Debates of April 13th, 1994

Canada Pension Plan

[Lloyd Axworthy, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development and Minister of Western Economic Diversification]

Mr. Speaker, I thank the hon. member for bringing that particular issue to my attention.

As I understand it that particular regulation has been in the CPP book since about 1966. As he points out it could impose a special burden on small and medium businesses at a time when we are trying to encourage them to create jobs and create growth.

Based upon the representation of the hon. member I will undertake to review that regulation and see if we can make a change.

Gun Control

[Val Meredith, Reform, Surrey—White Rock—South Langley, BC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Justice or the parliamentary secretary for justice.

The government continues to talk about gun control for legitimate gun users.

In August 1993 Frederick Stephen Dieno was arrested in a shootout with the RCMP in Surrey, B.C., while fleeing after robbing a pharmacy with a gun. Mr. Dieno was originally charged with 40 offences, including eight armed robberies and accompanying use of a firearm during an indictable offence. However, in a plea bargain arraignment last week Mr. Dieno pleaded guilty to two charges of robbery. All charges of using a firearm were dropped.

How can the minister ensure that Canadians can feel safe from the improper use of firearms when charges of using a firearm during the commission of an offence are routinely plea bargained away?

[Russell MacLellan, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, for the next few weeks the Minister of Justice and the department will be studying very closely the possibility of making changes to the gun control laws. These changes if decided upon will be brought forward and dialogued with all members of Parliament.

I want to say that questions relating to the administration of justice and plea bargaining are under provincial jurisdiction. As such they are not within the responsibility of the Minister of Justice.

[Val Meredith, Reform, Surrey—White Rock—South Langley, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to see there will be co-operation with the government side in making some changes to the gun control legislation. Unfortunately, I have every reason to believe it is in the wrong direction and it is against legitimate gun users.

We are asking for changes in the law. We want to know if the government is prepared to make changes in the law to prohibit plea bargaining away existing gun control on the illegal use of guns.

[Russell MacLellan, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, I agree with the hon. member that plea bargaining away charges on armed robbery should not take place.

This question relates to the study the Department of Justice is conducting on gun control. It is doing it very intensely and with the same concern the hon. member presents to this House. I am sure we will have something to tell the hon. member and indeed all members very shortly.

Budget Cuts

[Yvan Loubier, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the Prime Minister said in Edmonton on March 4, 1994 that the only cuts to be made in the next three years were those announced in the Budget; however, the Minister of Finance said in London on April 11, 1994 that there would be more deep cuts.

Speaking of possible cuts, he said: "I will make the answer very clear." That means yes, he will cut. So said the Prime Minister in Ottawa on April 12, 1994.

Who was telling the truth, Mr. Speaker? The Prime Minister in Edmonton, the Prime Minister in Ottawa or the Minister of Finance in London?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the very large cuts that the government made, especially in Defence and elsewhere, in programs that we are now reviewing, criticized by the opposition, when we always said that we would make those cuts. That is the basis of our budget. I said in Edmonton and here that the ministers could try to reduce government spending outside the budget, on a daily and weekly basis.

The results of this operation will be known every week or in the weeks to come. I think that in the next few days, for example, some ministers will have an opportunity to announce that some programs or institutions in their departments can be abolished right now. They will make announcements when they are ready. At the end of the year, we will see how much more was cut, in addition to what we promised in the budget.

[Yvan Loubier, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the Prime Minister has just disowned his budget. He has just said that his budget is no longer worth anything.

Now that he has admitted the need to make additional spending cuts, now that it is clear that he cannot do the job on his own, is the Prime Minister prepared to involve Parliament in this process by creating a parliamentary committee to review the government's finances, as we have been asking him from the beginning?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

It is the duty of all parliamentary committees, when they review the appropriations of every department, to make the appropriate recommendations. If members of the Bloc Quebecois and the Reform Party want to make recommendations, the committees are there. They sit every week and I am sure that all committee chairs will be very pleased to consider all recommendations for spending cuts and that will make the hon. members very happy. I asked our party to do so, because we want our members to be involved. There is no problem, then. You will have the estimates of all departments and you can make the suggestions that you want to make. They will be considered by the committee and forwarded to the government in due course.

Immigration

[Art Hanger, Reform, Calgary Northeast, AB]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Citizenship and Immigration.

Yesterday in the Standing Committee on Citizenship and Immigration the minister revealed that he wants to attract more immigrants from Europe. I ask the minister to assure this House he has no intention of introducing ethnic or racial criteria into the government's immigration policy.

[The Speaker]

I believe that this matter is in committee now. However on a more general type of question perhaps the minister would like to respond to that.

[Sergio Marchi, Liberal, Minister of Citizenship and Immigration]

Mr. Speaker, this side of the House is having some degree of difficulty in trying to understand the nature of the question.

On the one hand the hon. member is talking about the legitimate promotion of our immigration program through Europe. On the other hand he talks about a program in terms of ethnic or cultural lines.

The fact of the matter is we have a balanced program. We have a number of doors through which individuals can apply to enter, whether it be the refugee stream, humanitarian, family class, independent skilled, or business.

When I was in the London, England office which is our biggest office in Europe, I on behalf of my government suggested that the perception in Europe that our doors are closed is wrong. I believe we need to promote immigration from that part of the world and also to target it with respect to business class and independent skilled. Many trades, such as aerospace, are overheating in Great Britain. We could certainly do with those skilled tradespeople coming over.

There is nothing incompatible in saying that we want to have independent, skilled and business applications coming in, and at the same time maintaining our family and humanitarian programs which have been a hallmark of this country for a long time.

[Art Hanger, Reform, Calgary Northeast, AB]

Mr. Speaker, my question was to determine the policy of the government and whether it was going to introduce racial or ethnic criteria.

Reformers welcome immigrants from all over the world. I ask the minister, in trying to attract more immigrants from Europe, is he suggesting that immigration from other parts of the world be curtailed or is he suggesting that the total immigration numbers be increased? It has to be one way or the other. Which is it?

[Sergio Marchi, Liberal, Minister of Citizenship and Immigration]

Mr. Speaker, the member is missing the boat completely and he is all wet.

If the hon. member looks at the immigration plan we presented to the House just a few weeks ago, he will note that we increased, as per the red book, the number of independent skilled people. Canadians, including I am sure members of his own party, have wanted to take advantage of skilled individuals who can find an economic niche.

All I am saying is that the proportion of people with independent skills coming from Great Britain and the rest of Europe will increase over 40 per cent in keeping with the increase in our independent skill levels.

No, the government does not create policies based on the colour of one's skin, or religion or creed. We base policies on sound facts and we try to not divide people but bring them together in unity.

Potato Industry

[Joe McGuire, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the parliamentary secretary to the minister of agriculture.

I and my colleague from Malpeque, the P.E.I. potato industry and others have been working with the agriculture ministry for the past five months trying to solve the PBY-n compensation problem.

We were all expecting cabinet to make a decision on the issue this week, thereby putting an end to a four-year ordeal by the P.E.I. potato seed industry.

Can the government tell the P.E.I. potato industry when a decision will be made on this issue? A lot of farmers' futures depend on it.

[Lyle Vanclief, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to Minister of Agriculture and Agri-food]

Mr. Speaker, the minister has been pursuing this very important issue since it was first raised with him almost immediately after his appointment as Minister of Agriculture and Agri-food.

He has met with Prince Edward Island potato growers. He has met with the Potato Growers' Association. He has met with the premier. He has met with the MPs from that province and discussed this. He started and completed some analyses so that he could become fully and fairly informed on all the facts.

The process has taken some time. He has made sure that all of the facts have been before him. The process has been slowed up a little bit and interrupted by the launching of a lawsuit by some Prince Edward Island growers and the government has no alternative but to defend itself, and the government will.

In the meantime, the minister will continue to treat this as seriously and as thoroughly as he has in the past. It is now in the hands of the courts and nothing more can be said at this time.

Government Response To Petitions

[Peter Milliken, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, pursuant to Standing Order 36(8) I have the honour to table, in both official languages, the government's response to nine petitions.

Pearson International Airport Agreement Act

[John Manley, Liberal, for the Minister of Transport]

moved for leave to introduce Bill C-22, an act respecting certain agreements concerning the redevelopment and operation of terminals 1 and 2 at Lester B. Pearson International Airport.

(Motions deemed adopted, bill read the first time and printed.)

Criminal Code

[Pierre De Savoye, Bloc, Portneuf, QC]

moved for leave to introduce Bill C-234, an act to amend the Criminal Code (facsimile advertising), and Bill C-235, an act to amend the Canada Post Corporation Act.

Mr. Speaker, with your permission, I am introducing today two bills which deal with related subjects, so I will speak on both together.

First of all, as we know, of course, masses of unsolicited advertising material are delivered to our homes regularly. A number of our fellow citizens would prefer that Canada Post not deliver this kind of material.

The purpose of one of the bills I am introducing is to allow people who do not wish to receive direct mail advertising or unaddressed mailing to so advise Canada Post Corporation and stop receiving such material.

Let us now move on to another type of unsolicited advertisements, the type we often receive by fax, not on paper paid for by the originator but rather on our own paper. Sheet after sheet after sheet of ads that we never solicited pile up overnight in our offices.

The purpose of this bill is to prohibit the use of faxes to advertise the sale of goods or services to individuals or corporations which did not solicit it.

(Motions deemed agreed to, bills read the first time and printed.)

Members Of Parliament Retiring Allowances Act

[Dan McTeague, Liberal, Ontario, ON]

moved for leave to introduce Bill C-236, an act to amend the Members of Parliament Retiring Allowances Act (at age 60, 10 years service).

Mr. Speaker, the purpose of the bill is to prohibit former members of Parliament from collecting a pension while employed by the federal government, an agency of the Government of Canada or a federal crown corporation. This would eliminate the so-called practice of double dipping.

The bill also states that a former member is not eligible to receive a pension until reaching age 60 and has served at least three consecutive terms with a minimum of 10 years consecutive service.

Finally, under the bill beneficiaries of a member or former member who died before the age of 60 would not be able to collect a pension until that member would have been 60.

(Motions deemed adopted, bill read the first time and printed.)

Committees Of The House

[Ted McWhinney, Liberal, Vancouver Quadra, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I have the honour to move that the first Report of the Standing Joint Committee on the Library of Parliament, which was tabled March 22, 1994, be concurred in.

(Motion agreed to.)

Memorandum Of Agreement

[Peter Milliken, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, I move:

That pursuant to the Memorandum of Agreement between the Speaker of the House of Commons and the National Archivist of Canada dated June 8, 1993, all documents presented to a committee of the House of Commons sitting in camera and any other documents so designated by the Speaker which have been or will be deposited in the National Archives of Canada for safekeeping, including any such records deposited prior to the date of the Memorandum of Agreement shall be identified as Secret Records;

That, Secret Records shall not be made available by the Archivist to any person for a period of thirty years from the close of the Parliamentary session in which the Secret Records were created, unless the House of Commons or one of its committees directs otherwise, and

That, twelve months before the expiry of the thirty year delay, the Archivist will inform the Speaker that unless the Speaker directs otherwise, the secret documents will be made public according to the terms of aforementioned Memorandum of Agreement.

I ask for unanimous consent for this motion.

(Motion agreed to.)

Petitions

[Warren Allmand, Liberal, Notre-Dame-De-Grâce, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I have petitions sponsored by the Community Council of Notre-Dame-de-Grâce which contains over 200 names. The petitioners refer to the critical need for more social, co-operative and non-profit housing in Montreal and ask Parliament to lift the budget restraints imposed on CMHC for the development of social and co-operative housing.

[Vic Althouse, NDP, Mackenzie, SK]

Mr. Speaker, I have several hundred more names to add to the thousands that have already been presented from my riding and surrounding areas calling on the Parliament of Canada to urge government to abolish the Senate.

[Lee Morrison, Reform, Swift Current—Maple Creek—Assiniboia, SK]

Mr. Speaker, pursuant to Standing Order 36, I would like to present four duly certified petitions on behalf of my constituents, three of them dealing with the same subject from the towns of Shaunavon, Cabri, Maple Creek and Gull Lake.

The gist of the petition is that whereas section 745 of the Criminal Code of Canada requires a convicted murderer sentenced to life imprisonment without chance of parole for 25 years may apply for a review after 15 years, and whereas the murder of a Canadian citizen is a most reprehensible crime, wherefore the undersigned humbly pray and call upon Parliament to repeal section 745 of the Criminal Code of Canada.

The fourth petition from residents of Gravelbourg, Saskatchewan, and environs contains some 150 signatures dealing with section 241 of the Criminal Code.

The petitioners beg that Parliament not repeal or amend section 241 of the code in any way and to uphold the Supreme Court of Canada decision of September 30, 1993 to disallow assisted suicide and/or euthanasia.