Debates of Nov. 19th, 2002

Disability Tax Credit

[Loyola Hearn, Progressive Conservative, St. John's West, NL]

Mr. Speaker, today we have heard a great debate on a motion dealing with the disability tax credit. Although this issue has been raised before, it is only now that it is starting to hit home with the many individuals affected by this issue. The attempt by the government to eliminate the disability tax credit from those in need of every break they can get is inconceivable.

The issue becomes even more repugnant when one realizes that the line department is HRDC, the very department that boasts a $38 billion surplus. This surplus was built on the backs of the working class, including those living but yet working with their disabilities. The government and particularly the department of HRDC should be ashamed and should immediately restore the tax credit to those so deserving.

Queen's Jubilee Medal

[Myron Thompson, Canadian Alliance, Wild Rose, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I had the honour of presenting the Queen's Jubilee Medal to 23 special constituents from Wild Rose last Wednesday in Calgary: from Sundre, Irene Cunningham, Gloria Gorrill and Garry Vooys; from Airdrie, Vance Gough, Hugh Hamilton, Gordon Leek, Gretha Robinson and Lee-Anne Welter; from Banff, Bernadette McDonald, Brian Skrine and Nicole Yarmoloy; from Balzac, John Gough and Rudy Schmidtke; from Cochrane, Russel Sinclair, James Taylor and John Tennant; from Crossfield, Sheila Pagan and Edwin Snyder; from Olds, Olivia Amy Muir and Kelly Rasmussen; Beverly Cheesmur of Didsbury; Denny Gibson of Canmore; and Gladys Taylor of Irricana.

All 23 recipients truly represent the fundamental meaning of the Jubilee medal. They exhibited distinguished service or made a significant achievement to their fellow citizens, community and to Canada. Congratulations to all.

Kyoto Protocol

[Stephen Harper, Canadian Alliance, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, yesterday, the Minister of the Environment said that the government will follow the standard practice for the ratification of the Kyoto protocol. However, according to the Vienna convention, the time between the signing of a treaty and its ratification is to allow the government to pass all necessary legislation to implement the treaty nationally.

Will the Prime Minister respect this standard and introduce legislation before the vote in the House on the ratification of Kyoto?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I do not know where the hon. member gets his information. The government made a commitment to the international community to fulfill its obligations regarding Kyoto by the year 2012, and this is 2002. A vote will take place in the House of Commons. We could even have ratified the protocol without a vote in the House. However, we had the courtesy of asking for a vote here and we will ratify the protocol.

This is the reality. This is the prerogative of the executive branch. We did it and we will vote before the end of the year, as we said in the Speech from the Throne.

[Stephen Harper, Canadian Alliance, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, the Prime Minister, after these years, should know the correct facts. That is not correct. We do not have an international obligation until Parliament adopts this legislation and legislation is passed through Parliament.

A former chair of the Privy Council, someone whom the government I believe holds in high esteem, said “99.9% of all treaties are not ratified until the implementing legislation has passed”.

Will the government follow the advice of former Deputy Prime Minister Herb Gray?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, this is an international obligation that we have been discussing with the international community since 1992. From Rio we went to Kyoto, and we made some obligations there.

Since that time we said we would ratify, and there is no obligation to pass legislation before ratification. We have 10 years to implement the obligation that we take in front of the international community.

[Stephen Harper, Canadian Alliance, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, that is not true either. There is no obligation until the Canadian people accept that obligation.

Maurice Copithorne, an adviser to Foreign Affairs and a leading treaty lawyer, recently wrote that governments “will normally only ratify a treaty after any necessary enabling legislation has been passed”.

The government knows that to reach its made in Japan Kyoto targets enabling legislation will have to be passed by the provinces and by the federal government. Will the Prime Minister follow the standard practice and wait until the legislation is passed before Kyoto is ratified?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the members of the opposition want to delay and delay. They should be frank and simply say, “We are opposed to your Kyoto” . We on this side of the House are for Kyoto and we will implement it. We will vote before the end of the year and we will ratify it too.

Goods and Services Tax

[Charlie Penson, Canadian Alliance, Peace River, AB]

Mr. Speaker, the Prime Minister should know something about the delay of the Canadian helicopter purchase. That is one.

Canadians are outraged by news stories today of millions of tax dollars being paid out to fraud artists. Criminals are setting up phony companies and claiming bogus car exports to get the GST refund. It is an easy scam because the government does not usually check the validity of such claims. Small businesses have to struggle to comply with the GST and deal with an army of CCRA bureaucrats every day.

How could the government allow this big time GST racket to slip through?

[Sophia Leung, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of National Revenue]

Mr. Speaker, the CCRA officials are very dedicated and hardworking. They have the best interests of the country in mind. We are taking additional action to address this. We also will audit first, then investigate. If we detect any fraud, we will prosecute without any question.

[Charlie Penson, Canadian Alliance, Peace River, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I bet the criminals are quivering in their boots over that.

When the people at CCRA were asked how cheques worth millions of dollars could be mailed out without raising any alarm bells, they said they did not have enough auditors to do the work. Well, the CCRA seems to have more than enough auditors to watch over every mom and pop store in the country.

Why does the government pay so much attention to the money that is coming in and so little attention to the millions and millions of dollars that is going out the door every day?

[Sophia Leung, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of National Revenue]

Mr. Speaker, as I said before, we always investigate and then we prosecute. If any fraud is detected, we will definitely prosecute and impose a fine or punishment.

Municipalities

[Gilles Duceppe, Bloc, Laurier—Sainte-Marie, QC]

Mr. Speaker, on June 11, the Prime Minister said that municipalities are a provincial responsibility and that his government would respect provincial jurisdictions. Despite this commitment, his own task force is now proposing that Ottawa be authorized to discuss financing directly with municipalities, in an effort to increase its presence in an area that is clearly the responsibility of Quebec and the provinces.

Will the Prime Minister follow up on the task force recommendations or keep his promise and rule out immediately this strategy to encroach on Quebec's areas of responsibility?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, we have had a study committee which has done very good work, and I want to thank all members who contributed to it.

We have programs for municipalities in many areas into which we have injected new funds. Also, new ideas have been put forward by the members of this committee. We are going to look at them and retain those that are worthwhile.

It is very important to this government to make sure that the quality of life in our municipalities is decent throughout the country.

[Gilles Duceppe, Bloc, Laurier—Sainte-Marie, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the Prime Minister is playing both sides. Perhaps the question should have been put to the member for LaSalle—Émard instead. The nice thing is that, on this issue, he is clear. He wants to take a direct approach and have a new agreement to finance municipalities directly.

I will ask the Prime Minister again. Will he keep his promise, rule out this approach and state clearly that direct financing of municipalities is out of the question and that he will respect the jurisdictions of Quebec and the provinces?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, on this issue, we have always respected the jurisdictions of the provinces. We intend to continue to do so. I have always made that clear.

However, there is room in the federal administration for better coordination and better implementation of our programs to ensure that they are as efficient as possible so that the quality of life in all municipalities in Canada can be first rate.

[Yvan Loubier, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the idea being floated of creating a department of urban affairs indicates that the federal government is once again preparing to interfere into areas of provincial jurisdiction.

Will the Prime Minister admit that by wanting to intrude into municipal affairs, which are absolutely none of its business, the federal government is really concerned far more with visibility than efficiency?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the government has jurisdiction over areas that would allow us to help municipalities. Take social housing. Last week, this very same member was calling on the federal government to invest more money in this area. There are areas where we can, and do, help.

When it comes to all of the infrastructure programs, the municipalities are very happy that we have gotten involved since 1994. They continue to ask us for more and we are answering their requests. When it comes to infrastructure, the programs are funded by three levels of government: municipal, provincial and federal.

[Yvan Loubier, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Mr. Speaker, while we are on the subject of social housing, the Prime Minister neglected to mention that it is his government that has made deep cuts to social housing since 1995.

Instead of using every possible means to interfere in the jurisdictions of others, would the Prime Minister not instead admit that there is a fiscal imbalance in Canada? There is too much money for federal responsibilities and not enough to enable the provinces to fulfill theirs.

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I have to smile, because a few years ago, during the Quebec referendum, this member was saying that Quebec had to leave Canada because the country was being mismanaged, was in debt and on the verge of bankruptcy. Today he is criticizing the federal government for having managed things too well and for having a surplus because here in Ottawa we are doing things right.

Iraq

[Alexa McDonough, NDP, Halifax, NS]

Mr. Speaker, UN weapons inspectors have not even unpacked their equipment and already the White House is accusing Iraq of non-compliance. The U.S. accusations arise from Iraqi resistance to U.S. and British bombing sorties. Bombings by the U.S. or anyone else in Iraq are not sanctioned by the UN and they are threatening the weapons inspections that are sanctioned by the UN.

Has the Prime Minister demanded an end to the American led bombing sorties which threaten the success of the weapons inspection process?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, respect for the no-fly zone in Iraq is a policy that was established a long time ago, about 10 years ago at the end of the war. From time to time there have been some interventions by American airplanes and British airplanes.

With regard to the question of the unanimous resolution of the Security Council, we are very happy with that. We hope that Mr. Saddam Hussein will respect the will of the international community and will destroy any armaments of mass destruction immediately so there will be no need for the international community--

[The Speaker]

The hon. member for Halifax.

[Alexa McDonough, NDP, Halifax, NS]

Mr. Speaker, clearing Iraq of any weapons of mass destruction is absolutely the objective. Our concern is anything that might jeopardize that.

It seems as though the government's commitment to multilateralism is short-lived. It lasts until the next call comes in from Washington. UN resolution 1441 is absolutely clear that only the UN Security Council can determine what constitutes a breach and what action should follow.

The UN Secretary General has condemned the Americans thumbing their noses at the UN resolution. When will Canada do the same and challenge this dangerous American pretext for war?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I am very disappointed that the hon. leader of the NDP is not complimenting the government because we were among the first countries to tell the Americans that they could not go there without the support of a resolution of the Security Council. We have worked very hard on that. I am sure that with this resolution we have a better chance of not having a war because every country wants Saddam Hussein to respect the United Nations so there will be no need at all for a war there.