Debates of Oct. 21st, 1997

Canadian International Development Agency

[Deborah Grey, Reform, Edmonton North, AB]

Mr. Speaker, how much do you have to give to the Liberal Party to get a CIDA contract? It seems the more you give, the more you get.

Geratec Incorporated of Quebec, a group of companies directed by former Liberal cabinet minister Marc Lalonde, has donated a whopping $80,000 to the Liberals over the past two years. The payoff is $80 million in CIDA contracts, not a bad return on your dollar.

Was Pierre Corbeil just a Liberal bagman or was he the government's ethics adviser as well?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Deputy Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member's attempt to link fund-raising activities which have not been found in any way to be improper with a matter before the courts is totally unwarranted. She is again abusing the privileges and structure of this House. It is just another example of what I said yesterday about everything she says. It is just more Reform rubbish.

[Deborah Grey, Reform, Edmonton North, AB]

Mr. Speaker, the minister talks about rubbish. Let us look at a little of this rubbish, shall we?

Companies that get CIDA contracts are 70 times more likely to have donated money to the Liberals than other companies. Rubbish? It was the minister's own personal friend Marc Lalonde who stick handled this deal right through the goal. Is that rubbish? I do not think so.

If political donations have absolutely nothing to do with government grants, let the minister tell us why the Liberals get 70% of the contracts for CIDA. Is it just a heck of a coincidence or is it rubbish?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Deputy Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I ask the hon. member in turn whether it is just a coincidence that this evening in Toronto in a luxury hotel there will be a Reform Party fund-raising dinner, with the Leader of the Opposition as the guest of honour, and all they are charging is $2,000 per table.

Minister Of Intergovernmental Affairs

[Michel Gauthier, Bloc, Roberval, QC]

Mr. Speaker, everybody in Quebec yesterday heard the Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs say on CBC television that the French government had alerted his government to the fact that the vocabulary of the negotiations implied that Quebec was sovereign, which put the French in some discomfort. That is what the minister said.

How could the minister say such a thing? What did he base this statement on?

[Stéphane Dion, Liberal, President of the Queen's Privy Council for Canada and Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, clearly the French government is embarrassed each time the Quebec government tries to push it into the middle of our internal disagreements. It does not want to get involved, it has no intention of doing so.

The agreement must be in harmony with the France-Canada accord. If it is part of this agreement, and this is not difficult to do, Quebeckers could benefit from it, which would be a good thing.

[Michel Gauthier, Bloc, Roberval, QC]

Mr. Speaker, how can the Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs appear on CBC television and say such a thing, when no one told him that and the French embassy officially contradicted the minister? How could he say such a thing on CBC television?

[Stéphane Dion, Liberal, President of the Queen's Privy Council for Canada and Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, I think pretty well everyone knows that the French government is embarrassed each time the Government of Quebec tries to get it involved in the matter of Canadian unity.

I think French government policy is one of non-interference and non-indifference. The policy must therefore be respected, and things would go much better for the signing of an agreement such as the one we are talking about at the moment.

The Environment

[Bill Gilmour, Reform, Nanaimo—Alberni, BC]

Mr. Speaker, yesterday the environment minister said in the House: “Addressing climate change will incur costs for all Canadians”.

The signing of this deal is less than two months away yet the minister refuses to give us any details.

As the minister has already told us that this agreement is going to cost Canadians, will the minister now tell us is the cost going to be 10 cents, 20 cents or 30 cents per litre?

[Christine Stewart, Liberal, Minister of the Environment]

Mr. Speaker, I tried to make it clear yesterday that dealing with the issue of climate change will incur costs. It will incur costs for all Canadians to take action. It will incur costs if we do not take action.

With regard to any specific measures taken to address climate change, we will negotiate fully with our provincial counterparts.

[Bill Gilmour, Reform, Nanaimo—Alberni, BC]

Mr. Speaker, this is ridiculous. We are less than two months away from this country's signing an agreement will affect each of us. We do not know how deep the taxman is going into our pockets and for what reason.

This is not only dumb politics, this is a slap in the face for each Canadian. The minister said the provinces had to be on side. Clearly they have to be on side.

Will the minister assure us that she will not sign any deal in Kyoto until all the provinces are on side?.

[Christine Stewart, Liberal, Minister of the Environment]

Mr. Speaker, Canada is a member of an international community and it is committed to signing on to medium term legally binding targets in Kyoto.

In order to achieve any targets it is going to require a committed response on the part of all Canadians, every agency and every province. The federal government will be negotiating with our provincial counterparts, among others, to work with them to put in place appropriate measures.

Deficit Reduction

[Yvan Loubier, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Mr. Speaker, if the Minister of Finance has some leeway now, it is because people have paid for it. The unemployed have been singled out and have so far contributed $19 billion through unemployment insurance cuts.

My question is for the Minister of Finance. Now that he is well ahead of his forecasts, does he not think it would be fair and reasonable to give a little something back to those who, for two years now, have done more than their share to eliminate the deficit?

[Paul Martin, Liberal, Minister of Finance]

Mr. Speaker, that is precisely what we have done. That is why the Prime Minister announced in May that we intended to return $6 billion in social transfer payments to the provinces. That is why the Minister of Human Resources Development announced not just an initial contribution of $850 million for the child tax benefit, but a second contribution of the same size.

When you look at the things we have done, such as extending the infrastructure program to create jobs in Quebec and in the rest of Canada, it is very clear that the federal government is using its leeway for the very purpose of helping the most disadvantaged and creating jobs.

[Yvan Loubier, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Mr. Speaker, it is really unbelievable. Twice now, since he spoke in Vancouver, I have heard the minister spout this nonsense. He is pulling the wool over the public's eyes. He is adding $6 billion over five years. He is cutting $6 billion annually, until 2003. His government will have taken $42 billion out of the mouths of the most disadvantaged by 2003. What are $6 billion worth compared to the $42 billion in cuts now taking place?

I question the intellectual integrity of this minister.

[The Speaker]

No question, no answer. That's it.

Immigration

[John Reynolds, Reform, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast, BC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Citizenship and Immigration.

Last week an infant died in his mother's arms, having been strangled and then run over by a criminal who had been ordered deported in 1994.

Since the minister has abandoned her $250 million enforcement system to track illegal and criminal refugees, when are we going to see a plan of action to solve this very serious problem?

[Lucienne Robillard, Liberal, Minister of Citizenship and Immigration]

Mr. Speaker, we have completely reviewed our deportation policy here in Canada and decided to focus on criminals. To this end, we have indeed put together a plan of action. We even introduced in this House legislative amendments, which the Reform Party opposed.

This having been said, it is quite clear that the process should be improved and agreements signed with the various countries to expedite the deportation process.

[John Reynolds, Reform, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast, BC]

Mr. Speaker, innocent Canadians are being killed, raped, robbed by a growing number of illegal immigrants. The minister has done nothing for these grieving families but give a cruel bureaucratic excuse.

Again, when will we see a plan of action that will start to solve this very serious problem?

[Lucienne Robillard, Liberal, Minister of Citizenship and Immigration]

Mr. Speaker, it is always very dangerous to pass general, blanket judgements on any given group of people. The fact that some individuals abused our system or illegally entered Canada does not entitle us to condemn the immigration system as a whole. We must be wary of creating myths regarding immigration in Canada.

This having been said, it is quite clear that we do have a plan of action to deport criminals.

Deficit Reduction

[Paul Crête, Bloc, Kamouraska—Rivière-Du-Loup—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Finance.

The minister is dipping freely into the employment insurance fund to erase his deficit. However, he justifies the high contributions and reduced benefits by saying he wants to create a reserve for bad times. So far, the minister has taken about $12 billion out of the employment insurance fund.

How far will the minister go before he stops reducing his deficit on the backs of workers and employers and the unemployed?

[Paul Martin, Liberal, Minister of Finance]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member is well aware that, when we took office, employment insurance contributions had been increasing for three years. Since we took over, contributions have been lowered. The Minister of Human Resources Development and I have announced that contributions would drop to $2.80 in November. And we will continue to lower them every year. But one has to look at all of the government's financial statements.

Small Business

[Ian Murray, Liberal, Lanark—Carleton, ON]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of National Revenue.

As this is national small business week, could the minister explain what his department is doing to reduce the burden of reporting requirements on Canada's small business?

[Herb Dhaliwal, Liberal, Minister of National Revenue]

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank the member for his question concerning small business. Small business is very important for growth in the Canadian economy. Small business is creating jobs.

Yesterday I introduced the business number registration work station which will help small business to ensure that we streamline and reduce duplication.

We also introduced quarterly payroll deductions. Instead of monthly they will be quarterly. This will help reduce paperwork, overlap and duplication.

Justice

[Myron Thompson, Reform, Wild Rose, AB]

Mr. Speaker, can the solicitor general please explain to this House how Larry Takahashi, who committed 30 rapes and is serving three life terms, could possibly be released? What kind of a parole system is he running?