Debates of March 12th, 1996

Montreal's Armenian Community

[Michel Daviault, Bloc, Ahuntsic, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Acting Prime Minister.

The mayor of Montreal informed the local Armenian community that he had been forced to abandon plans to build a memorial to the victims of the genocide because of pressure from the Minister for International Co-operation and Liberal candidate in the riding of Papineau-Saint-Michel. Moreover, clients of the firm for which Mr. Pettigrew used to work are currently conducting business negotiations in Turkey and, strangely enough, Turkish officials are said to have also brought pressure to bear to make this project fail. Great job for a human rights advocate.

How can the Acting Prime Minister justify the involvement of his colleague, the Liberal candidate in Papineau-Saint-Michel, who made representations directly to the mayor of Montreal to stop this project commemorating the Armenian genocide of 1915?

[Alfonso Gagliano, Liberal, Minister of Labour and Deputy Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, my hon. colleague knows full well that the erection of monuments falls under municipal jurisdiction and that the Minister for International Co-operation had no involvement in this. In fact, that is what the minister himself told the press. And he no doubt reiterated the federal government's position, namely that monuments come under municipal, not federal jurisdiction.

[Michel Daviault, Bloc, Ahuntsic, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the mayor of Montreal did confirm that the minister himself had told him so, which puts this government on the oppressors' side in this matter.

What assurances can the Acting Prime Minister give to this House that, as a former vice-president of a firm courting Turkey, his colleague, the Liberal candidate in Papineau-Saint-Michel, did not cave in under undue pressure to wreck this project in Montreal?

[Alfonso Gagliano, Liberal, Minister of Labour and Deputy Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, I know that this is an attempt on the part of the hon. member to bring this House to discuss the election campaign in the riding of Papineau-Saint-Michel, Incidentally, he is his party's organizer.

But what did the Minister for International Co-operation tell the mayor? He clearly outlined the federal government's position, stating, first of all, that the erection of monuments comes under municipal jurisdiction and, second, that it was not a federal matter.

Therefore, there is no connection between the fact that former associates of the Minister for International Co-operation are involved in business dealings and the position taken by the federal government, the Minister for International Co-operation or the Liberal candidate in Papineau-Saint-Michel. If the hon. member wants to play politics on the backs of the Armenian people, he should do so in the riding in question; he will see the result on March 25.

International Trade

[Charlie Penson, Reform, Peace River, AB]

Mr. Speaker, we have just learned the Americans are taking us to court at the World Trade Organization over Sports Illustrated . The Americans know how to play hardball with legislation they do not like. When will this government start playing hardball for Canadian businesses and take the legal route by taking the Helms-Burton bill to court?

[Ron MacDonald, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to Minister for International Trade]

Mr. Speaker, the member has raised two very important issues the government has taken the lead on.

With respect to the Helms-Burton bill our Prime Minister no less, as well as the Minister for International Trade and our ambassador in Washington have expressed very clearly the objections of the Canadian government to that bill. We continue to consult with the leaders in industry who may be adversely affected by the bill, as well as some of our allies in the Caribbean, Latin America and the European Union to try to get a consensus to put pressure on the United States to abandon the bill. We believe the bill is extraterritorial. We believe the bill will have the unwanted impact of slapping American allies in trade for an action they had absolutely nothing to do with, which was the unfortunate and condemnable shooting down of the two planes by the Cuban government.

[Charlie Penson, Reform, Peace River, AB]

Mr. Speaker, we have seen how far the Prime Minister's cosy relationship with President Clinton got us. Not very far.

The government is telling Canadian businesses that it is up to them to create jobs. Yet, at this moment many of them are being forced to choose between doing business with the United States or doing business with Cuba. If the government really wants to create jobs, will it show some backbone and assure Canadian businesses that it is going to fight this bill on their behalf?

[Ron MacDonald, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to Minister for International Trade]

Mr. Speaker, perhaps the hon. member did not hear my response.

For the record, it is very clear that the Canadian government has taken the lead, not just with foreign governments, by trying to ensure that the American government knows that the bill is inappropriate but also by consulting with Canadian businesses that could adversely be impacted by the bill. After consultations are completed and we get an indication from the U.S. as to if and when it is going to implement some provisions of the bill, we will take the most appropriate action possible to protect Canadian business interests.

Cultural Institutions

[Gaston Leroux, Bloc, Richmond—Wolfe, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the acting Prime Minister. The American Trade Secretary, Mickey Cantor, said yesterday that culture was like VCRs, they are not banned in the United States for being made abroad.

Also, Mr. Kantor announced yesterday to the world that the United States was going to fight the Canadian act which levies a tax on split run editions, an act which was passed, you will recall, with the Bloc Quebecois' support since it deals with protecting our cultural institutions.

With regard to Sports Illustrated , is the government committed not to renegotiate downwards the cultural sovereignty of Canada and Quebec?

[Guy Arseneault, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Canadian Heritage]

Mr. Speaker, the Canadian government has had a very clear position all along. Canadian culture is at the core of our Canadian identity.

With regard to Sports Illustrated , we feel we have a very strong position and we will maintain that position. We hope that the American government will maintain and respect those trade agreements, even during an election year.

[Gaston Leroux, Bloc, Richmond—Wolfe, QC]

Mr. Speaker, would the parliamentary secretary tell this House what the government intends to do to make the United States understand once and for all that cultural exemption is here to stay, that it is non-negotiable and that we intend to use it to develop Canadian and Quebec cultures?

[Guy Arseneault, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Canadian Heritage]

Mr. Speaker, our government is unequivocally committed to promoting our Canadian culture and identity. We will steadfastly stand our ground on this issue.

Krever Commission

[Grant Hill, Reform, Macleod, AB]

Mr. Speaker, Judge Krever is ready to report on the tainted blood scandal in Canada. The judge claims to know why thousands of Canadians were infected with tainted blood. He also knows where this happened. Now he says he knows who is responsible, yet the government will not let him talk.

Why is the government trying to muzzle Krever with a brand new tainted blood forum? Why not just let Judge Krever talk?

[David Dingwall, Liberal, Minister of Health]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member is a member of a very distinguished profession. When the hon. member makes that kind of accusation on the floor of the House of Commons he lends absolutely nothing to the substantive debate as it relates to this country's blood system.

The accusations of that member and of the Reform Party are absolutely false and unqualified. The hon. member knows no one is trying to hamper what Justice Krever may or may not say.

The Attorney General of Canada has a fiduciary obligation and a statutory obligation to ensure procedural fairness and the rules of natural justice apply to each and every citizen. That is the fact and the hon. member ought to acknowledge that.

[Grant Hill, Reform, Macleod, AB]

Mr. Speaker, the rhetoric is wonderful, is it not? Only the Liberals would spend $14 million on a study and then when they find what the problem is ignore the results.

Canadians only want to know what happened. Canadians deserve to know what happened. Will the health minister admit his new tainted blood forum is simply a method of muzzling Krever? What is the government trying to cover up?

[David Dingwall, Liberal, Minister of Health]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member goes on again to make false allegations. The hon. member should be aware that Justice Krever has made a very valuable and positive contribution to this debate. Not only has he made 43 interim recommendations relating to the blood system, he has also talked about the system of governance.

Justice Krever said no one is in charge. The various groups, the Canadian Haemophilia Society, the Canadian Blood Agency, the Canadian Red Cross, the various consumers and stakeholders across the country agree with our approach that we ought to move forward with a debate and consultations in order to put in place a system of governance not only to maintain a safe system in Canada but to have the safest blood system in the world.

Irving Whale

[Gérard Asselin, Bloc, Charlevoix, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of the Environment. Just a few hours ago, a new report on the Irving Whale incident was made public. This study indicates that the barge should have been refloated last summer despite the fact that it contains enough PCBs to pollute a fairly large portion of the Gulf of St. Lawrence. The report concludes that the refloating operation should be done next summer.

Can the minister tell us if he intends to follow up on the recommendations made in this report and, if so, can he give us the assurance that no PCBs will be spilled during the refloating and transportation of the barge?

[Sergio Marchi, Liberal, Minister of the Environment]

Mr. Speaker, I thank the hon. member for the question. As he knows, the lifting of the barge was put on hold last summer so my department and the Department of Fisheries and Oceans could conduct another environmental assessment. This would be the fourth because we wanted to err on side of caution, on the side of the health of Canadians as well the environment.

This morning the report from that assessment was tabled. It is important to note that rather than making a lot of comments in the Chamber now about this report, we should allow the 30-day public consultation to take hold.

Seven different public meetings both in Atlantic Canada and in the province of Quebec have been organized. I think we should allow for the public to have a say in response to this fourth report. As soon as the public has made its representations, the government, between me and the Minister of Fisheries and Oceans, will certainly take hold of the situation and make the right decision.

[Gérard Asselin, Bloc, Charlevoix, QC]

Mr. Speaker, as a supplementary, considering that the government has already spent $12 million on this, does the minister intend to uphold the polluter pays principle and charge the total costs to the Irving company, Canada's second richest family?

[Sergio Marchi, Liberal, Minister of the Environment]

Mr. Speaker, the question obviously has a price tag but the member tries to suggest that it is an easy problem without any complex issues being involved. He is absolutely incorrect in that. It is a very complex situation.

A number of individuals have suggested leaving the barge there, and that would have problems. A number of individuals suggest the oil should be pumped from the chamber of the barge to the surface, and that has its complications. There seems to be a majority opinion that lifting the barge with the proper safeguards and technology is the way to go.

With respect to the member's question, all matters are under negotiation. The Government of Canada will make the right decision for the best interest of the people in the area as well as for the environment.

Terrorism

[Warren Allmand, Liberal, Notre-Dame-De-Grâce, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the acting Minister of Foreign Affairs.

I was pleased to learn that both the Prime Minister and the Minister of Foreign Affairs will participate in the anti-terrorism summit in Egypt. Not only is the Middle East peace process under attack but there is a continual threat of terrorism throughout the world.

What concrete measures will Canada propose at the summit and what is Canada prepared to do to co-operate in a worldwide anti-terrorist program?

[Christine Stewart, Liberal, Secretary of State (Latin America and Africa)]

Mr. Speaker, the anti-terrorism summit in Egypt is a very important event in the name of peace in the world. Canada is very pleased to have a role in trying to promote that peace. We have been very involved in the Middle East peace process as a chair of the working group on refugees. We also feel that as Canadians we have a large stake in the success of the continuing peace process in the Middle East.

Certainly it has been challenged by the recent extremist terrorist acts on the part of Hamas. Our presence there along with the international community gives moral support to the peace process. Besides that we will be talking substantively during that meeting to find out what more Canada and the international community can do together to eradicate terrorism worldwide.

Justice

[Jack Ramsay, Reform, Crowfoot, AB]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the solicitor general.

Serial child killer Clifford Olson becomes eligible on August 12 of this year to have a sentence review hearing by virtue of section 745 of the Criminal Code.

Does Clifford Olson still have the support of the solicitor general and that of his government for this review or will the solicitor general and his cabinet move immediately to scrap section 745 from the Criminal Code?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Leader of the Government in the House of Commons and Solicitor General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, Clifford Olson has never had and does not have the support of the government for anything.

The Minister of Justice with my support is actively looking at ways of dealing with concerns about section 745.

I look forward to the Minister of Justice's being in a position to present the results of his work to the House before too long. If my hon. friend is serious, we will put him to the test and see if he stands up to support the changes.

[Jack Ramsay, Reform, Crowfoot, AB]

Mr. Speaker, we stood in the House and we remember how the cabinet voted. We remember what happened with the private member's bill to scrap section 745 over a year ago.

The Liberal government has indicated that it is committed to maintaining the 15-year review for some first degree murderers. Can the solicitor general please give us an example of a first degree murderer who in his view deserves an opportunity to get parole after serving only 15 years of a so-called life sentence?