Debates of April 24th, 1998

Hepatitis C

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Deputy Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, it is clear from the debate yesterday that the Reform Party and other opposition parties are asking us to vote a lack of confidence, not just in the federal government but in all the provincial governments and territories, because they are all equally part of the agreement on compensation which the Reform Party and other opposition parties are wrongly opposing.

[Chuck Strahl, Reform, Fraser Valley, BC]

Mr. Speaker, the Deputy Prime Minister knows that is simply not true. The House cannot vote non-confidence in a provincial legislature and it does not intend to on the federal legislature. Some issues are bigger than party lines and they are bigger than party discipline.

I am sure the Liberal whips are a powerful force, but then again a conscience can also be a powerful thing too. Having to look yourself in the mirror every day for the rest of your life, knowing you abandoned those suffering from hepatitis C, sort of puts party politics into perspective, does it not?

Why will the the Prime Minister not allow his members of parliament to do the right thing, vote for their constituents and vote with their consciences in a free vote in the House of Commons?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Deputy Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, when members vote in the House on Tuesday I am sure they will be doing the right thing in the interest of hepatitis C victims, in the interest of relations with the provinces.

I ask members of the Reform Party to reconsider their position because when it comes to political points they do not have to give any lessons to anybody. They are doing their best to make this an unwarranted political issue.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh.

[Chuck Strahl, Reform, Fraser Valley, BC]

Mr. Speaker, last month the minister—

[The Deputy Speaker]

Order, please. I think I am hearing some language that is inappropriate for the Chamber and I ask hon. members to show some restraint.

[Chuck Strahl, Reform, Fraser Valley, BC]

Mr. Speaker, last month the Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs said “My country before my party”. He knew that some issues like national unity rise above and are more important than partisan politics.

Helping hurting hepatitis C victims is one of those issues. These people are sick because the government neglected to screen our blood supply. These victims are not Liberals. They are not Reformers. They are not NDP. They are just Canadians and they deserve and they need our help.

Why will the Prime Minister not show some heart and say “my conscience before my party?” Why will he not allow members of parliament to vote their conscience?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Deputy Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, we are concerned, but speaking of politics I want to quote Judy Maddren of the CBC today who says “Saskatchewan's health minister says the opposition parties in Ottawa are just trying to score political points in their protest against the hepatitis C package and Clay Serby says that includes his federal NDP cousins”.

I think Mr. Serby's view on behalf of all provincial governments on this matter has a great impact and speaks for itself. It shows what the Reform Party and opposition members are really up to in this matter.

[Grant Hill, Reform, Macleod, AB]

Mr. Speaker, this vote is not a vote for anything but for the victims. It is simply wrong to say that there are partisan issues brought to bear here.

All opposition parties have stated very clearly that this will not be an election issue. The only person who is trying to raise the stakes is the Prime Minister.

Why is the government so willing to put everything on the line to defend a bad deal?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Deputy Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I ask the hon. member, if it is a bad deal, why on the CBC radio news today did Clay Serby, the Saskatchewan health minister, say “this has never been a political issue. We should not be making it a political issue?” Mr. Serby went on to say “Now you have political parties today who want to try to make hay politically on this irrespective of who they are. I worry about that”.

Serby says “The package was put together by health ministers from all political parties”. He says “They managed to put aside their political differences and the opposition parties should do the same, including the federal wing of the NDP”. This should be something listened to by members of the Reform Party because it makes sense contrary to their position.

[Grant Hill, Reform, Macleod, AB]

Mr. Speaker, if the Prime Minister were not strong arming his backbenchers he knows he would lose this vote. The victims know it. Backbenchers know it. The Prime Minister knows it. I am sure the Deputy Prime Minister knows it.

Is the real reason why the Prime Minister is treating this as an issue that is so important not that if he has a free vote he will lose that vote?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Deputy Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I reject the premise of the hon. member's question. We are confident that we will win the vote.

In any event I notice that the Reform member did not respond to my quotation of the representative of all the provinces who said he and his party colleagues and the other parties are just trying to play petty politics on that, and that he, Mr. Serby, on behalf of the provincial counterparts who are part of the arrangement, reject that and think it is wrong. The hon. member did not deal with that point and this speaks for itself.

Calgary Declaration

[Suzanne Tremblay, Bloc, Rimouski—Mitis, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the federal member of Parliament for Sherbrooke, who is seeking the leadership of the Quebec Liberal Party, now contends that the concept of unique society included in the Calgary declaration must have the same meaning and scope as the concept of distinct society put forward in the failed Meech Lake accord.>

Does the Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs agree with this statement by the hon. member for Sherbrooke?

[Stéphane Dion, Liberal, President of the Queen's Privy Council for Canada and Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, I have already answered yes to this question.

The concepts of “unique” and “distinct” mean the same thing: a commitment from this federation to show the necessary flexibility to adjust to the Quebec reality as it does to all other realities across Canada.

[Suzanne Tremblay, Bloc, Rimouski—Mitis, QC]

Mr. Speaker, there is no doubt that the hon. member for Sherbrooke clearly stated that the Calgary declaration did not go far enough. If there is no difference, and “distinct” means the same as “unique”, why did they go through the trouble of drafting the Calgary declaration?

Will the minister admit that the Calgary declaration is the best Canada has to offer Quebec, despite the fact that even his federalist allies consider it does not go far enough?

[Stéphane Dion, Liberal, President of the Queen's Privy Council for Canada and Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, if the hon. member really believes that the member for Sherbrooke thinks Canada is not enough, she does not understand his political philosophy.

He has stated that Canada is a wonderful country, which we can always make better, and that the Calgary declaration outlines principles to help us further improve this country we intend to keep.

Saskatchewan Francophones

[Richard Marceau, Bloc, Charlesbourg, QC]

Mr. Speaker, yesterday, francophones from Saskatchewan denounced here in Ottawa the ethnocide—and that is their word—they are facing.

According to the 1996 census, although 20,000 of them claim French as their mother tongue, only 6,000 actually use it. The rate of assimilation in Saskatchewan is assessed at 71%.

What does the government have to say this morning to francophones from Saskatchewan, who consider their numbers to be disappearing?

[Don Boudria, Liberal, Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, we say to the francophones from Saskatchewan and to all other francophone minorities that we support them.

We in the government do not consider them dead ducks or warmed up bodies or paraplegics in wheelchairs or second class Canadians, all of which are descriptions that have been used by the members of the Bloc Quebecois.

[Richard Marceau, Bloc, Charlesbourg, QC]

Mr. Speaker, it is a shame the minister chose to hurl meaningless insults instead of responding to something very specific and announcing a policy.

Why, instead of saying any old thing, does he not stop hiding his head in the sand and come up with some concrete measures to put a stop to assimilation?

[Don Boudria, Liberal, Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, I congratulate the hon. member on recognizing that the remarks I have just cited were insulting, because we Canadians living outside Quebec have had it with separatist insults. We are full fledged citizens and do not deserve the separatists' insults.

Hepatitis C

[Chris Axworthy, NDP, Saskatoon—Rosetown—Biggar, SK]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Deputy Prime Minister.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh.

[The Deputy Speaker]

Order, please. It is impossible to hear the hon. member.

[Chris Axworthy, NDP, Saskatoon—Rosetown—Biggar, SK]

Yesterday the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Health suggested those victims who contacted hepatitis C from the blood system prior to 1986 should seek a pension under the Canada pension plan disability provisions.

He will know that applicants under the scheme are uniformly rejected on the first opportunity and that the opportunities to get a disability pension under the Canada pension plan are very slim. One of my colleague has a constituents with one leg and one eye who was not declared disabled.

Is the Deputy Prime Minister not embarrassed that the government would offer a solution to hepatitis C victims when that opportunity is slim to none?

[Joe Volpe, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to Minister of Health]

Mr. Speaker, when I mentioned what I did yesterday I was trying to give an indication to all members who are concerned about hepatitis C sufferers that there are plans in the works to try to alleviate the most immediate consequences of this debilitating disease.

I gave an indication that the provincial health ministers together with the health minister of Canada are working on the plans available under the social safety net that included CPP and all other types of programs. Those discussions are ongoing and would be put into effect for—