, over 1,400 veterans have been assisted through the veterans homelessness program since its inception in 2023. That's a huge measure of success. Of course, this is a program that saw in 2023 a veteran homelessness estimate of a little over 2,000 veterans who needed some supports and services over the course of a year with respect to being homeless or at risk of being homeless. Today, that number, estimated on 2024 numbers, has decreased to a little shy of 1,800. It's very positive in that particular regard that the program is having the impact.

I would say, colleagues, that the measure of success on this is that 34 organizations that are in communities across the country from coast to coast are part of the veterans homelessness program and are out there reaching veterans. You heard the minister speak of some of her personal interactions over the course of the last number of months in that regard. This has certainly given us the opportunity to collect better data on understanding this particular problem as we go forward and how we can help more veterans.

I mentioned that a little over 1,400 have been helped and assisted. That includes wraparound support services, or the services that veterans need in order to be stable, and at the same time an assistance to veterans to find long-term housing and transitional housing, etc. That program has certainly been impacting veterans positively from coast to coast.

Thank you so much.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Thank you, Mr. Freeman.

I'll go over to you, Mr. Tessier.

In the first round of questions, we heard that the budget at Veterans Affairs has doubled in the last 10 years and somehow that was a bad thing because there are some veterans who are unhappy with how those dollars are spent. My understanding is that in the distribution of the funds that are spent by Veterans Affairs, 90% of them flow straight through to the veterans. Could you offer some comments with respect to the significance of the growth in the Veterans Affairs budget from the time we came into power?

[Pierre Tessier, Assistant Deputy Minister, Chief Financial Officer and Corporate Services, Department of Veterans Affairs]

The budget for Veterans Affairs in 2015-16 was approximately $3.7 billion. The budget forecasted for this fiscal year is $7.8 billion. The current percentage of department budget funds towards veterans programs, benefits and services is 94%. The programs for veterans and their families are quasi-statutory in nature. What that means is that as the demand increases, if more veterans and their families come forward, that funding is available throughout the year for us to adjust our budgets to ensure all veterans are served.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

The amount of money spent by the Department of Veterans Affairs has increased significantly in the last 10 years, and 94% of it has been paid out to veterans. Is that what I'm to understand?

[Pierre Tessier]

That is correct.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Thank you, everyone. I very much appreciate you for being here.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

Ms. Gaudreau, you have the floor for six minutes.

[Marie-Hélène Gaudreau, Bloc, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Mr. Harris, are you satisfied with the delivery of services to our veterans?

[Steven Harris]

I think the right answer is that we can always do better.

[Marie-Hélène Gaudreau, Bloc, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

On a scale of one to 10, where two means “woefully inadequate” and eight means “very good”, how satisfied are you?

[Steven Harris]

I would say I'm at 7.5. We have the right programs and systems in place to meet the needs of veterans. However, it's not perfect. We will have to work even harder to—

[Marie-Hélène Gaudreau, Bloc, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

Okay, but I'd like to understand something. Achieving 80% is considered a success. I get that; I'm in business, and I've worked with community organizations. What about the other 20%? Is there a department for those who've been abandoned?

I mentioned earlier the two women who have been asking for a public apology for two years, because, although they're alive, their names were added to a monument for fallen soldiers. I can't imagine what they're going through. I mean, it's been two years. Something's got to happen. Is there a department for those who've been abandoned?

I have people coming to my office every week telling me they can't reach anyone on the phone, much less in French—that takes another six months. Others tell me they can't find a doctor willing to help them, because their case is too complicated. These people have mental health issues; they've been to war. Come on. It makes no sense. It's like we're in another world. We have to reflect collectively on the respect and honour we owe them.

It scares me, because the government wants to increase military spending, but doesn't even have the necessary equipment. Representatives from the women veterans council come to the committee in the hope of changing things, but then get asked, “What have you done? What did you say?” I hear stories like that every week in my office and I can't believe it. It has to stop.

What are you missing to take concrete actions?

I'd like to hear from each of you on this. I have four minutes left.

[Steven Harris]

What I can say is that, every day, my team works very hard to help all veterans, men and women, those who show up in our offices just as much as those who are less visible. It's very hard, but they keep going. They contact the veterans' family members, friends and others to help them, particularly through the many programs we offer.

[Marie-Hélène Gaudreau, Bloc, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

Does that happen?

[Steven Harris]

Others can add to my answer, but when it comes to service delivery, we are there to support our veterans, and it's a difficult job.

I, too, speak every day with men and women veterans who have issues that our programs and services can't always help with. It's not easy.

We work very closely with everyone on that, not only those who have it the easiest or whose situation is more obvious.

I can assure you that the people in my field, in my department, work very hard to support our men and women veterans.

[Marie-Hélène Gaudreau, Bloc, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

Madam Chair, I'm not criticizing the quality of the service.

We have 10 fingers, two arms and one head. At some point, we'll have to face the facts. If this is so important and veterans have our respect, then let's show it, whether it's with funding or in another way.

A minister with only five months’ experience in the position can't know everything.

I don't know how long you've been in your position, Mr. Harris, maybe two years, five years, 10 years, but the problem is cyclical.

I wonder whether those working at the department have any compassion. I mean, 80% or 75% is considered a success rate.

I apologize; I'm getting quite emotional, because at every committee meeting, we meet traumatized people and we traumatize them even more when we end up abandoning them.

It's been going on for too long. That's true. People tell us their problems are piling up.

Is there a place or a department that can help those who have largely been forgotten?

We tell people that we want to help them, that that's what we're here for and that if there's an emergency, we will take action. Then we apologize and say that we dropped the ball on something, that we weren't thorough. It's time to face the facts. The current situation makes no sense.

Maybe another witness, someone on video conference, can answer.