House of Commons Hansard #97 of the 35th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was palestinian.
Jean Chrétien LiberalPrime Minister
Mr. Speaker, he resigned and I regretfully accepted his resignation for the reasons I clearly explained to the House earlier.
Michel Gauthier Bloc Roberval, QC
Mr. Speaker, does the Prime Minister not agree that the Jean-Louis Roux affair adds to the long track record of this government, whose motto is that people are not guilty until they get caught?
Ken Epp Reform Elk Island, AB
Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Prime Minister and has to do with the use of government credit cards by ministers.
Canadians are telling us that transparency and accountability are fresh ideas they would really like to see in this Parliament. Yesterday the Deputy Prime Minister said we had all the facts, underline all. How strange then that more facts were released yesterday to the press but not to us.
The former minister of defence unintentionally breached some guidelines. He lost his job. The Secretary of State for Training and Youth knowingly breached Treasury Board guidelines and she continues to enjoy the support of the Prime Minister.
How does the Prime Minister decide which guidelines are to be enforced and which are to be ignored?
Jean Chrétien LiberalPrime Minister
Mr. Speaker, we replied to these questions last week. The money has all been paid back. There was the use of a credit card and every time that it was used it was checked with the department and the payments were made back to the government in a proper fashion.
No money was lost. It was just as explained last week. The secretary of state made a clerical mistake involuntarily and all the facts were submitted to the ethics counsellor who said that there was no need for me to ask for a resignation.
Ken Epp Reform Elk Island, AB
Mr. Speaker, I believe that Canadians still have some unanswered questions. Here are some facts that are still needed.
Of the $9,700 whited out, $9,200 is still unaccounted for. There are two and a half years for which we have no records. There is no way of knowing which items were charged to taxpayers. There is no way of knowing when personal expenses were incurred, how
much they were and when precisely they were paid back. There is no way of knowing how many other ministers are engaging in this same type of abuse of their cards. There is no way of knowing what the actual guidelines are-
Ken Epp Reform Elk Island, AB
Mr. Speaker, with the problems we have with access to information and whiteout, will the Prime Minister commit to tabling in this House full and complete documentation for the entire period without whiteout?
Marcel Massé LiberalPresident of the Treasury Board and Minister responsible for Infrastructure
Mr. Speaker, the personal expenditures of the member are information that is of a personal nature and is covered under the Privacy Act.
It is the role of the comptroller in every department to look at the expenditures and to determine what is official government expenditure and what is personal expenditure. That is what happened in this case. There is no mystery to it. The comptrollers have gone through it. All the money has been repaid.
Suzanne Tremblay Bloc Rimouski—Témiscouata, QC
Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Foreign Affairs.
Although the ceasefire declared unilaterally yesterday by the rebel Tutsis seems to be holding, Zaire is still in the throes of a major crisis, because the principal players hold conflicting views. The Nairobi summit does not seem to have produced any concrete results today, with Rwanda still opposed to an international force being sent in.
In a context where Zaire is ruling out any peace talks until Rwandan forces leave its territory, can the minister tell us what efforts his government now intends to take to help resolve the major crisis brewing in central Africa?
Lloyd Axworthy LiberalMinister of Foreign Affairs
Mr. Speaker, as I said yesterday, Ambassador Chrétien is now in Africa to discuss with all parties the possibility of a meeting or a ceasefire. The Government of Canada is prepared to take an active part in Ambassador Chrétien's recommendations.
At the same time, as I said yesterday, we are very concerned about Rwanda's role, and I have asked my officials and the ambassador to Rwanda to present Canada's positions to the government of Rwanda in order to co-operate in all the efforts being made to find a solution in the great lakes region of Africa.
Suzanne Tremblay Bloc Rimouski—Témiscouata, QC
Mr. Speaker, all players now agree on two priorities: obtain a lasting ceasefire and open up safe humanitarian corridors.
Is the minister, or is he not, prepared to support the position of the French government, which feels that the best way to ensure the creation of such safe corridors is to send in an international force by order of the Security Council?
Lloyd Axworthy LiberalMinister of Foreign Affairs
Mr. Speaker, it would be prudent that any decision about response into the very troubled situation also involve the African states. There should be full participation of those who are most immediately affected.
It is a point of our own diplomacy and that of Ambassador Chrétien on behalf of the United Nations to come up with recommendations. One of the options or choices could well be some form of safe refuge or safe corridor, but until those direct consultations of the ambassador are concluded it is probably too early for Canada to say exactly what it will do.
We are prepared and ready to respond to all requests that will provide a solution to the situation and we can only wish God speed to Ambassador Chrétien in the work that he is doing.
Jim Abbott Reform Kootenay East, BC
Mr. Speaker, when a top official at the CRTC opposes a bill that has passed the House we should all be concerned. Civil servants are here to implement policy, not lobby against policy passed by the members of Parliament.
On September 23 this House passed Bill C-216, an act to outlaw negative option billing. I ask the heritage minister again, does she condone a top official at the CRTC's opposing Bill C-216, undertaking actions to see this bill defeated in the parliamentary process?
Sheila Copps LiberalDeputy Prime Minister and Minister of Canadian Heritage
Mr. Speaker, as I said yesterday, I do not accept the claim of the hon. member. In fact, over the course of any legislation any member of Parliament in this place or the other place is entitled to seek a briefing and indeed that was the question in this particular case.
Jim Abbott Reform Kootenay East, BC
Mr. Speaker, there seems to be a discrepancy in the minister's understanding and mine. We will leave that as it is.
The reality is this minister is opposed to the passage of Bill C-216. The Canadian Consumers' Association of Canada on October 18, because it is concerned about that, wrote to her and said: "We are writing on behalf of Canadian consumers to ask the
minister to send a clear public signal that you support Bill C-216, the private member's bill".
Will she undertake that she not only supports the bill, yes or no, but that when it comes back to this House it will be undertaken as an act of Parliament?
Sheila Copps LiberalDeputy Prime Minister and Minister of Canadian Heritage
Mr. Speaker, if you follow the logic of the member it should not return back to this House.
Michel Guimond Bloc Beauport—Montmorency—Orléans, QC
Mr. Speaker, my question is directed to the Minister of Finance.
Last week, when we asked the Minister of Finance to table his bill that would amend the Income Tax Act, so as to eliminate the use of family trusts as tax loopholes, he simply maintained that the ways and means motion tabled had already taken effect. Of course the motion takes effect when it is tabled, but subsequently, a bill is required to amend the Income Tax Act.
Contrary to what the minister claimed last week, he must table a bill to amend the Income Tax Act. Consequently, when does he intend to table this bill?
Paul Martin LiberalMinister of Finance
Mr. Speaker, last week I said that when the ways and means method is used, whatever is required in the Act to plug the loophole referred to by the hon. member takes effect immediately.
That being said, we intend to proceed with the bill at the appropriate time, as usual, as soon as the House leaders on both sides can agree on a time slot.
Michel Guimond Bloc Beauport—Montmorency—Orléans, QC
Mr. Speaker, the Bloc Quebecois is prepared to offer its immediate participation and co-operation. We are ready to support the bill.
On the same topic, could the Minister of Finance promise that this bill will provide a statutory and objective method to calculate the guarantees required by Revenue Canada of millionaires who want to transfer their assets outside Canada, instead of leaving the choice of guarantee t the sole discretion of the government?
Paul Martin LiberalMinister of Finance
Mr. Speaker, we intend to proceed in the usual way. I repeat what I said when the leader of the opposition asked me a similar question. I said, and I quote: "If there is the slightest risk the Canadian government will not be paid its fair share of taxes, we will require a lot more than a notice of waiver. We will require a bond, a debenture, a valid security for ensuring that the taxes will be paid".
Charles Caccia Liberal Davenport, ON
Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister for International Trade.
In view of the fact that Canada is about to conclude a free trade agreement with Chile, can the minister indicate the state of negotiations for labour and environmental side agreements to the accord?
Ron MacDonald LiberalParliamentary Secretary to Minister for International Trade
Mr. Speaker, I would like to assure the hon. member that the Canadian government has pursued very aggressively the necessity of having side deals both on labour and the environment in talks with the Chileans. I would like to inform the member that to date the talks have been very positive and we are very happy with the negotiations. There are some outstanding issues and until those outstanding issues are completed, the deal is not done.
However, on the issue of labour and side agreements at this point we do not see any problem with those side agreements holding up an overall agreement regarding the Canada-Chile free trade deal at some time in the future. That of course is pending the successful resolution of some of the other outstanding issues.
Jack Ramsay Reform Crowfoot, AB
Mr. Speaker, yesterday an experienced police officer was moved to tears after viewing reams of child pornography, confiscated in Kirkland Lake, showing little children being raped and sodomized.
Is the justice minister comfortable knowing that as a result of legislation enacted by him and his government the perpetrators of these heinous crimes may never see a court room or never do time in prison? Is he comfortable with that?
Allan Rock LiberalMinister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada
Mr. Speaker, I have no idea what that question means. But I do want to take the opportunity to congratulate the police in Ontario who are responsible for the very excellent job of finding the people responsible under very difficult circumstances.
I am not sure what the question means. If the hon. member is referring to the sentencing process in this country, perhaps he could tell us, if he is concerned about sentencing, why he voted against our Bill C-41 which provided for tough sentences for violent crimes. Perhaps he could tell the House why he voted against our bill which strengthened the Young Offenders Act by doubling the maximum penalty for first degree murder. Perhaps he could tell us
why he voted against Bill C-68 which provided for mandatory penitentiary terms of four years for those who use guns in crimes. Perhaps he could tell us something about that.