Debates of April 18th, 1994

Employment

[Elwin Hermanson, Reform, Kindersley—Lloydminster, SK]

Mr. Speaker, it is really disappointing not to get any answer to a question at all when we are looking after the benefit of young Canadians and trying to create an atmosphere of hope for them.

I note the minister has been handing out some very nice youth corps T-shirts and caps made out of canvas, suede and leather. How much did these things cost? How many youth were employed, if any, to make these souvenirs?

[Lloyd Axworthy, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development and Minister of Western Economic Diversification]

Mr. Speaker, it is quite true we want young people working in this national youth corps to be identified with Canada.

They are providing a service to the community. They are working on behalf of Canadians helping to clean up the environment, to work with inner city children, to develop a number of

projects that will be of enormous service and contribution to this country.

In this time and age when we particularly want young Canadians to feel proud of their country we think there is nothing wrong with wearing a maple leaf on their chests.

Social Program Reform

[Francine Lalonde, Bloc, Mercier, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Human Resources Development.

Faced with the amount of criticism of both the federal government's intentions for the reform of social programs and its way of proceeding, the Minister of Human Resources Development had to cancel the federal-provincial conference that was to take place this very day in Ottawa. Furthermore, the impasse between Quebec and Ottawa on labour force training continues.

Does the minister confirm that it is because other provinces besides Quebec were strongly opposed to the government's policies and procedure that he had to cancel the federal-provincial conference at the last minute, something rare if not unique, without first advising the Prime Minister?

[Lloyd Axworthy, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development and Minister of Western Economic Diversification]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member is unaware of some recent history.

To begin with all the first ministers and the Prime Minister agreed in a meeting in late December that there must be a social policy review. Since that time we have had two very important rounds of meetings with ministers of all provincial governments. We held them last January and last March. Substantial areas of agreement were reached.

The reason we did not proceed with the meeting today is that some provinces wanted more time. It seems only reasonable and logical that in an important, complex process like this if some of the parties want more time that we as a government that looks toward co-operation would give them more time.

[Francine Lalonde, Bloc, Mercier, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my supplementary is for the Minister of Human Resources Development. Given the gap that he is trying to hide between the positions of his government, of certain provinces and of Quebec, does the Minister, following the cancellation-and it is quite something to cancel a federal-provincial conference at the last minute; conference goers have seldom seen that happen-promise to review his proposed reform of social programs to make this reform meet the traditional aspirations and demands of Quebec?

[Lloyd Axworthy, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development and Minister of Western Economic Diversification]

Mr. Speaker, this hon. member should take a look at a few books dealing with federal-provincial relations over the last 120 years. If she thinks this is a great change in precedent, I would suggest that it is quite the opposite. Any federal-provincial meetings must contain a number of adaptations.

By the way, this is not a cancellation, simply a postponement. We have asked our officials to sit down and look at certain areas where they want more time, where we can share more information and that is all.

I suggest to the hon. member that her party's attempts to create some great alarmist crisis out of this event is simply one more effort by them to try to undermine federalism in this country.

[Some hon. members]

Hear, hear.

[Dale Johnston, Reform, Wetaskiwin, AB]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Human Resources Development.

Last week several ministers and provincial counterparts complained that the minister has no interest in genuine consultation as far as social reforms are concerned. They suggested that the minister is trying to ram through his own ideas rather than looking for fresh input.

Does this minister already have a specific proposal in mind to present to the provinces? If so, why is he pretending to seek input through consultation?

[Lloyd Axworthy, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development and Minister of Western Economic Diversification]

Mr. Speaker, I would be very interested in receiving, and I ask the hon. member to table, exactly what provincial ministers he is quoting. When I received calls from provincial ministers and spoke to them on Friday, no one said we were trying to ram something through.

If the hon. member is going to make charges of that kind, putting words in the mouths of provincial ministers, he owes it to the House to table those reports.

[Dale Johnston, Reform, Wetaskiwin, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I have a supplementary question.

Is this minister truly committed to working with the provincial ministers on social reform or is this consultation process just a sham?

[Lloyd Axworthy, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development and Minister of Western Economic Diversification]

Mr. Speaker, the answer to the first part of the question is yes. The answer to the second part is no.

Action Plan For Young People

[Michel Gauthier, Bloc, Roberval, QC]

Mr. Speaker, after being told last Friday that Quebec's refusal to take part in the federal-provincial conference on social programs reform was one of the main reasons that had prompted the Minister of Human Resources Development to cancel the conference, the minister went ahead and announced his own youth program.

Does the minister recognize that his six-point strategy is the work of civil servants working in isolation here, in Ottawa, without regard for provincial areas of responsibility, the consensus in Quebec on the matter and the waste of public money due to extensive duplication at present?

[Lloyd Axworthy, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development and Minister of Western Economic Diversification]

Mr. Speaker, what the hon. member said is incorrect. A meeting was held about a month ago, at which time we discussed all of these youth initiatives with the provincial ministers. A consultation process was also established at that time. So, what the hon. member is saying is wrong and I ask him to apologize.

[Michel Gauthier, Bloc, Roberval, QC]

Mr. Speaker, before introducing several new youth programs, would the minister not agree to say that Quebec already administers several programs in that particular area, including the Volunteer Youth Action Program? Did the minister make a point, before taking such actions, of calculating the exact cost of the overlap he is creating with his new program?

[Lloyd Axworthy, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development and Minister of Western Economic Diversification]

Mr. Speaker, there are over 400,000 young people in this country without employment.

It would seem to me that any effort, whether it is by local governments, provincial governments or the federal government to help those people should be welcomed, not attacked.

We have talked to the provinces. We have worked out ways in which we would work in co-operation to make sure there is no overlap. The program we produced on Friday is a national program that affects Canadians from one part of the country to the other. It allows young people to travel from one part of the country to the other to see what a great country we really have.

That is why it is so different from programs offered exclusively by provinces. It a national program with national objectives with a national perspective in mind.

If the hon. member was not representing the kind of party and ideology that he is, he would be one of the first to applaud our attempts to work with the provinces to help young people.

Public Safety

[Val Meredith, Reform, Surrey—White Rock—South Langley, BC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Prime Minister.

The Prime Minister in his concern for public safety must be aware that there are approximately 1,000 criminals facing deportation currently free on the streets of Toronto. Not only that but there are another 400 prisoners about to be released who have deportation warrants pending against them.

People in Toronto and across the country are upset and concerned about safety in their streets. What is the Prime Minister going to do to ensure that these criminals are deported immediately upon their release from prison?

[Mary Clancy, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to Minister of Citizenship and Immigration]

Mr. Speaker, first of all the reports are incorrect.

There are not 400 prisoners currently. There are 200. They are in the prisons and in the jails at this time serving out their sentences. At the end of the service of their sentences due process and the immigration department will ensure that they are returned to their countries of origin.

[Val Meredith, Reform, Surrey—White Rock—South Langley, BC]

I have a supplementary question, Mr. Speaker.

One of the reasons for this backlog in deportations is the shortage of deportation officers. I understand there are about 24,000 deportation orders across the country that are unable to be acted upon.

Can the Prime Minister or the parliamentary secretary for immigration explain why the immigration minister is not reducing government red tape but instead is laying off a third of the front line deportation officers in Toronto?

[Mary Clancy, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to Minister of Citizenship and Immigration]

Mr. Speaker, I again assure the hon. member that the immigration department is following the law of the land and following due process, that the number of people to be deported will be handled by the minister and by the department in due course and the hon. member should not worry.

Unemployment

[Laurent Lavigne, Bloc, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Finance.

A task force study commissioned by the Quebec forum on employment reveals that unemployment has resulted in a $32 billion loss for Canada. Moreover, the study shows that Canada's unemployment rate is higher than that of most industrialized countries.

Will the minister confirm the conclusion of the study, to the effect that the recent lowering of the unemployment rate is primarily due to a reduction in the number of people looking for work, and not to job-creating activities?

[Paul Martin, Liberal, Minister of Finance and Minister responsible for the Federal Office of Regional Development-Quebec]

Mr. Speaker, there is no doubt, and we have said so ourselves, that the real reason for the lower unemployment rate is a reduction in the number of job applications.

However, it must be pointed out that, for the most recent month, we created 48,000 jobs, and a total of 114,000 over the last two months, which is almost a record for the last five or six years. Consequently, the government is very proud of its performance. However, the hon. member is absolutely right regarding the enormous cost of unemployment.

In fact, this is one of the reasons why, unlike the Reform Party, we believe that, to lower the deficit, we must not only make cuts, but also stimulate employment. This is the best approach to a more reasonable deficit and a more adequate financial situation.

[Laurent Lavigne, Bloc, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

Mr. Speaker, when does the minister intend to put forward a true job-creating strategy? Does he realize that, by not lowering UI contributions to $3 now, he delays for one year the 40,000 jobs which he planned to create in 1995 with this budget measure?

[Paul Martin, Liberal, Minister of Finance and Minister responsible for the Federal Office of Regional Development-Quebec]

Mr. Speaker, I should point out, and this is why our approach is a well-balanced one, that the deficit must be lowered to stimulate employment and to foster economic stability in our country.

We would love to lower UI contributions now, but we need money to do that and we need the UI reform which will be proposed by my colleague, the Minister of Human Resources Development.

When you look at the budget initiatives regarding apprenticeship programs, if you co-operated with us, instead of stubbornly objecting to the measures put forward by my colleague to help young people and to train older workers, we could create many more jobs.

Tobacco Products

[Shaughnessy Cohen, Liberal, Windsor—St. Clair, ON]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Health.

Young women are smoking at a much higher rate than are males of the same age. This is especially disturbing in light of the news that U.S. tobacco companies are adding some 600 chemicals to their cigarettes, 13 of which have been proven hazardous to human health.

What steps is the minister taking to ensure that Canadian cigarette manufacturers make the public aware of all such additives in their products?

[Diane Marleau, Liberal, Minister of Health]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member raises an issue of concern to all Canadians.

All Canadians have a right to know what is included in the tobacco products they smoke, what goes into their lungs and what goes into the atmosphere around them.

I am determined to bring all pressures to bear on Canadian companies to also disclose the list of ingredients which are included in their tobacco products. If they do not then Canadians can take it for granted that the 599 ingredients listed in the U.S. are perhaps those that are included in Canadian cigarettes.