Debates of March 13th, 1996

Unemployment Insurance Reform

[Douglas Young, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development]

Mr. Speaker, it would be to the Leader of the Opposition's advantage to allow the critic, who handles these issues so ably, to continue to work toward the improvements we wish to see made to Bill C-12. That hon. member knows what she is talking about, at least.

What is going on here today? The Leader of the Opposition is telling us that our minds are already made up.

Since Parliament reconvened, I have been explaining in this House that the parliamentary process requires the committee to examine the bill in question, and I am confident that members of all parties will have valuable suggestions to make. We have not decided on one solution in preference to another, except that we do wish all changes made to Bill C-12 as tabled to be equitable and in line with the commitments made by the Minister of Finance in last year's budget.

[Yvan Loubier, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

My foot.

[Douglas Young, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

And as for this "baveux", this member of the Bloc Quebecois-

[Some hon. members]

Oh, Oh.

[The Speaker]

My dear colleagues, we know today is Wednesday. I would ask all of you to choose your words very carefully. The hon. member for Mercier has the floor.

[Francine Lalonde, Bloc, Mercier, QC]

Mr. Speaker, allow me to express my regret that this minister, whose responsibilities include co-operation, working with other parties, clearly went off the rails yesterday and again today, and this time with a member of Parliament.

[Some hon. members]

Hear, hear.

[Francine Lalonde, Bloc, Mercier, QC]

The Minister of Human Resources Development has up to now shown no intention of withdrawing his bill on unemployment insurance. Instead of reassuring Canadians and Quebecers, who are worried about their situation, the minister is poisoning an already explosive debate.

If the minister refuses to withdraw his bill, is he prepared, as of today, to reassure Canadians and Quebecers by informing them of the changes he proposes to make to his bill?

[Douglas Young, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development]

Mr. Speaker, I think all members who have looked at the issue realize the extent of the concerns raised by a whole lot of people pretty much throughout the country. I think it would be irresponsible of me to impose more work on the committee, which, only a few days ago, got the job of looking over the bill and expressing its opinion. I remind you that all political parties are represented on the committee.

I think it would be inappropriate for me to say: "We are going to propose this and that amendment on top of Bill C-12", before I even hear what the parliamentary delegation on the committee has to say. In the coming days, when we have heard the witnesses who are to appear before the committee, I hope that we will hear the member's suggestions for amending the bill. She is right, we do not intend to withdraw the bill, but we do intend to amend it to meet the needs of people with legitimate concerns.

[Francine Lalonde, Bloc, Mercier, QC]

Mr. Speaker, to the many demonstrators, the minister says: "We will reform". We ask him to specify the reforms, and he says: "I am waiting to see the committee". He cannot mock people.

Is the minister prepared today or in committee tomorrow to state exactly what amendments he plans to make to his bill?

[Douglas Young, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development]

Mr. Speaker, a whole series of people are supposed to appear before the committee. Dozens, if not hundreds of individuals and groups have asked to come and testify before the parliamentary committee.

I hope, with time, the committee will invite me too to come and do it a bit of a favour by explaining the implications of certain proposals by organizations or members of Parliament.

I do not think we should just leave the impression that it is going to take two, three or four months before we get to solutions, because I am sure the committee, given that its work has already begun, will submit suggestions for the government's consideration, and we will come up with final proposals. I hope this will happen within the next few weeks.

Employment

[Preston Manning, Reform, Calgary Southwest, AB]

Mr. Speaker, after making inflated promises of jobs, jobs, jobs in the last election, the Liberal government has finally realized that it is the private sector that is going to create the majority of those jobs.

The unemployed need more than words. The only practical way to unleash the job creating power of the private sector on the scale that is required is through genuine tax relief. Yesterday the Minister of Finance ruled out all hope of that happening.

What is the hope for long term private sector job creation when the government has ruled out tax relief until the next millennium?

[Doug Peters, Liberal, Secretary of State (International Financial Institutions)]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member should look at the most recent statistics. They indicate that in the last three months over 140,000 jobs have been created. Those are in the private sector almost entirely and almost entirely full time jobs.

The hon. member would do well to look at the numbers before he asks his question.

[Preston Manning, Reform, Calgary Southwest, AB]

The numbers that we are looking at, Mr. Speaker, are 1.4 million unemployed and 2.5 million under employed. That is the statistic he ought to look at.

Perhaps it is just as well that the minister did not answer my question about tax relief because who would believe anything the government said on that subject. Why would Canadians believe that the Liberals had any intention of leaving more money in the hands of taxpayers when they deliberately broke their promise to scrap, abolish and kill the GST?

The government has lost its believability on the subject of tax reform and that diminishes the stimulative effect that promised tax reform could have.

What is the hope for tax relief that will stimulate consumer and business confidence when the government has broken its one and only major promise on tax reform?

[Doug Peters, Liberal, Secretary of State (International Financial Institutions)]

Mr. Speaker, I would have been disappointed if I had not been asked about the GST today. The hon. member is trying to make question period the most boring 45 minutes in the House.

Let me deal with the question of the GST and the supposed questions that he raises. I would like to suggest to the hon. member that our commitment is clearly to harmonize. I realize harmony is not something that the Reform Party has.

I suggest that he read his own party's addendum to the finance committee report on the GST, in which the Reform Party said: "We commend the government on its attempt to harmonize the tax with the provinces. As the Reform Party concurs with the majority of those who said that a substantial simplification would result from a wide ranging broadening of the tax base, we support the lowest possible rate on the broadest possible base until major tax reform takes place".

That was the Reform Party's position.

[Preston Manning, Reform, Calgary Southwest, AB]

Mr. Speaker, if there is boredom in question period it is because of the quality of the answers, not the quality of the questions.

The government promises hope. Where is the hope for consumers and families when the finance minister has ruled out any

prospect of tax relief until the next millennium? In the last seven years Canadians have seen the disposable incomes of families go down but the revenues of the federal government go up by over $20 billion.

What hope is there for income stability? What hope is there for tax relief? What hope is there for long term job creation as long as government tax revenues increase while the disposable incomes of Canadians decrease?

[Doug Peters, Liberal, Secretary of State (International Financial Institutions)]

Mr. Speaker, the policies of this Liberal government are the best hope for Canadians. We have set and met the targets on the deficit. We have gotten the deficit down and it is still falling to the point where the books will eventually be balanced. The policies of the Liberal government are the best hope that Canadians have for job creation and improvement in their lives.

Disability Tax Credit

[Maurice Bernier, Bloc, Mégantic—Compton—Stanstead, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Revenue.

A number of organizations defending the rights of the disabled have for months been receiving so many complaints regarding Revenue Canada that they have recently decided to sound the alarm. Revenue Canada seems to have an increasingly narrow definition of what constitutes a disability, thus managing to limit access to the disability tax credit.

Can the minister confirm for us that the directives issued by her government regarding the disability tax credit have resulted in a tightening of the eligibility criteria?

[Jane Stewart, Liberal, Minister of National Revenue]

Mr. Speaker, I draw to the attention of the House the very good work that the advocates on behalf of disabled Canadians did in responding to the prebudget work of the finance committee. Because of this work, the Minister of Finance included in this year's budget a paragraph that stated the government would look at the support systems and programs to ensure they responded to the modern needs of disabled Canadians.

Specifically in response to the disability tax credit, not only has this member drawn it to my attention but many of my caucus members have as well. I have asked my department to do four specific things. First, to ensure that Canadians have the understanding and education they need to understand this credit. Second, to ensure that we review it in a very effective way.

[Some hon. members]

Order, order.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh.

[The Speaker]

I think you will have another kick at the can.

[Maurice Bernier, Bloc, Mégantic—Compton—Stanstead, QC]

Mr. Speaker, since the minister admits that more restrictive directives have been issued that are in effect at odds with the report by the Committee on Human Rights and the Status of Persons with Disabilities, a report tabled in this House and signed by all Liberal members, I would like to remind the minister that in this report she is asked to reconsider this restrictive interpretation for the years up to and including 1995.

Will the minister abandon this restrictive interpretation?

[Jane Stewart, Liberal, Minister of National Revenue]

Mr. Speaker, the definition of persons with disabilities has been expanded for the sake of this credit. We know there are those who have been audited. We have asked every tax centre across the country to look at individual cases and to treat them with fairness and understanding should difficulties of hardship arise in individual cases.

We are not without compassion but we have to ensure that the tax base is fair and is full of integrity.

Old Age Security

[Jan Brown, Reform, Calgary Southeast, AB]

Mr. Speaker, on October 18, 1993 the Prime Minister stated: "The Liberal Party is committed to maintaining old age security".

Last week in the budget the finance minister killed OAS. The Prime Minister made a campaign promise to seniors in 1993 that he knew he would break by attacking their pensions as he has.

Why did the Prime Minister falsely raise the hopes of seniors that he would protect them when he was shamelessly planning to kill OAS as quickly as possible?