House of Commons Hansard #21 of the 36th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was farmers.
Gilles Duceppe Bloc Laurier—Sainte-Marie, QC
Mr. Speaker, yesterday, in unveiling the government's position vis-à-vis WTO negotiations, the Minister for International Trade made three points, which seem to be irreconcilable, to say the least.
First, he said that nothing was excluded. Then, he said that he was retaining his full authority to regulate the health and education sectors. Finally, he said that he was not seeking any exemption.
Could the minister now tell us the government's real position in these negotiations?
Pierre Pettigrew LiberalMinister for International Trade
Mr. Speaker, our government's position is absolutely clear when it comes to health and education services. I believe this is what the Bloc Quebecois leader is referring to.
There is no question of negotiating Canada's public health or education services. They are not up for discussion. But, if other countries wish to discuss these services in the context of the General Agreement on Trade in Services, they may, on a voluntary basis, make commitments in a number of areas. Canada will not be making any such commitments.
Gilles Duceppe Bloc Laurier—Sainte-Marie, QC
Mr. Speaker, I would therefore like to know why the minister is not seeking an exemption in case all countries decide to negotiate this issue, which would in fact be very surprising.
Will the minister be seeking an exemption with respect to anything public, with areas such as health and education?
Pierre Pettigrew LiberalMinister for International Trade
Mr. Speaker, the General Agreement on Trade in Services is an agreement with an ascending list, which is to say that it is not up to Canada to decide that certain other countries will not speak about certain services if, in their own interest, they wish to conduct international trade in them.
What I am saying is that, since membership is voluntary, we do not wish to prevent other countries from speaking about this. But, since Canada's participation is voluntary, we have no intention of making commitments with respect to public health or education services.
Richard Marceau Bloc Charlesbourg, QC
Mr. Speaker, when questioned yesterday, the Minister of International Trade was very confused and, especially, very vague on the government's position at the WTO on health and education. This is no surprise, it is not even the federal government's jurisdiction.
How can the minister claim to accurately represent the interests of Canadians in the areas of health and education, in the case of the GATS, for example, when it is not the federal government but the provinces that have expertise and jurisdiction in these areas?
Pierre Pettigrew LiberalMinister for International Trade
Mr. Speaker, that is precisely why I held a very worthwhile working meeting with all the provincial ministers of trade on October 7.
Officials meet weekly with provincial governments precisely in order to be absolutely certain that Canada's position accurately reflects the needs and interests of all the provinces in our country.
I can assure you that, for the moment, we are absolutely confident of arriving together with a strong voice in Seattle in order to protect and promote the interests of all Canadians.
Richard Marceau Bloc Charlesbourg, QC
Mr. Speaker, that did not prevent the premiers from unanimously asking, in the latest provincial premiers' conferences, to present their viewpoints at the WTO table.
The government has said once again that it wants to negotiate in areas not under its jurisdiction. Will the minister agree to not make any commitments in the areas of health and education without provincial agreement, because this is provincial responsibility, not his?
Pierre Pettigrew LiberalMinister for International Trade
Mr. Speaker, let me be very clear: the Government of Canada has no intention of making a commitment without consulting the provinces.
This is why we are working very closely with the provinces. I told the provincial ministers in recent weeks that we will work very closely together, and it is vital.
I would like to point out to the member for Charlesbourg that at the negotiating table, Brussels speaks for the European Union, including in areas under the jurisdiction of the national governments of members of the European Union.
Alexa McDonough NDP Halifax, NS
Mr. Speaker, we are eight days away from the anniversary of the Broadbent resolution, the unanimous resolution of this House to eliminate child poverty by the year 2000. This was to be Canada's millennium project, and yet today to Canada's great shame hundreds of thousands more, not fewer, children are living in poverty.
The finance minister was among those who made that solemn commitment 10 years ago. Will the finance minister today commit to eliminating child poverty, come hell or high water?
Jane Stewart LiberalMinister of Human Resources Development
Mr. Speaker, the government is very concerned about child poverty. Witness the $5 billion a year that go into the Canada child tax benefit. Witness the $2 billion that come July will be part of the national child benefit. Witness the $9 billion in total that include programs like CAPC, prenatal nutrition, and focusing on Inuit and aboriginal health. Child poverty is a priority for the government.
Alexa McDonough NDP Halifax, NS
Mr. Speaker, we are still waiting to hear, come hell or high water. The facts remain. There are 1.4 million children living in poverty, third world rates of infant mortality among aboriginal communities and families with children as the fastest growing group among the homeless. These are the shameful facts.
Will the finance minister commit to targets and timetables to eliminate child poverty, come hell or high water?
Jane Stewart LiberalMinister of Human Resources Development
Mr. Speaker, if the hon. member would just reread the Speech from the Throne she would see the government is committed to dealing with children and the issue of child poverty.
There will be a significant additional investment to the national child benefit. We will be working hand in glove with the provinces to make sure that it focuses on low income families with children.
Peter MacKay Progressive Conservative Pictou—Antigonish—Guysborough, NS
Mr. Speaker, we were informed yesterday that the solicitor general was informed immediately about this breach of national security. He chose not to inform the head of SIRC, Paule Gauthier. The ensuing damage control and spin doctoring saw the Prime Minister say that this was no big deal.
The government's flippant attitude to a national security crisis is appalling. Since the minister did not see fit to inform the head of SIRC, can he tell us when he informed the Prime Minister's Office and when he got in touch with the director of security services, Ward Elcock?
Lawrence MacAulay LiberalSolicitor General of Canada
Mr. Speaker, as I indicated yesterday, the director of CSIS, Mr. Elcock, informed me.
I can also inform my hon. colleague that SIRC does not need my notice to evaluate or review any files. It has the mandate from the House to review the files, and that is exactly what it is doing. It has done that for the past 15 years and it does not need any input from me to do so.
Peter MacKay Progressive Conservative Pictou—Antigonish—Guysborough, NS
Mr. Speaker, this is sounding more and more like an Austin Powers episode, The Spy Who Shagged Us .
We need truth or consequences from the minister. When will he tell us about the status of the search for the missing CSIS documents? Just how many CSIS agents are out there now engaging in a search and destroy mission on a Toronto metropolitan dump?
Lawrence MacAulay LiberalSolicitor General of Canada
Mr. Speaker, I can tell my hon. colleague that the director of CSIS assured me that all necessary steps would be taken to ensure strict adherence to security procedures.
That was three weeks ago and he assured me again today.
John Cummins Reform Delta—South Richmond, BC
Mr. Speaker, the Nisga'a treaty assigns 25% of Nass River salmon to the Nisga'a people. There are four other bands with claims to Nass River salmon.
This treaty will fundamentally change the way we allocate resources in this country for all time. Given the significance of these changes, will the Prime Minister not allow the people of British Columbia to have their say in a referendum?
Herb Dhaliwal LiberalMinister of Fisheries and Oceans
Mr. Speaker, the hon. member's numbers are incorrect. It is not a percentage, it is 60,000 sockeye.
To reallocate those we will be retiring licences from the commercial fleet, so it will not take away from the commercial fleet. Of course, the percentage will depend on the abundance of fish.
The majority of members of the House and all members on this side of the House are proud of the Nisga'a treaty and we will make sure we go through with it.
John Cummins Reform Delta—South Richmond, BC
Mr. Speaker, as usual the minister has his numbers wrong.
The fact is that the Nisga'a people had a vote on this treaty. Why can the people of British Columbia not have and enjoy the same privilege?
Bob Nault LiberalMinister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
Mr. Speaker, they do, in this House.
Pierre De Savoye Bloc Portneuf, QC
Mr. Speaker, if the European Union negotiates on behalf of the European countries, the Minister of International Trade must realize that it cannot require any of its member countries to be committed without its explicit consent.
Are we to understand from the minister's response just now that he is prepared to conclude nothing relating to health and education without the explicit agreement of each of the provinces, Quebec included?
Pierre Pettigrew LiberalMinister for International Trade
Mr. Speaker, I can assure you of one thing. In the fields of health and education, the General Agreement on Trade in Services fully allows Canada not to go that route if this is not what its policy and its government wishes.
Our government is very clear on this. There is no question, in the trade in services on which we are to commit on a voluntary basis, of our committing to going that route, and the provinces are unanimously on side with me on this.
Pierre De Savoye Bloc Portneuf, QC
Mr. Speaker, I find the minister very quick to admit that the provinces are unanimously on side with him on this. Let him make the effort to check that, and to do so after there has been some negotiation.
Similarly, can the minister make a commitment to respond to Quebec's demands and to ensure that there is no negotiation with the WTO on culture?
Pierre Pettigrew LiberalMinister for International Trade
Mr. Speaker, I have been working in close collaboration with my colleague, the Minister of Canadian Heritage, toward a new instrument in the realm of culture.
Recently, I received a letter from the Government of Quebec indicating that it recognized the need we felt as a government to continue this work toward a new instrument, in order to truly promote our very important cultural diversity.
We also hope that other international organizations such as the World Trade Organization will also acknowledge the government's right to promote cultural diversity.
Jim Abbott Reform Kootenay—Columbia, BC
Mr. Speaker, we know that top secret documents were stolen from a CSIS operative. In the minister's own words, he received a report from CSIS immediately.
I remind him that section 20, paragraph 2 of the CSIS act says specifically that the minister in turn must send the report with his comments to the Attorney General of Canada and SIRC. He did not do this. Why did the minister break the law?