Debates of April 19th, 1994

Curling Championships

[Georgette Sheridan, Liberal, Saskatoon—Humboldt, SK]

Mr. Speaker, members will remember that on March 8, International Women's Day, I rose in this House to pay tribute to the accomplishments of the four Saskatchewan women making up the Sandra Peterson rink on winning the Scott Tournament of Hearts which all good Canadians, at least from the cold parts, will know as the national women's curling championship.

I am pleased to report to this House that once again the Peterson rink has distinguished itself by winning the Women's World Curling Championship in Obersdorf.

Lest members conclude that only the women of Saskatchewan can curl, I would add that the Canadian men's rink also became world champions this weekend, skipped to victory by former Saskatoonian Mr. Rick Folk.

Employment Forum

[Jean Landry, Bloc, Lotbinière, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the findings of a study conducted by the employment forum and made public yesterday show that the very high rate of unemployment cost the Quebec economy $30 billion and the Canadian economy $109 billion last year.

This situation cannot go on any longer. The members of this forum unanimously reaffirmed the consensus in Quebec: one solution for the problem of unemployment is to give Quebec full and complete responsibility for labour force training. This solution is a necessity, not a whim.

In the daily Le Devoir , Jean-Robert Sansfaçon wrote: ``If Jean Chrétien's Liberals stubbornly ignore this, it means that they have learned nothing about the dynamics of Quebec society. Sooner or later this error will turn against them.''

Members Of Parliament

[Ken Epp, Reform, Elk Island, AB]

Mr. Speaker, during the election the party now in government made much of promises to have more open government and freer votes. Today the government and all members of this House have an opportunity to vote for a good idea and to leave party discipline behind.

Later today we will be voting on a Reform amendment to put a cap on the total number of MPs elected. I believe that essentially every Canadian supports the idea that we do not need more than 295 MPs. Many believe we need fewer. I urge all MPs to vote in favour of this amendment, to vote in such a way that undoubtedly represents the majority view in each constituency.

I am expecting that this evening we will see a clear indication of the Liberal Party's commitment to deliver on its promise of freer votes.

Manpower Training

[Gilles Bernier, Independent, Beauce, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I think that the Reform Party's recent statements about Quebec are disrespectful. They add to them by saying that Quebec is imposing its will on Ottawa on the issues of lower cigarette taxes, the establishment of the environmental secretariat in Montreal and the postponement of the federal-provincial conference on labour. Such allusions are out of place.

I ask the government to act diligently to solve the manpower issue with Quebec and the provinces concerned. It is time to reduce overlap. Perhaps this obstinacy is due only to some over-centralizing officials. The government would show flexibility by understanding Quebec's traditional demands and adopting an updated federalism that is more acceptable to all provinces.

Under the Constitution, we certainly agree that labour force training is an educational issue and education is within provincial jurisdiction: it is their responsibility and they would provide training more economically. That is what the people of Beauce think.

Gun Control

[Eleni Bakopanos, Liberal, Saint-Denis, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the senseless acts of violence in the past weeks have caused communities all across the country to cry out for stricter legislation regarding gun control.

Yesterday I met with 120 students from all across Canada as part of the Encounter with Canada program. During our exchange these young Canadians expressed their concerns over the recent developments regarding the Young Offenders Act and stricter gun control laws.

A concerted effort between government and community youth organizations along with the introduction of stricter gun enforcement laws are required to effectively deal with this problem.

I strongly support a total ban on handguns in Canadian cities to ensure that incidents like those which occurred recently in Ottawa and Toronto do not recur.

On behalf of the people of Saint-Denis, I ask our government to seriously reconsider the Firearms Control Act in order to end acts of violence in our cities.

Killer Cards

[John O'Reilly, Liberal, Victoria—Haliburton, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I rise today to express my concern about the importation of serial killer cards into Canada.

I, like many colleagues, am opposed to these shameful cards entering our country. I have hundreds, maybe even thousands of constituents from Victoria-Haliburton in Ontario who have signed a petition stating that the killer cards not be allowed in Canada.

We live in a violent enough society, evidenced by senseless shootings in the last few weeks, and we do not need to send another violent negative message to our youth by allowing these cards to circulate in our schools.

I echo the petitions which are circulating throughout this country and urge this House to amend the laws of Canada to prohibit the importation, distribution, sale and manufacture of killer cards in law and to advise producers of killer cards that their product, if destined for Canada, will be seized and destroyed.

Bloc Quebecois

[Paul Devillers, Liberal, Simcoe North, ON]

Mr. Speaker, yesterday I was accused by the member for Richelieu of being hypocritical in presenting a petition to the House while opposing its content.

I would like to say to that member that I shall on occasion oppose certain views some of my constituents may hold but I will not oppose their right to express them or to have their voice heard in this place.

I want to tell those who claim that I do not respect the bilingual status of our country that I am the first member of Parliament for Simcoe North to provide services and to send out householders in both official languages.

The Bloc Quebecois has often said it was given the democratic right to sit in this place despite its fundamental goal to break up our country.

I find it despicable on the part of Bloc Quebecois members to claim that they want to protect the principles of democracy and freedom of expression when, in fact, they are trying to deprive others of those rights.

We believe in democracy whether it suits our political agenda or not.

Transport Canada

[Philippe Paré, Bloc, Louis-Hébert, QC]

Mr. Speaker, we have obtained from a reliable source a working paper on a government strategy designed to massively privatize Transport Canada's services.

This strategy, which was developed in secret, will not only have a disastrous impact on employment in that department by eliminating 15,000 positions: it will also have serious consequences on the economy as a whole, through an increase in transportation costs.

This withdrawal by the government from its responsibilities in the field of transport illustrates the confusion of a federal system which is about to crumble.

Moreover, the government's policy in the transport sector clearly shows that it is not serious about job creation. This hurried reform could result in a setback for Quebec and Canada, since the transport industry has always been an essential component of their economies.

Federal Government

[Deborah Grey, Reform, Beaver River, AB]

Mr. Speaker, Canadians thought when this government was elected that they might hear and witness something new.

Much to the disappointment of millions of Canadians all they got was the same old thing.

We have a government that announces with greatest fanfare a rehash of the Company of Young Canadians, basically Katimavik II; a great concept but are our youth willing to pay the bill on this borrowed money?

Ministers go to Atlantic Canada to tell Canadians there are no bold new ideas, just the usual tired old programs through which borrowed money substitutes for innovative job creation initiatives.

The experiments in judicial reform that have proved unsuccessful since their introduction in the 1960s and 1970s are another sign that creative solutions are not being found.

I would remind the government that yesterday's answers will not work when applied to today's questions; old songs by new singers are still old songs.

We need a new song for the new Canada. Reformers together with Canadians are working on the lyrics and the tune for "O Canada, New Canada".

East Coast Fisheries

[Jean Payne, Liberal, St. John's West, NL]

Mr. Speaker, today the ministers of fisheries and human resources announced a new five-year $1.9 billion package to assist east coast fisherpeople and plant workers.

This government has taken a long term approach to ensure the future prosperity of the people of Newfoundland, including St. John's West. The money will be an investment in their future, the future of the fishery and the future of the people.

Training programs and green projects will allow people to improve themselves and their working environment. The people of St. John's West can take comfort in the fact that this government has listened to their concerns.

I want to commend the ministers and this government for the manner in which they have so humanely dealt with this difficult problem.

Economic Growth

[Martin Cauchon, Liberal, Outremont, QC]

Mr. Speaker, today, I would like to take advantage of my allotted time to talk about economic growth.

This morning, Statistics Canada announced that, after growing by 0.9 per cent in February, the composite index had continued to progress in March with an increase of 0.7 per cent. Seven economic components out of ten showed a marked improvement. It is a very positive sign for our country.

I would like to add that Canadian production remains very strong. Today, Statistics Canada reported that our exports to the United States, our main trading partner, reached record levels. This proves that our government's economic recovery plan is working and that the finance minister's budget was right on target.

World Curling Champions

[John Solomon, NDP, Regina—Lumsden, SK]

Mr. Speaker, it is with a great deal of pleasure that I offer congratulations to the Canadian men's and women's world curling champions in winning the 1994 global titles.

Residents of Saskatchewan, and all Canadians, are especially proud of the Sandra Peterson rink of Saskatchewan which gave Canada its second consecutive world curling championship. Sandra Peterson, Jan Betker, Joan McCusker, coach Anita Ford and lead Marcia Gudereit, who lives in my riding of Regina-Lumsden, are top athletes that deserve our praise and admiration for their accomplishments, the only Canadian women's team to win consecutive world championships.

These women have worked hard and their dedication to curling has paid off. They have developed a controlled defensive style that has brought them the victories they deserve. This team is named the Rat Pack because their mascot is a rubber rat.

I know all members of the House will join with me in applauding the efforts or our world class Rat Pack in winning the world championship.

Action Plan For Young People

[Lucien Bouchard, Bloc, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, my question is directed to the Prime Minister.

Although several provinces were opposed, the federal government decided to go ahead and announce its youth strategy last Friday. The Quebec Minister of Education, who also chairs the Conference of Education Ministers, called this an example of unacceptable intrusion by Ottawa in the education sector and even considered challenging the government's decision before the Supreme Court.

Does the Prime Minister realize that his strategy is not only an intrusion in an area under provincial jurisdiction but also that Quebec and several other provinces have agreed to oppose the government, since the strategy will create further costly and unnecessary administrative duplication and overlap, which means less value for money?

[Marcel Massé, Liberal, President of the Queen's Privy Council for Canada]

Mr. Speaker, no one questions the jurisdiction of Quebec and other provinces over education. Of the three programs announced last Friday, the first is a program to help students. Quebec opted out of this program in 1964.

The second program, which targets young people, is not really about education but about promoting youth employment. The federal government had and still has a number of different programs in this area, like Katimavik, for instance, and we have made every effort to ensure that the federal program is complementary to the provincial program.

The third component, the national apprenticeship program, helps young people make the transition from school to work, a problem that is both federal and provincial. Both governments

are active in this area and should continue their programs, in order to help young people find jobs.

[Lucien Bouchard, Bloc, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, the problem is that the Quebec government does not share the federal government's views and intends to bring a formal challenge before the Supreme Court to protest this new intrusion by the federal government in areas under provincial jurisdiction.

I want to ask the Prime Minister, and I hope he will answer himself this time around, since he made a commitment to effective management and reducing overlap, why he has reversed his policy by launching a federal offensive on education and manpower training which increases the overlap and duplication he wanted to get rid of?

[Marcel Massé, Liberal, President of the Queen's Privy Council for Canada]

Mr. Speaker, as I pointed out, this is not another intrusion in an area under provincial jurisdiction. Our programs are not like that. The two programs I mentioned, the youth program and the apprenticeship program, are about promoting youth employment and not about education, strictly speaking. Furthermore, they complement provincial programs.

Constitutionally speaking, when a problem is national in scope, like the problem of funding jobs for youth, the federal government shares and will continue to share jurisdiction with the provinces in dealing with this kind of problem.

[Lucien Bouchard, Bloc, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, we have just witnessed a blatant example of bureaucratic obtuseness.

The fact is that the federal government will duplicate what is already being done and spend money unnecessarily, so that we can hardly expect a good return on this investment. I want to ask the Prime Minister whether he has now made it his policy to provoke court challenges on all fronts?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, as the Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs said earlier, we have a national responsibility in the area of job creation, and it is one of this government's priorities to find ways to help youth find jobs.

If the Leader of the Opposition spent any time reading the Liberal Party's platform in the red book, he would see that it is all there, and the people voted for this platform, and that is why we are governing the country today.

Transfer Payments

[Yvan Loubier, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Mr. Speaker, yesterday the Minister of Finance clearly stated his intention to make massive cuts in transfer payments to the provinces in his next budget. Failing agreement with the provinces, the Minister of Finance plans to impose his solution regarding the cuts to be made. The freeze in transfer payments is already saving Ottawa $1.5 billion over two years.

Are we to understand that the Minister of Finance has given up on trimming federal operating expenditures and has chosen to reduce his deficit on the backs of the provinces, without any compensation, through a massive reduction in transfer payments for health and education?

[Paul Martin, Liberal, Minister of Finance and Minister responsible for the Federal Office of Regional Development-Quebec]

Mr. Speaker, what I said is that the Minister responsible for Public Service Renewal intends to review all federal programs and that review is already under way. So we are certainly looking at our own spending.

I would like to quote a document of which I am very fond, the budget: "It is essential that social security reform leads to programs that are more affordable and work better for Canadians. For the federal government, transfers must be no higher after reform than they are now. We want this reform process to be a co-operative one. We are providing a two-year period of predictability and modest growth in social security transfers to provinces while reform goes on. As promised by the Prime Minister, we will build towards a five-year period of stability in transfers."

That is what I said in the budget, that is what I said yesterday, that is what I discussed with all provincial finance ministers: co-operation. They agreed on it in January.

[Yvan Loubier, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Mr. Speaker, how does the Minister of Finance explain that for lack of money, he is cutting transfers to the provinces, but at the same time his government has chosen to intervene brazenly, to say the least, in fields of provincial jurisdiction like youth and training programs. Does he not agree that when you have no money, you should mind your own business?

[Paul Martin, Liberal, Minister of Finance and Minister responsible for the Federal Office of Regional Development-Quebec]

Mr. Speaker, the member refers to the fact that we are cutting-I cannot remember the expression that he used-our transfers to the provinces.

In fact, in the month of January, we settled equalization payments on a basis that had been deferred for a number of years by the previous government. The payments were very generous to the seven provinces that were receiving them.

At the same time we met with the provincial finance ministers and told them we would not decrease the payments for a two year moratorium. It is the first time that has been done in a long time. They are used to the previous government simply cutting at will.

Then we said to the provinces that together, co-operatively, we would begin to reform the social programs that Canadians wanted reformed so that we could deliver the services more effectively and at less cost.

Youth Unemployment

[Preston Manning, Reform, Calgary Southwest, AB]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Prime Minister.

Canadians are now beginning to see some of the details of the government's legislative program and their initial reaction is disappointment, not enthusiasm.

For example, when Canadians examine the human resources project announced last week to help unemployed youth, they find that 70 per cent of the funds are not for job creation at all and that most of the program is simply a rehash of old programs and Liberal ideas from the 1960s and 1970s.

Does the government not have any bold new ideas for assisting young people, and if it does, what are they?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, we have a program to assist young people.

Perhaps the hon. member does not agree with the idea that the federal government should spend money to help people, especially young people, but now I hear him say that we should spend money.

I am very happy he might find better ways but I am delighted for the nation to hear the leader of the Reform Party tell us to spend more money on young people. I take notice of that.

[Preston Manning, Reform, Calgary Southwest, AB]

Mr. Speaker, we are talking about allocating money that is ready to be spent. The Prime Minister's reply simply illustrates my point that there is nothing new or creative or bold being said.

Real Reformers have been calling for a portion of federal educational transfers to be paid directly to young people through education and training vouchers and for immediate revamping of the students loan program to make repayments income-contingent.

These are bold and new ideas for encouraging youth preparation for the new economy. Could the Prime Minister tell us why new ideas like these are not an integral part of the government's thinking or announcements on this subject.