Debates of Feb. 8th, 2000

Supply

[Jean-Guy Chrétien, Bloc, Frontenac—Mégantic, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of privilege. I urge my colleague to stick to the facts and to the facts only. If five cents are diverted by this government, by this party, it is five cents too much. According to the figures, we are talking about an amount between $1 and $3 billion, not $300 million. Let us stick to the facts.

[The Deputy Speaker]

I fail to see how this could be construed as a question of privilege.

[Bryon Wilfert, Liberal, Oak Ridges, ON]

Mr. Speaker, it is hard to stick to the facts when people over there are not listening. I have indicated that there was not $1 billion missing. I have indicated many times, both in the House and outside, that if there is $1 missing we should all be concerned about it. Clearly, on this side of the House, the minister is taking appropriate steps.

The minister responded very quickly to the call to attend the Standing Committee on Human Resources Development on Thursday. Normally, instead of 10 working days, we have the minister there on Thursday to answer questions, to put the facts on the table.

Some of my colleagues on the other side have already started to dismiss the role of the standing committee because they seem surprised that the minister, who wants transparency, openness and accountability, as everyone on this side of the House and I am sure on that side of the House would like to see, is willing to ensure that the questions which members might have—and I mean questions, not rhetoric—are put on the table. There is no question that we have to have confidence in the system.

Before the audit was released some colleagues on the other side of the House spoke about projects in their ridings as being worthy, visionary and all so important. Now they cannot wait to say “scandal”. They cannot wait to say “pork-barrelling”.

Where has this money gone? It has gone to literacy programs. It has gone to job creation programs. It has gone to programs which have benefited communities from one end of the country to the other. Yet we hear these terms being bandied about, without any interest it seems in looking for real solutions to deal with the administrative problems which are clearly unacceptable.

Rather than simply shrugging it off, we have designed a six point program. It may not be exhaustive. There may be other constructive suggestions which the committee will be able to present on Thursday to the minister.

The minister has responded already by indicating that she will provide quarterly updates on the action plan. It is important that every member of parliament be involved to ensure that the dollars my colleague across the way referred to will go to the people and the organizations which have applied, to ensure that there is accountability and to ensure that the proper paperwork has been done. It is unacceptable in this day and age for moneys to be handed out without the proper documentation.

The audit never suggested political interference. The audit never at any point suggested that there was $1 billion missing. What it indicated was that there was very sloppy bookwork. It is very clear that the six point program that is being implemented as we speak is designed to deal with this.

Let me give the House one example of the program.

To ensure that the payments are made properly, the director will have to certify the particular project. There will have to be a signed agreement. There will have to be signing authority. Payments will be advanced only when the documentation is there, and I am speaking of documentation in terms of claims, expenses and so on.

Since many members wrote letters of support for projects in their communities, at some point we all believed there was value in the projects they were touting, whether they were literacy programs, job creation programs or whatever.

Clearly the point is that we want to make sure there is confidence in the system.

I hear members opposite bandying about terms without any constructive or supportive comments as to how we might fix the problem together. They would rather attack the minister, saying that she should resign. The minister released the report, the action plan, and has made it the number one priority of her department.

No one is prepared to accept business as usual, certainly not on this side of the House. We want to ensure that we have a system which is strong and comprehensive. We must ensure that the payments are made with every i dotted and every t crossed. They must be carefully checked. All of the files which are active are being reviewed by the department and will be reported on by the end of April.

It is important that we not lose sight of the fact that these steps are being taken. The auditor general has endorsed the action plan before us. I would like to hear the comments of members opposite in regard to the action plan and the 25 recommendations which were made in the audit.

We have heard in the media and in the House about the projects that have been approved across the country, how they have benefited the various ridings. Yes, the system has broken down, but we are fixing the system to make sure it never happens in the future.

It would be folly to continue to use terms and figures which members clearly know are inappropriate. I too am restricted in the terms that I might use in the House.

At the end of the day, if we are improving the literacy skills of Canadians, if we are giving the people who have disabilities an opportunity to work, if we are giving them meaningful employment opportunities, as has been suggested by many members and organizations, we should not minimize the important role which HRDC plays in communities, and in many cases very visibly, from coast to coast to coast.

In the short term the minister is taking corrective measures to ensure that payments meet certain financial and program requirements, as well as checking for and correcting problem files. In the longer term we will look at equipping our HRDC staff with the right tools. It is important that they have the tools to do the job. We want accountability, openness and transparency. That is part of the action plan. We want to have measurable and achievable results. And we want to report back not only to the House, but to the public at large.

[John Solomon, NDP, Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK]

Mr. Speaker, the member for Oak Ridges talked about accountability and responsibility. He said that the Liberal government should be responsible and accountable. All Canadians want from their governments is for them to be accountable and responsible to the people.

The member for Oak Ridges said: “We have to have to have confidence in the system”. We have seen a very severe attack on the integrity of the government over the last year. How can Canadians have confidence in the system, in the government, when it tries to spend $20 million a year to subsidize millionaire hockey players?

How can we have confidence in the government when it refuses to assist western grain farmers who are suffering the worst farm income crisis since the 1930s?

How can we have confidence in a government which defends the oil companies, allowing them to gouge consumers at the gasoline pumps at the highest rates in the world?

How can we have confidence in the government when medicare is in crisis and all it says is that it will look at it over the next five years?

We have a real crisis in confidence with respect to the government.

I ask the member: How can you persuade Canadians to trust your government to do the right thing in any program you administer when every single time you lay your hands on the treasury the money is misspent?

[The Speaker]

Before I recognize the hon. member for Oak Ridges, I know it is only the second day, but I would ask the member to address his questions through the Chair rather than to the member.

[Bryon Wilfert, Liberal, Oak Ridges, ON]

Mr. Speaker, my hon. colleague gave us a litany of issues, many of which he knows are not directly under federal jurisdiction. In some cases, such as gasoline, although the federal government is responsible for dealing with competition, it does not deal with the issue of pricing at the pumps.

In terms of the farm crisis, there is not one member on this side of the House who needs any lesson in dealing with that crisis. The minister has put forth dollars. Maybe you should talk to your friend, the premier of Saskatchewan, about anteing up his 40%.

Maybe you should talk about the fact that when the Government of Canada put—

[The Speaker]

I am interrupting once more to say that the hon. member must address the Chair. Please, do not address each other directly.

[Bryon Wilfert, Liberal, Oak Ridges, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I do not want to learn any bad habits from my friend across the way. There is no question that the comments we are getting from across the aisle are not in the proper context. They are saying that we are not doing anything.

We have anted up 60% for farm incomes. Gasoline pricing is not our responsibility, but competition is, and we accept that. If we are going to talk about medicare, let us put the actual figures and facts on the table, not the rhetoric.

Elisabeth Gasser

[Denis Paradis, Liberal, Brome—Missisquoi, QC]

Mr. Speaker, a few days before Christmas, Elisabeth Gasser passed away. She had been my riding assistant in Brome—Missisquoi, providing me with wonderful support right from the first time I was elected in 1995.

Her death is a great loss for her family, her many friends and her work colleagues, as well as for the Liberal Party, on which she focussed the strength of her convictions and the enthusiasm for which she was well known.

I was greatly affected by her passing, because Elisabeth was one of those people known for their joie de vivre, dynamism and availability to all. She was one of those people who never did anything half-heartedly. She made her way through life with determination and passion.

This lady, who was so full of life, left us at the age of 45, as the result of lung cancer. She leaves a great void behind her.

I wish to salute the courage of this woman whose extraordinary morale never faltered all the time she was ill. I extend my most sincere condolences to her family, particularly her four children, who were still very much in need of their mother's presence.

Farewell, Elisabeth.

Human Resources Development

[John Duncan, Reform, Vancouver Island North, BC]

Mr. Speaker, the federal government plays politics with its multibillion dollar HRD programs while abandoning essentials such as isolated coastal community docks, the coast guard, national defence and the RCMP.

Department of Transport policy states that the federal government will continue to maintain port facilities for remote and isolated communities. Its actions contradict its words.

The village of Quatsino has been a viable west coast community since the 1880s. Quatsino relies on boat transportation and dock facilities to send children to school and to access health care.

The federal government wants to abandon one end of this marine route by abandoning the dock. Federal bureaucrats have told residents it is their problem because they chose to live there.

When will the government see past its insensitive nose and live up to its own policy commitments?

White Cane Week

[Gurbax Malhi, Liberal, Bramalea—Gore—Malton, ON]

Mr. Speaker, this week is White Cane Week. The white cane and the guide dog have come to symbolize every blind person's right to pursue and achieve a full and independent life.

They allow blind persons to travel safely, undertake gainful employment and fully participate in society. Canadian schools, institutions and business leaders should take the lead in ensuring full acceptance and equal opportunity for the blind in Canada.

Finally, I ask all Canadian citizens to recognize and respect the white cane and the guide dog as representing safety, dignity and self-help for the blind.

Father Georges-Henri Lévesque

[Clifford Lincoln, Liberal, Lac-Saint-Louis, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to pay tribute to the memory of Father Georges-Henri Lévesque, whom I had the privilege of knowing during my years in the Quebec national assembly.

Father Lévesque was one of those special people whose exceptional contributions to society leave an indelible mark on the times in which they have lived.

Theologian, academic, reformer and scholar, Father Lévesque founded Laval University's faculty of social sciences, and co-chaired the commission which created the Canada Council.

We owe him a debt of gratitude, primarily for his inspiration, his courage, his brilliance as a reformer and social intervenor; his name is rightfully linked with the great flow of ideas and social reforms that gave rise to the quiet revolution.

Father Lévesque, for all that you have been, and all that you have left as your legacy to us, we are deeply grateful.

Agriculture

[Larry McCormick, Liberal, Hastings—Frontenac—Lennox And Addington, ON]

Mr. Speaker, on January 16 the family farm tribute was held at the Air Canada Centre in Toronto. This successful afternoon of entertainment and education saw 13,000 people in attendance and was broadcast live across Canada by CBC Newsworld and CFRB.

A long list of performers from Gordon Lightfoot, Michael Burgess and the Toronto Symphony Orchestra to children's entertainer Fred Penner inspired event goers. Participants also frequented the exhibit gallery educational booths set up by Agriculture and Agri-food Canada, by Health Canada and by agricultural organizations like the Canadian Federation of Agriculture.

Urban Canadians who make up more than two-thirds of Canada's population enjoy tremendous benefits from the commitment and contribution of our farmers. Canadian farmers are the most efficient in the world. They produce the highest quality of foods at domestic prices that are the envy of other countries.

On behalf of Rural Caucus I wish to acknowledge the efforts of the member for Broadview—Greenwood in collaboration with Ronnie The Hawk Hawkins in spearheading this event. Through their efforts—

[The Speaker]

The hon. member for Kelowna.

Human Resources Development

[Werner Schmidt, Reform, Kelowna, BC]

Mr. Speaker, yesterday's question period revealed that the Prime Minister does not care about credibility. On June 12, 1991, he said:

If there is any bungling in the department, nobody will be singled out. The minister will have to take the responsibility.

Yet the Prime Minister made a spectacle of defending the HRD minister. The Prime Minister has no regard for integrity. His minister knew of the bungling of the transitional jobs fund. Yet he defended her when she told the House and Canadians that everything was all right. She now admits that was not true but what she says now is true. Can we believe her? We only know for certain what the auditors have shown us: mismanagement and ineptitude.

The Liberals do not care about how they spend taxpayer money. They just want more of it. There were 37 tax increases since they took office. As the latest billion dollar boondoggle glaringly shows, when the Liberals get our money they abuse it, misuse it and lose it.

Figure Skating

[Bernard Patry, Liberal, Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I am hugely proud to announce to this House that Pierrefonds will be hosting—and this is a first for Quebec—the North American Challenge 2000, between August 8 and 13. This international figure skating championship will be linked to the summer 2000 championships.

Sponsored by the Club de patinage artistique de Pierrefonds, an affiliate of the Association régionale de patinage artistique du Lac-Saint-Louis, which comprises 15 clubs, the competition will bring over 1,000 young people together and allow them to test their skills in one of the most beautiful sporting disciplines.

I would like to congratulate, among others, the Fédération de patinage artistique du Québec, which has a membership of nearly 38,000 skaters and the Canadian Figure Skating Association for their work with the young people and for the confidence they have shown in the Club de patinage artistique de Pierrefonds.

Every success to our athletes, officials and organizers.

Anne Hébert

[Maud Debien, Bloc, Laval East, QC]

Mr. Speaker, Anne Hébert, one of Quebec's greatest writers passed away recently at the age of 83.

Poet, novelist and playwright, this gentle discreet woman caught the imagination of Quebecers through her writing with its shadows of love and hate, life and death, red and black and dark and light.

Born in Sainte-Catherine-de-la-Jacques-Cartier, cousin of another famous writer, Saint-Denys Garneau, she produced works that earned her an international reputation and prestigious awards, including the Prix France-Canada, the prix Fémina and the prix des Libraires de France, to name but a few.

Anne Hébert died at the dawn of the year 2000. Like the century marked by concern and great hope, she left us a body of work drawn on our roots.

The Bloc Quebecois would like to express its deepest sympathies to her family and say to them, in the words of one of her lines, that she who ceaselessly secretly weighs our soul will remain in the hearts of Quebecers.

Churchill Heights

[John Cannis, Liberal, Scarborough Centre, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I take this opportunity to welcome the students of Churchill Heights to Ottawa today. These students have travelled to Ottawa from my riding of Scarborough Centre in order to visit the impressive Parliament Buildings and to see firsthand how their government functions. This experience will no doubt be an enriching addition to what they have already learned in the classroom and will leave a lasting mark on them for the rest of their lives.

I believe it is important for Canadians of all ages to visit the capital and bear witness to the legislative process at work. As such I extend an invitation to all my constituents to do as the students of Churchill Heights have done by visiting us in Ottawa.

I welcome the students from Churchill Heights to Ottawa and thank them for giving me the opportunity to host them in our country's capital.

Gulf War Syndrome

[Art Hanger, Reform, Calgary Northeast, AB]

Mr. Speaker, an independent autopsy performed on deceased Captain Terry Riordon proves conclusively that gulf war illness exists and that depleted uranium is the probably cause. Captain Riordon's wife, Sue Riordon, endured the double misery of watching her husband die a slow and agonizing death and hearing the government deny that he was suffering from anything but stress.

It is one thing for the government to send our troops to war. It is entirely another to deny they are sick as a result of that war, but that is exactly the government's record. It has continually denied the existence of any gulf war syndrome and publicly insisted that depleted uranium is essentially safe even though its own internal documents warn personnel to wear safety gear when handling this substance.

It is time to recognize the illness, care for the veterans and isolate the toxin that has caused a decade of pain for hundreds of vets. It is time for the government to be held accountable. We honour the courage of Sue Riordon in her quest for the truth.

Quebec Economy

[Raymonde Folco, Liberal, Laval West, QC]

Mr. Speaker, we just heard some excellent news for our economy. The value of Quebec exports has increased for the third consecutive month, to reach $5.7 billion. This is a 4.7% increase compared to the October figure.

This is a sure sign of the strength of the Quebec economy as well as proof that Quebec can only gain from being part of this great country that Canada is.

Unfortunately, the sovereignists send the wrong message when they try to make people believe that an independent Quebec would fare better. These eloquent figures prove just the opposite.

Human Resources Development

[Michelle Dockrill, NDP, Bras D'Or, NS]

Mr. Speaker, is there anybody left who wonders why Canadians do not have confidence in the government? The political mismanagement of HRDC funding practices has created yet another Liberal slush fund. Canadians are not fooled by the Prime Minister and his spin doctors trying to get off the hook. Canadians know that ministers must be accountable for their own departments.

Instead of following through on its ethical obligations and instead of helping students who are suffering under record high debt the government decides to subsidize billionaire banks. Next, the shipping company owned by the finance minister is interested in buying the assets of Devco, the same crown corporation that through his policies he helped shut down. Is that ethical?

The questions speak louder than the rhetoric. In this last month alone the examples of just how much the government is out of touch with the needs of ordinary Canadians are shocking. If the government wants to restore its credibility it must first learn to respect the people to whom it is accountable, all Canadians.

Minister Of Intergovernmental Affairs

[Pierre Brien, Bloc, Témiscamingue, QC]

Mr. Speaker, yesterday, with his usual but nevertheless hard to take self-importance and contempt, the Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs described those groups wishing to be heard on Bill C-20 as “mothball clubs”.

As far as we in the Bloc Quebecois are concerned, these groups reflect the views of millions of Quebecers, including women, young people, artists and workers. Mothballs have nothing to do with them.

On the contrary, the fact that these Quebec groups wish to be heard and the plea by some 100 Canadians yesterday to have the clarity bill withdrawn are a breath of fresh air, and the minister should listen to these people.

Let us help the minister make amends. Let him invite these groups and listen to them during the committee hearings. The minister will see that what they have to say has nothing to do with mothballs.

The Economy

[Albina Guarnieri, Liberal, Mississauga East, ON]

Mr. Speaker, through the efforts of all Canadians we are enjoying some of the best economic conditions in over a decade. The unemployment rate was 6.8% in January, the lowest level since April 1976.

This is the largest decline in unemployment under the leadership of any Canadian government in over 50 years. Over 1.7 million new jobs have been created since the Liberal government took office in 1993.

Every Canadian is a part of this success: the lowest unemployment rate for women since 1974, 5.5%; for young people since 1990, 12.5%. With 16 consecutive months of economic growth the Canadian economy is experiencing the longest uninterrupted surge forward in over a decade. Job creation and economic growth are part of every party's political platform, but it is only this government that has delivered on that promise in liberal proportions.

Western Alienation

[Rick Borotsik, Progressive Conservative, Brandon—Souris, MB]

Mr. Speaker, I rise today to comment on last week's release of the Liberal government's task force on western alienation. After reading all 62 pages of the report I realized that no matter how many studies the government does on the issue of alienation it still does not get it.

The report showed how completely detached the Liberals are from the needs of western Canada. Their view of western Canada is endemic whether it be their historic indifference to the farm crisis, the 1997 election call in the middle of the Red River Valley flood or a decision under the Trudeau government to create the national energy program.

As a timely example of this western indifference, just this week, yesterday and today, a delegation of respected agricultural leaders have been denied, refused a meeting with the Minister responsible for the Canadian Wheat Board, one of the few Liberals left in western Canada. The issue they wanted to talk about was western grain transportation, the Kroeger report, an item that is vital to agriculture in western Canada.

Robert Munsch

[Brenda Chamberlain, Liberal, Guelph—Wellington, ON]

Mr. Speaker, we have always known that Guelph—Wellington is full of wonderful and talented people. Later this week one of those people, author Robert Munsch, will be inducted into the Order of Canada. Robert Munsch has written 35 children's books, including the classics Mortimer , The Paper Bag Princess and Love You Forever .

Children across Canada and around the world have grown up with these great stories which not only entertain but also teach important lessons about the importance of family and of accepting people for who they are.

All of Guelph—Wellington will watch proudly when Robert Munsch is honoured by Governor General Adrienne Clarkson for his impressive contribution to children's literature. We hope that Mr. Munsch will keep writing for many, many years to come.