Debates of Jan. 24th, 1994

Student Loans

[Eugène Bellemare, Liberal, Carleton—Gloucester, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I wish to make colleagues in the House of Commons aware of a serious situation developing with student loans.

The former Tory government abolished the initial six months of free interest on student loans.

Many Canadian graduates now find themselves without jobs, without money and with student loans of $30,000 or more. How can we ask these young people to pay back their loans right away when they are unemployed?

Jobless graduates have become discouraged, even desperate. I urge my colleagues to support youth employment programs and a fair repayment plan of student loans.

St. John's East

[Bonnie Hickey, Liberal, St. John's East, NL]

Mr. Speaker, I take this opportunity to be the first female MP from Newfoundland and Labrador to speak in the House of Commons.

On October 25, 1993 the people of both St. John's ridings had the wisdom to elect me and my friend from St. John's West as the first women to represent our fair province in this honourable House.

The issues brought to my attention by my fellow Newfoundlanders during the campaign are clear. Unemployment is dangerously high. Our young people are beginning to lose hope and many families are finding it all but impossible to cover their basic needs.

However Newfoundlanders are at their best when times are the hardest. We continue to have the lowest level of income in the country but we give to our charities the most. This is the type of character that makes me proud to represent the people of St. John's East. I would like to thank the voters who have put their trust in me, in the Prime Minister and in this government team to address the issues of their concerns.

Youth Unemployment

[Sue Barnes, Liberal, London West, ON]

Mr. Speaker, let me offer you my personal congratulations and those of my constituents of London West.

There are many challenges facing this government, but one which we must address quickly is the 17.2 per cent level of youth unemployment. Approximately 355,000 young people remain unemployed in Canada. These youth have become innocent victims after years of economic hardship. With them we will work toward forging a new economy founded on information and knowledge based industries.

I am confident that in its promised priority for job creation this government will assist in a productive school to work transition and work co-operatively with business, labour and other levels of government to achieve our objectives.

I ask all members of the House to strongly endorse measures including the establishment of the Canadian youth services corps and the formation of new apprenticeship programs. We must support our human resource of young talent and energy as we head into the 21st century.

Cigarette Smuggling

[Maurice Godin, Bloc, Châteauguay, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I am amazed at the lack of interest shown by the federal government and its lack of co-operation in helping the provinces stop the illegal sale of cigarettes once and for all.

Despite its promises to take action right after the election, the Liberal government is dragging its feet on the increasingly serious problem of smuggling. Instead of helping provincial governments to tackle the problem, it is passing the buck.

This government is not doing any better than the previous Conservative government that was rejected by the population. It is in this government's interest to help solve the problem instead of aggravating it.

How long will small businesses have to protest to make the authorities understand that the two kinds of justice dispensed by the present system cannot be tolerated?

New Zealand

[Ted White, Reform, North Vancouver, BC]

Mr. Speaker, in 1979 I emigrated from New Zealand where the government of the time was immersed in a policy of tax and spend with overgenerous social programs and widespread reliance on welfare.

In 1984, as many members will be aware from the "W5" television program, New Zealand experienced a debt crisis. The tough decisions that should have been made by the politicians turned into drastic decisions when New Zealand could no longer deficit fund its spending.

Unless all members of the House learn from the experiences in countries like New Zealand, Denmark and Sweden which have all experienced debt crisis in the last 10 years, Canada too will soon be on the brink of a debt crisis.

The new free enterprise, unsubsidized, minimally regulated economy of New Zealand today is proof that there is a great reward for gaining control of government spending.

Canada-Ontario Infrastructure Works Agreement

[Jerry Pickard, Liberal, Essex—Kent, ON]

Mr. Speaker, today the Government of Canada has taken another step toward fulfilling its commitment to job creation.

Federal and provincial colleagues assembled in Toronto this morning to sign the Canada-Ontario infrastructure works agreement. This undertaking paves the way for Ontario residents to benefit from more than $720 million of federal funding to be matched by provincial and local authorities to build and upgrade our infrastructure services.

As a result of this initiative jobs will be created immediately. Roads, sewers, water mains and other services will be improved. It will enhance our economic growth and create jobs today and well into the future.

This government's commitment to jobs through programs like this one and upcoming strategies such as the youth corps apprenticeship initiative will act as a catalyst for the country's economic development.

The Environment

[Wayne Easter, Liberal, Malpeque, PE]

Mr. Speaker, as was mentioned in the House on Friday, the Irving Whale sank off the coast of P.E.I. some 23 years ago. It remains there today, with 3,100 tonnes of bunker sea oil in its tanks. Federal officials have tried for years to assure Islanders that the barge does not pose an environmental risk, however after 23 years few Islanders share that confidence. This is increasingly evident in recent weeks.

It has been reported that the Canadian Coast Guard has recommended the oil be pumped out. I am pleased the Minister of the Environment agrees that it is not a question of whether or

not to remove the oil but is a matter of finding the financing and is a matter being discussed within government.

It is my intention and that of my colleague, the member for Bonaventure-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, to continue the pressure to resolve the issue and to have the oil removed from the Irving Whale . It is time, as one committee is named, to ``bail the whale''.

The Budget

[Audrey McLaughlin, NDP, Yukon, YT]

Mr. Speaker, there have now been two meetings on pre-budget consultations. This is the opportunity for the new government to show that it is really prepared to take a new direction and to listen to all Canadians.

Recently the hon. member for Willowdale voiced surprised at the tighten the belt attitude that has dominated pre-budget meetings, but I ask if one has predetermined the results by the invitation list and by virtually ignoring all presenters who present an alternative view, should one really express surprise at the result?

I urge the minister and I urge the government to ensure that these pre-budget consultations, unlike the ones of the previous government, show new direction that all Canadians are listened to and that we have a budget which reflects the needs of every Canadian, not just simply one group.

Cigarette Smuggling

[Lucien Bouchard, Bloc, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Prime Minister.

The shopkeepers' revolt against smuggling is growing in Quebec, with the regrettable decision of store owners in the Saint-Eustache region to sell cigarette cartons for $20 today in order to fight the unfair competition from professional smugglers.

In a statement he made yesterday in Granby in reaction to this revolt, Premier Johnson of Quebec made the following urgent appeal to the federal government: "The plan to sell cigarettes without collecting taxes should first of all bring a reaction from the federal police".

Given this appeal from the Premier of Quebec, asking him to assume his responsibilities and enforce the law, what is the Prime Minister of Canada waiting for to order the RCMP to dismantle the smuggling rings?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Leader of the Government in the House of Commons and Solicitor General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, this is a serious situation and I wish to assure my hon. colleague that the RCMP is prepared to lay charges where the evidence shows that federal law has been broken.

[Lucien Bouchard, Bloc, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Prime Minister. Given this vague answer, which is only a statement of intentions that have never been carried out so far, does the Prime Minister not realize that all this is reinforcing everyone's impression that the Government of Canada and the Prime Minister have in effect ordered the RCMP to turn a blind eye on smuggling?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

As the Solicitor General indicated, the Royal Canadian Mounted Police have received orders to make all citizens of this country obey the law.

[Lucien Bouchard, Bloc, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, do the government and the Prime Minister not recognize that there is something extremely unhealthy for the citizens of a democracy and a society based on law to see the state come down harder on small shopkeepers who are the victims of smuggling than on the real smugglers, the professional traffickers, who for many years have been acting with complete immunity, in broad daylight and on a very large scale, thus depriving the federal and provincial governments of huge amounts of money?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I have nothing to add except to say that of course the federal government and the governments of Quebec and the other provinces must act to enforce the law. That is what the Solicitor General instructed the RCMP to do and I hope that the provincial governments will give the same instructions to their police authorities.

Member For Markham-Whitchurch-Stouffville

[Gilles Duceppe, Bloc, Laurier—Sainte-Marie, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is directed to the Prime Minister. In the Throne Speech last week, the government announced its intention to monitor the behaviour of ministers and members. We just heard that the Liberal member for Markham-Whitchurch-Stouffville was fired in 1989 from his teaching position, after he sent a series of 17 threatening letters to his colleagues, the last one containing death threats-

[The Speaker]

Order. We had several questions on the subject last Friday, and today the hon. member in question made a speech in the House. Perhaps the hon. member would care to rephrase his question?

[Gilles Duceppe, Bloc, Laurier—Sainte-Marie, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I was just getting to my question.

How could the hon. member for Markham-Whitchurch-Stouffville run for the Liberal Party, if the party executive was aware he had been fired because of these death threats?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I do not think I have anything to add to the statement by the hon. member for Markham-Whitchurch-Stouffville who apologized before the House this morning. We have a tradition in the House that applies when no criminal charges were laid.

I remember when I was a member here, one of the members rose in the House and admitted that in the past, he had served a prison sentence, but since that time he had been a member in good standing of his community. After this admission he was given a standing ovation by the House, because he had become a very good citizen.

[Gilles Duceppe, Bloc, Laurier—Sainte-Marie, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I realize apologies were made this morning, but according to House security regulations, any person who had made such statements, whether or not he apologized, would be prohibited from entering Parliament Hill.

[The Speaker]

Order. This is not a matter for the government to deal with, and I think it is rather difficult to answer the question because it is not up to the government to take action in this respect. Perhaps the question could be rephrased somewhat?

[Gilles Duceppe, Bloc, Laurier—Sainte-Marie, QC]

This was my preamble, Mr. Speaker. How does the Prime Minister intend to deal with the case of the hon. member for Markham-Whitchurch-Stouffville?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the members of this House have their private lives like anybody else. There are members who in the past faced criminal charges and sat as members until their problems were resolved before the courts.

In the case of the hon. member for Markham-Whitchurch-Stouffville, no charges were laid before any court whatsoever. There was no judgment. The hon. member in question apologized to Canadians, and in this House, it is the rule that when a member apologizes for making a mistake, those apologies are accepted.

If every member in this House who made a mistake in the past were obliged to leave the House, there might not be many members left who would not have to rise in the House and say: I made a mistake at some point in my life.

The hon. member admitted he made a foolish mistake, and he apologized. I think the Standing Orders of this House indicate that one accepts the apologies of a member of this House.

The Senate

[Preston Manning, Reform, Calgary Southwest, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I have a question for the Prime Minister.

As he knows, Senator Everett from Manitoba, after providing many years of independent-minded service in the upper House has resigned his seat and called for an election of future senators.

Will the Prime Minister today assure the people of Manitoba that if their legislature were to pass legislation providing for the election of a Senate nominee that he would appoint the winner of such an election to the upper chamber?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the Canadian Constitution makes provision for the appointment of senators. We will amend this procedure when all of the provinces agree to an elected Senate. We cannot have some elected senators and some appointed senators. We have to amend the Constitution, but it is clear that the members of this House are not willing to do so.

I do not intend to change the Constitution at this moment. We will respect the Constitution. It is the basic law of the land. It is the way the Constitution is written. I will respect the Constitution until it is changed.

[Preston Manning, Reform, Calgary Southwest, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I have a supplementary for the Prime Minister.

The Prime Minister well knows that Senate nominees can be elected without any constitutional change. Almost three months ago the Prime Minister received a letter dated October 28 from Premier Klein of Alberta touching on this same subject.

He sought assurance from the Prime Minister that if a Senate vacancy were to arise in Alberta and a Senate nominee were to be elected in accordance with the provisions of the existing statute, the Alberta Senate Selection Act, that he would appoint the winner of that election to the upper chamber.

Can the Prime Minister now give the premier of Alberta that simple assurance?