Debates of Sept. 26th, 2001

Health

[Jeannot Castonguay, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Health]

Mr. Speaker, obviously they had a very full agenda. I cannot outline all that was discussed, but I might indicate that one of the items of discussion was the high cost of pharmaceuticals.

The ministers agreed to establish a common evaluation process, so that instead of each province conducting its own evaluation, it would be done at the national level, and the results would be shared. Each province would then decide whether or not to include it on the formulary listing.

They also discussed the importance of home care and community health care. Clearly, this is an important issue, because these days, there is much work being done in the community. There are a great many things that I would like to share, but—

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh.

[The Speaker]

Order, please. This concludes oral question period for today.

The Chair has received notice of a question of privilege from the hon. member for Saint-Hyacinthe--Bagot.

Privilege

[Yvan Loubier, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Mr. Speaker, there are some strange goings-on in this parliament and a fortiori in this government.

On September 18 of this year, the Minister of Finance tabled Notice of Ways and Means Motion No. 6. This was a notice of ways and means motion amending the Income Tax Act so as to allow taxpayers, and particularly the government, to better manage the money that government receives.

However, eight days after this notice of ways and means motion was tabled, we are still trying to find out which minister, which department and which officials are responsible for it.

When we ask the Minister of Finance who is responsible for this notice of ways and means motion, he refers us to the Secretary of State for International Financial Institutions.

When we contact officials in the office of the secretary of state responsible for financial institutions, they are surprised and completely taken aback: it is the first time they have seen this notice of ways and means motion, and they refer us to the Department of Finance.

At the Department of Finance, we are told that it is the Minister of National Revenue, not the Minister of Finance, who is responsible. The Minister of National Revenue tells us it is the Minister of Finance.

Eight days after the notice of ways and means motion was tabled, we still do not know which minister is responsible for this important notice, the effect of which is to introduce new provisions for managing the billions of dollars received from Canadian and Quebec taxpayers.

Second, our efforts to obtain this information from departmental officials have not been any more successful. When we call the Department of Finance and speak to officials, we are told that this is not their responsibility but rather the responsibility of officials working for the Secretary of State for International Financial Institutions. When we speak to officials working for the Secretary of State for International Financial Institutions, we are told that department of revenue officials are responsible.

In short, after eight days, officials are still wondering which minister is responsible for Notice of Ways and Means Motion No. 6, which department is responsible for this notice of ways and means motion, and which official can provide any sort of answer to our questions regarding the billions of taxpayer dollars managed by the government.

[The Speaker]

Order, please. The hon. member indicated that he was rising on a question of privilege. I heard nothing about a question of privilege, and I trust that he will come to that immediately.

[Yvan Loubier, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I was just getting to it.

Yesterday afternoon, there was a suggestion of the possibility of voting on this notice of ways and means motion. We were asked at that time, as members of this House, to vote on a kind of shapeless thing, a UFO, unidentified flying object. We were asked to vote on a motion whose ins and outs no one was able to explain to us.

According to Montpetit Marleau, we have privileges as members of this House. We have the right to know what we are voting on and to have replies to our questions from the ministers responsible or from public servants. We find ourselves in a situation where responses are not forthcoming and we are being threatened with a vote. This is clearly contempt of this House. Clearly, our privileges as members of parliament are being breached by this government. I am calling upon you for a ruling on this breach according to Montpetit-Marleau.

[Don Boudria, Liberal, Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, there is no question of privilege involved here, as we all know. If the hon. member is asking us for the assurance that someone will give him an information session before I, as leader of the government in the House, call for a vote on this motion, of course we will.

[The Speaker]

The hon. member for Saint-Hyacinthe--Bagot, very briefly.

[Yvan Loubier, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Mr. Speaker, there is truly an attack on our privileges. In Marleau and Montpetit's House of Commons Procedure and Practice , it says on page 50, and I quote:

Parliamentary privilege is the sum of the peculiar rights enjoyed by each House collectively... and by Members of each House individually, without which they could not discharge their function.

It is impossible for me to discharge my function of Bloc Quebecois critic on finance, since I am not getting an answer from the government. We do not know which minister, department or officials are in charge. For the past eight days, we have not been able to get answers--

[The Speaker]

In spite of the hon. member's arguments in support of his point of view, there is a problem here for the Chair. This ways and means motion was tabled on September 18. It is recorded in the notice paper; therefore it is in the order paper of the House, and a copy was tabled with the clerk of the House.

I know that I myself often cannot understand these documents, but this is not a question of privilege. Sometimes, these documents are very difficult to understand, because they are very technical.

I fully sympathize with the hon. member and I appreciate his difficulties in finding someone to provide explanations, but we heard the hon. leader of the government in the House say that he will find someone somewhere who can do it.

This is not, in my view, a question of privilege, because the document is here. I realize that these documents can be very technical, but this is not, in my opinion, a question of privilege.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, Oh!

[The Speaker]

I believe that I heard enough on this issue. I would like to move on to other issues.

[Yvan Loubier, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Mr. Speaker, please--

[The Speaker]

The hon. member for Saint-Hyacinthe--Bagot has the floor for a brief comment. Then I will hear the hon. Secretary of State.

[Yvan Loubier, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I have a great deal of respect for the Chair. The problem is not one of understanding. Since the ways and means motion was tabled, I have been looking for the minister responsible. I am being sent from one minister to the next, from one department to the next, and no public servant can answer our questions on this ways and means motion. This has been going for eight days.

This is the first time that such a thing happens. Usually, we can find the public servant and, more importantly, the minister responsible.

If there is no violation of my privileges as a member of parliament--

[The Speaker]

Order, please. It is not a matter of finding an official who can answer the questions. There are ministers here in the House to do that.

The Secretary of State for International Financial Institutions is in the House. He has the floor if he wishes to contribute to the discussion.

[Jim Peterson, Liberal, Secretary of State (International Financial Institutions)]

Mr. Speaker, I will ensure that someone gets in touch with the hon. member.

[The Speaker]

I believe this ends debate on this question of privilege for now.

Business of the House

[Don Boudria, Liberal, Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order. There has been consultation among all parties in the House in relation to the disposition of Bill C-15. If the House agrees I would like to offer the following motion to be adopted without debate. I move:

That Bill C-15, An Act to amend the Criminal Code and to amend other Acts, be deemed to have been read a second time and referred to the Standing Committee on Justice and Human Rights;

That the committee be instructed to divide the bill into two bills, the first containing the provisions of Bill C-15 respecting protection of children from sexual exploitation, criminal harassment, disarming or attempting to disarm a peace officer, home invasions, allegations of miscarriages of justice and reform and modernization of criminal procedures, and the second containing the provisions of Bill C-15 respecting cruelty to animals and the Firearms Act; and

That the committee be instructed to report the first bill no later than October 31, 2001 and the second bill no later than November 30, 2001.

[The Speaker]

Does the hon. government House leader have unanimous consent of the House to propose the motion?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

(Motion agreed to)

[John Reynolds, Canadian Alliance, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order. I thank the government House leader for a doing a job on which opposition House leaders have been working for a long time.

It is a difficult job to get the Minister of Justice to change her mind and we thank him for that. All Canadians will thank him because what we have done today is good for all Canadians.

Official Languages

[Geoff Regan, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, in accordance with Standing Order 109 it is my pleasure to table, in both official languages, two copies of the government's response to the report of the Standing Joint Committee on Official Languages, “The Broadcasting and Availability of the Debates and Proceedings of Parliament in both Official Languages”.

Government Response to Petitions

[Geoff Regan, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, pursuant to Standing Order 36(8) I have the honour to table, in both official languages, the government's response to 10 petitions.

Interparliamentary Delegations

[Joe Comuzzi, Liberal, Thunder Bay—Superior North, ON]

Mr. Speaker, as co-chair of the Canada-U.S. Interparliamentary Group and pursuant to Standing Order 31 I have the honour to present, in both official languages, the report on the meetings held in Canada from May 17 to May 21.

Never in the history of the House has the Canada-U.S. Interparliamentary Group played such an important role. It will continue to play that role in the future.