Debates of Feb. 25th, 2013

Experimental Lakes Area

[Irene Mathyssen, NDP, London—Fanshawe, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I have a petition in regard to the Experimental Lakes Area. It is signed by residents of London, Kitchener, Waterloo and Kingston.

Petitioners are asking the House to reconsider the closure of the ELA, since the ELA has been a global leader in conducting full ecosystem experiments that are critical in shaping environmental policy and in understanding the human impact on lakes and fish. They ask the government to recognize the importance of the Experimental Lakes Area, reverse the decision to close down the ELA research station and continue to staff and provide financial resources so that this experimentation can continue.

Financial Institutions

[Peter Julian, NDP, Burnaby—New Westminster, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to present petitions signed by dozens of residents of eastern Ontario and the Ottawa region. They are concerned about overcharging on remittance fees. Many banks are charging up to 25% on remittances being sent by new Canadian families to their loved ones and family members overseas. This overcharging hurts lower-income Canadians, particularly new Canadians. The petitioners call upon the Government of Canada to introduce legislation that would put into place caps on the types of remittance penalties and remittance fees presently being paid by new Canadians and lower-income Canadians.

I would like to thank the volunteers from ACORN Canada for their work in getting involved and talking to people about this issue to make sure that Canadians can have their voices heard on the floor of the House of Commons.

Questions on the Order Paper

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, I ask that all questions be allowed to stand.

[The Speaker, Conservative, Andrew Scheer]

Is that agreed?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

President of Venezuela

[Jim Karygiannis, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

Mr. Speaker, on October 7, 2012, Hugo Chavez of Venezuela was elected for another term as president. On November 27, President Chavez underwent treatment for cancer in Cuba, and on December 8, it was announced that the president would have to undergo new cancer surgery.

Article 231 of the Venezuelan constitution states that the new president should be sworn in before the National Assembly on January 10 following the election. If this cannot happen, the president shall be sworn in before the Supreme Tribunal of Justice.

Due to his illness, president-elect Chavez has not been sworn in before the National Assembly or the Supreme Tribunal of Justice. On January 9, 2013, Venezuela's supreme court ruled that the postponement of president-elect Hugo Chavez's inauguration for an indefinite time is legal. After hearing the supreme court's decision, Vice-President Maduro indicated that the swearing in of the president was just a formality.

President-elect Chavez returned to Venezuela on February 18 and still has not been sworn in as president. The people of Venezuela deserve a president and a judicial system that adheres not only to the letter of the law but to the spirit of the law.

The Venezuelan diaspora in Canada is asking what the Canadian government is doing to help the people of Venezuela to ensure that the integrity of the Venezuelan constitution is maintained and that the democratic rights of Venezuelans are not abolished. Therefore, I am asking for an emergency debate so that the government can answer this very important question and explain what steps it is taking.

[The Speaker, Conservative, Andrew Scheer]

I thank the hon. member for raising this issue, but I do not think it meets the test for an emergency debate.

The Chair also has noticed of a point of privilege. The hon. member for Skeena—Bulkley Valley.

Minister of Human Resources and Skills Development

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I rise today on a question of privilege pursuant to section 48(1) of the Standing Orders that govern this House. It has been demonstrated that the Minister of Human Resources and Skills Development deliberately misled the House of Commons. Given the seriousness of the matter, it is my duty as a member of Parliament to bring this question to the attention of the Chair of the House of Commons.

Members of the House are all well aware of the rights and immunities afforded to parliamentarians so that they may carry out their duties as members of Parliament. However, for the sake of clarity, let me remind my colleagues that on page 75 of Erskine May's Treatise on the Law, Privileges, Proceedings and Usage of Parliament, parliamentary privilege is defined as “the sum of the peculiar rights enjoyed by each House collectively...and by Members of each House individually, without which they could not discharge their functions”.

Mr. Speaker, let me take a moment to provide the House with an account of what has taken place to this point. In hearing my remarks, I will ask you to find that the grounds exist that this is a prima facie case of privilege and that this case may be referred to the appropriate committee.

Three weeks ago, the official opposition learned that Service Canada investigators were being imposed upon to find reductions in EI benefits through the seeking of quotas. Each investigator was being asked by the minister to meet a quota of almost $500,000 per employee per year.

On February 1, 2013, during question period, the member for Hochelaga asked the Minister of Human Resources and Skills Development to explain the existence of these troubling quotas. In response to these questions, the minister flatly denied that quotas even existed. She said that “there are no individual quotas for employees of HRSDC who are looking at EI”. I quote again: “Departmental employees do not have individual quotas”.

Whether the minister calls these quotas, objectives or targets, the truth remains the truth.

Quebec newspaper Le Devoir revealed today that according to a new document it has obtained, every HRSDC investigator has an EI benefit quota to meet, even though the minister has denied that any such quota exists. Whether the minister calls them quotas, objectives or targets, the truth remains the truth.

The document in question is a performance and learning agreement. It sets out the criteria for evaluating the investigators' performance. One criterion is that each employee must make an average of $500,000 in savings a year. The savings here refer to benefits that are recovered or not paid to the workers who need them most.

Mr. Speaker, if you will allow me, I would like to quote the 22nd edition of Erskine May, which states the following on page 63: “[I]t is of paramount importance that ministers give accurate and truthful information to Parliament, correcting any inadvertent error at the earliest opportunity”.

Erskine May further states, on page 111: “The Commons may treat the making of a deliberately misleading statement as contempt”.

I would also like to quote the House of Commons Procedure and Practice, second edition, on page 115, which states that:

Misleading a Minister or a Member has also been considered a form of obstruction and thus a prima facie breach of privilege. For example, on December 6, 1978, in finding that a prima facie contempt of the House existed, Speaker Jerome ruled that a government official, by deliberately misleading a Minister, had impeded the Member in the performance of his duties and consequently obstructed the House itself.

Mr. Speaker, more recently, on May 7, 2012, you stated the following regarding a similar question of privilege raised by the member for Toronto Centre, and I will quote:

It has become accepted practice in this House that the following elements have to be established when it is alleged that a member is in contempt for deliberately misleading the House: one, it must be proven that the statement was misleading; two, it must be established that the member making the statement knew at the time that the statement was incorrect; and three, that in making the statement, the member intended to mislead the House.

I believe that the present situation meets those three criteria and represents clear contempt of the House.

The Minister of Human Resources and Skills Development clearly made false statements in the House in response to questions asked on February 1, 2013.

Since she is fully responsible for her department, the minister should be aware of the performance criteria used to evaluate Service Canada investigators and should therefore know that they have quotas to reduce EI benefits.

By denying the truth in the House of Commons, the minister wilfully misled members of the official opposition and the House.

I am confident that all members of the House will agree that it is an important and serious offence to mislead one's colleagues, and in particular, that this offence was caused by a minister. Misleading the House is a very serious breach of the rules governing our democracy and this institution.

I would urge you, Mr. Speaker, to consider these facts and issues, and if you find a prima facie case of contempt of Parliament, I am prepared to move the appropriate motion to have this case referred to the Standing Committee on Procedure and House Affairs.

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, I must say, at the outset, that I totally reject the premise on which the member opposite is raising his point of privilege. Clearly, when the minister has responded to questions from members of the opposition, she has been quite clear in stating, without question, that the government and the department in question has not placed quotas on any of the employees. I certainly believe that it is a laudable goal, and I hope all members agree with me that it is a laudable goal, for any government to try to save money, and particularly to try to find ways to stop fraud from occurring.

The minister has stated on many occasions that the department has already saved not millions of dollars, not hundreds of millions of dollars, but close to half a billion dollars in savings through stopping the fraud that had been occurring when EI claimants were wrongfully claiming for EI benefits. I also suggest that it is a laudable goal for this government, as it would be for any government, to try to make sure that in future, as we move forward, we continue to ensure that all EI claimants who ask the government for EI payments are actually doing so legitimately. Not to be diligent would be denying Canadians who play by the rules and currently receive EI benefits the ability to receive the money in a straightforward and proper manner.

I would suggest to the member opposite that the minister, when responding to questions from the opposition, was being quite forthright and was not trying to mislead the House whatsoever. Therefore, members opposite cannot claim privilege, because, in fact, their duties and responsibilities as members of Parliament have not been impeded.

I would close by saying that the matter of privilege the member opposite raises is obviously serious. Any time any member raises a question of privilege, it is a serious matter. I would therefore ask you, Mr. Speaker, to allow the minister in question an appropriate opportunity, at her earliest convenience, to respond in further detail to the question of privilege just made.

[The Speaker, Conservative, Andrew Scheer]

I thank both members for their interventions and look forward to further points related to this question.

The House resumed consideration of the motion that Bill C-55, An Act to amend the Criminal Code, be read the second time and referred to a committee.

Response to the Supreme Court of Canada Decision in R. v. Tse Act

[The Speaker, Conservative, Andrew Scheer]

We will now have five minutes for questions and comments for the hon. member for Dartmouth—Cole Harbour.

Questions and comments?

Resuming debate, the hon. member for Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier.

[Élaine Michaud, NDP, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to rise in the House today to speak to Bill C-55, a Response to the Supreme Court of Canada Decision in R. v. Tse Act.

This bill amends the Criminal Code to provide safeguards related to the authority to intercept private communications without prior judicial authorization under section 184 of that Act.

Bill C-55 requires the Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness and the Attorney General of each province to report on the interceptions of private communications made under section 184.4; provides that a person who has been the object of such an interception must be notified within a specified time, which is currently done only where charges are laid; and narrows the class of persons who can make such interceptions.

This bill updates certain provisions of the Criminal Code relating to wiretaps that were enacted in 1993. The updating was ordered by the Supreme Court in R. v. Tse, in which it held that section 184.4 of the Criminal Code was unconstitutional and had to be amended by Parliament no later than April 13, 2013. The deadline is fast approaching.

In that case, the Supreme Court found that this section infringed the right to be protected against arbitrary searches and seizures, a right guaranteed by section 8 of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms, and was not a reasonable limit within the meaning of section 1 of the charter. That decision is based on the fact that section 184.4 of the Criminal Code does not provide a mechanism for oversight and does not require that notice be given to persons whose private communications have been intercepted.

Bill C-55 is a somewhat desperate last-minute attempt by the Conservatives to comply with the instructions from the Supreme Court by the deadline given. I say “last-minute” because as of today parliamentarians have exactly 19 days left in which to pass Bill C-55 at second reading, examine it in committee, pass it in the House and then repeat the process in the other place, before it ultimately receives royal assent and comes into force as the law in Canada. That is very little time for such an important bill, which could have negative consequences for too many Canadians if we do not take the time to analyze it thoroughly.

I can understand why, after falling flat on their face with Bill C-30, the Conservatives would be somewhat nervous about the idea of considering the electronic surveillance issue again, or indeed any issues relating to potential breaches of Canadians’ privacy, but Bill C-55 ought to have been introduced long ago.

Perhaps the Conservatives were trying to minimize the Minister of Public Safety's opportunities to insult potential opponents of Bill C-55. Who knows?

In any event, the NDP believes that it is an initial step in the right direction, and that is why we will be supporting Bill C-55 at second reading so that it can be studied in committee.

As I mentioned earlier, this bill would make important and essential amendments to the Criminal Code to make section 184.4 consistent with the Constitution by adding a number of safeguards as directed by the court.

The NDP has been asking the government to take action for a long time in order to act on these recommendations. From this standpoint, we would like this bill to move on to the next stage. It is essential for the investigative measures provided in any bill amending section 184.4 of the Criminal Code to have oversight and accountability mechanisms that protect the privacy of Canadians.

I am aware of the fact that it is sometimes necessary to put aside individual privacy to protect human lives and property from serious and imminent harm.

On the other hand, one cannot simply cast aside the fundamental rights guaranteed by the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

The Supreme Court of Canada has established new parameters to protect privacy. We expect Bill C-55 to comply with these new criteria.

However, analysis of the defunct Bill C-30 and its stinging failure makes it obvious that the Conservatives need to rethink their approach to privacy and personal information.

A close look at the Conservatives’ agenda in this area demonstrates clearly that Canadians have good reason to be worried about any government bills on wiretapping and privacy.

My New Democratic colleagues and I are aware of the public's concerns about wiretapping, and we share them.

When Bill C-55 is studied in committee, the NDP will work, as we always do, on behalf of all Canadians to guarantee respect for the rule of law, the Constitution and the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

We want to ensure that Bill C-55 is in compliance with the Supreme Court’s decision in R. v. Tse to make section 184.4 of the Criminal Code constitutional and to achieve the necessary balance between personal freedom and public safety.

I invite my Conservative colleagues on the Standing Committee on Justice and Human Rights to work with the NDP to improve Bill C-55 to guarantee respect for the fundamental rights of all Canadians as set out in our charter.

We know that it is sometimes difficult in committee to get support for opposition ideas. However, this time, we all agree on the basic idea that the Criminal Code needs to be amended to comply with the Supreme Court directives. There are people with impressive legal expertise in every party. They understand this issue and have suggestions to make to ensure that public safety in this country is a given for everyone, but that people's fundamental rights are also guaranteed.

It is important that all of the parties work together on this task so that the end result will truly protect us by keeping Canadians safe from terrorist attacks and any other wrongdoing. However, we need assurance that personal rights will be respected as well.

The Conservatives do not need to get caught up in hyper-partisan debates, as they did when they introduced Bill C-30. There is no need for rhetoric and no need to label people as child pornographers—as the Minister of Public Safety did during debate on Bill C-30—if they dare raise the issues that remain in Bill C-55. They also do not need to wait for public and political pressure to get to the point where the government has no other choice but to abandon its own bill, as it did with Bill C-30.

After that huge debacle, I would hope that the Conservatives have finally learned their lesson and that they will be willing to work with members of the official opposition and the third party to fix enduring issues in the Criminal Code of Canada.

We in the NDP share the government's desire to maintain and ensure public safety, but we also care about respecting the principles of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms in every bill that is passed in this House. Unfortunately, that does not always seem to be the case with this government, which would rather be called to order by the Supreme Court after introducing its bills, rather than legislating proactively and ensuring that its bills are constitutional before introducing them in the House.

This government could benefit from the advice and opinions of the opposition in order to ensure that Bill C-55 complies with the Supreme Court decision in the R. v. Tse case. I hope the government will be more open than it typically has been since winning a majority.

I heard many of the speeches given by my NDP and Liberal colleagues. They all regard this bill from more or less the same perspective, specifically, that it addresses something that has been a serious problem in the Criminal Code since 1993, but has never been resolved, not by past Liberal governments or by the Conservative government.

Now we have a makeshift bill here today that was introduced at the last minute to satisfy a court requirement. However, this bill was not necessarily 100% well thought-out and not all possible consequences have been considered. There is still some work to do.

We come here with a very open mind. We support this bill at second reading so that it can be improved at committee in order to ensure that it respects the criteria for the protection of privacy set out by the Supreme Court. That is the objective of all of my colleagues, including those who are members of the Standing Committee on Justice and Human Rights and those on other committees. It is the objective of the third party.

I hope we will achieve this objective together through our work in committee, and I look forward to seeing the new version that results from our examination.

[Laurin Liu, NDP, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Mr. Speaker, we know that the court has established new parameters for protecting the right to privacy, and we expect this bill to comply with those standards. That is what the NDP will be asking for.

Can my honourable colleague explain, once again, why we have only 19 days to study this bill? Why has the government waited so long, why has it waited until the deadline set by the Supreme Court? How does this undermine our right to provide oversight here in Parliament?

[Élaine Michaud, NDP, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague for her excellent question. Unfortunately, my answer can be summed up in one word: arrogance. Since gaining a majority, the government has introduced the bills it wants and consulted no one, or next to no one. It may consult those who share its opinion.

However, the opposition's concerns, whether they are those of the public or of members of other parties, are not considered. We spent months hearing about Bill C-30 and trying to debate and improve it. The public and various opposition party members have clearly told the government about problems with the bill, but the government decided that it was right and that, because it has a majority, it did not need to worry about the opposition's opinion.

That is the situation today, 19 parliamentary days before the deadline set by the Supreme Court. We are still debating this bill, which should have been introduced months ago. Bill C-30 should have been abandoned or shelved a long time ago, and we should have taken up the task together. That was not done and that is why we are in this problematic situation today.

[Hélène LeBlanc, NDP, LaSalle—Émard, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague for her speech. I would like her to comment on the importance of accountability. Under the bill, this type of interception is used in exceptional circumstances.

I would also like the hon. member to comment on the importance of always having accountability mechanisms, monitoring mechanisms and well-established conditions in bills, but also on the importance of accountability if this type of monitoring is used.

[Élaine Michaud, NDP, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague for that excellent question. Accountability is a very important issue, particularly in a bill such as this one. Even if this type of interception is used on a fairly limited basis, it undermines the fundamental right to privacy .

In this case, the right to privacy is undermined in exceptional circumstances, namely, to protect people's lives and to protect property from major damage. The police are given permission to do this, but they must still be closely monitored. Parliament must be informed of how often this type of method is used. We must be informed of the type of circumstances surrounding the choice to intercept any private communications.

This type of mechanism must be included in the bill in order to protect Canadians and to ensure that the measures we take to respect and guarantee public safety do not excessively undermine the fundamental rights of Canadians guaranteed by the Charter. Section 1 of the Charter allows us to override these rights when doing so is reasonable, but we must ensure that such is always the case, which is what will allow for accountability.

[Djaouida Sellah, NDP, Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I will be sharing my time with my colleague from LaSalle—Émard.

I will start by saying that I am very relieved. Like many of my constituents from Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, I am relieved that Bill C-30 has died a quiet death.

Many of my constituents wrote to me to share their concerns about the ill-advised and dangerous Bill C-30. I am pleased that it is now behind us and that we can finally focus on the issues related to section 184.4 of the Criminal Code.

In all the time I have been a member in this House, this is the first time that the government has listened to reason and acknowledged that its first attempt was not the right one, since it did not correspond to the needs and wants of Canadians. I congratulate the Conservatives on that and urge them to start over more often. It is not so hard and everyone feels better afterwards. I urge the government to start over with the employment insurance reform. It feels so good to do the right thing.

But to come back to the matter at hand, let us be honest: this bill looks more like an appropriate response to what the courts have called for than did the former Bill C-30. This new bill is simply an update to the wiretapping provisions that the Supreme Court held to be unconstitutional.

This bill is before us as a result of a decision of the British Columbia Supreme Court, upheld by the Supreme Court of Canada, that declared section 184.4 of the Criminal Code to be unconstitutional. That section allows peace officers to intercept certain private communications, without prior judicial authorization, if they believe on reasonable grounds that the interception is immediately necessary to prevent an unlawful act that would cause serious harm, provided that judicial authorization cannot be obtained with reasonable diligence.

The courts held that emergency situations existed, but that a balance had to be struck between measures to protect individuals against unreasonable searches and seizures and society’s interest in preventing serious harm. That is why the courts held that section 184.4 of the Criminal Code violated section 8 of the charter, since it does not provide a mechanism for oversight, and very specifically, it does not require that notice be given to persons whose private communications have been intercepted.

An accountability mechanism needs to be enacted to protect the important privacy interests that are at stake, and a provision requiring notice would meet that need. The requirement that individuals whose communications are intercepted be given notice would in no way interfere with police action in an emergency. It would actually enhance the ability of the individuals targeted to identify and challenge violations of their privacy and obtain a genuine remedy. That is part of the balance we must try to strike and it is precisely that balance that we must achieve. Safeguards have to be in place to prevent as many abuses as possible and provide our constituents with a guarantee that their rights and freedoms will not be violated by legislation that this House might enact.

One way to be sure of this is to follow the instructions the courts have given, in particular with regard to privacy.

There are points that respond directly to the decisions of the courts. For example, this bill requires that the Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness and the attorney general of each province report on the interceptions of private communications made under section 184.4. It further provides that a person who has been the object of such an interception must be notified within a specified time, which is ordinarily 90 days but could be extended to three years in the case of terrorism and organized crime.

The bill also narrows the class of individuals who can make such interceptions, in addition to limiting interceptions to the offences listed in section 183 of the Criminal Code, which make up a relatively long list. In my opinion, these measures follow the instructions given by the courts, but we have to make sure that these provisions meet the charter requirements.

Like my NDP colleagues, I would like this bill to be referred to committee so that witnesses can be heard to give us answers to a number of questions, or at least provide some details on certain points. It would not be acceptable for amendments to the Criminal Code to once again be ruled unconstitutional by the court. It is our duty as parliamentarians to ensure that the rule of law is respected and that section 184.4 is amended in order to comply with the Constitution, the charter and Canadian laws. The benchmarks must be clear.

Needless to say, I have no blind faith in this government. Canadians have good reason to be apprehensive about Conservative privacy bills, because their record in this area is dismal. We must always work on behalf of the public and show respect for the rule of law, the Constitution and the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms. In view of their failed attempt with Bill C-30, that is to be expected. Many Canadians and stakeholders agree.

According to Michael Geist, Bill C-30 may be dead, but legal access is definitely not. He claims that when the government dropped Bill C-30, it introduced Bill C-55 to allow wiretapping without a warrant. He added that although the bill is disguised as a response to last year's Supreme Court decision in R. v. Tse, much of it is lifted from Bill C-30.

He is right. That is why we need to be vigilant. The court established new parameters to protect privacy and we expect this bill to comply with those standards. That is why it must be studied in committee.

[Lysane Blanchette-Lamothe, NDP, Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague for her characteristically impassioned speech.

I would like to ask her a question about the time available to us as parliamentarians to seriously study this bill. My colleague mentioned in passing that there would be 19 parliamentary days available to meet the deadline set by the court. This is somewhat problematic because the court's decision was not handed down only a few days ago, but rather many weeks and months ago—a year, to be precise.

Why then was this bill introduced only 19 days prior to the deadline? Is this not a way of preventing parliamentarians from doing serious work?

[Djaouida Sellah, NDP, Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague for her apt question and her typically perceptive analysis.

As she put it so well, we unfortunately have only 19 working days to examine and analyze this bill. We are of course fully aware that this is the way things are done these days.

Ever since I was elected to the House, this government has done everything in its power to gag members of the opposition and take advantage of its majority in the House. Unfortunately, like my colleague, I deplore the fact that we have only 19 days to analyze such an important bill, one that will affect the privacy of Canadians.

[Alain Giguère, NDP, Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC]

Mr. Speaker, in contrast with Bill C-30, this bill clearly took out the term “peace officer” and replaced it with “police officer” and “other person”.

However, it is not clear who the “other person” is that has the right to use wiretaps. Is it military, immigration, customs or Coast Guard personnel? “Other person” is not defined.

Does my colleague feel it would be appropriate for a parliamentary committee to clearly define who the “other person” is that has the right to use wiretaps under the law?

[Djaouida Sellah, NDP, Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Mr. Speaker, again, I would like to thank my brilliant colleague who, as usual, is trying to find flaws in the bills put before us. And, as usual, he is succeeding.

He is right. That is why the NDP is showing its goodwill and wants to work with the government. We will support this bill so that it goes to committee and so that we can eventually define who these other people are that can use wiretaps.

I hope that the answer will be clear in committee. We will see what happens after that.

[Hélène LeBlanc, NDP, LaSalle—Émard, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank the hon. member for her speech.

I would like her to tell us more about the difficulties we sometimes have in committee. Amendments are often proposed in committee.

Is she confident that the government will listen carefully to us when this bill is examined?

[Djaouida Sellah, NDP, Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to once again thank my NDP colleague for the work she does in the House.

She is always there to ask the right questions. The proof is there: I am being asked questions only by my NDP colleagues. I assume this means that the Conservative members have no interest in the issue before us today.

Like the rest of my colleagues, I certainly have concerns about what will happen to this bill when it gets to committee.

I sincerely hope that our government colleagues will have the decency to properly discuss this issue, which affects the privacy of Canadians, in committee.

[Hélène LeBlanc, NDP, LaSalle—Émard, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I rise in the House today to speak about Bill C-55, which amends the Criminal Code to provide, in response to the Supreme Court’s decision in R. v. Tse, safeguards related to the authority to intercept private communications without prior judicial authorization under section 184.4 of that Act. I would like to mention the four main points included in the bill's summary.

(a) requires the Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness and the Attorney General of each province to report on the interceptions of private communications made under section 184.4; (b) provides that a person who has been the object of such an interception must be notified of the interception within a specified period; (c) narrows the class of individuals who can make such an interception; and (d) limits those interceptions to offences listed in section 183 of the Criminal Code.

I am emphasizing these four points because one would expect to find these clearly defined points in the bill.

I would like to begin with an argument that was already raised by our justice critic and that is the definition of “police officer”. It is important that this term be better defined in committee. The definition has been narrowed. It reads:

“police officer” means any officer, constable or other person employed for the preservation and maintenance of the public peace...

We will have to provide additional clarification. I would also like to point out that the bill in fact updates the wiretap provisions that the Supreme Court ruled unconstitutional. This reminds us of the saga of Bill C-30. Today, we find ourselves in the House with only a few days to study the bill. When the bill is sent to the Standing Committee on Justice and Human Rights, the number of days left to thoroughly study the bill will pose a problem. A timeline more in keeping with the importance of this bill should have been established in order to properly define the notions covered by this bill.

I would also like to mention that it is vital that this bill include mechanisms to provide oversight and accountability for the investigative measures. As I mentioned with respect to the four points, they must be well defined and there must be accountability. As English members say, there needs to be checks and balances.

We also mentioned that this bill must balance the need for surveillance with specific conditions and exceptional circumstances that have been well defined. These measures must only be used in exceptional circumstances. There must also be accountability for the frequency with which this mechanism is used and the methods used to inform people that they have been affected by this type of interception.

Another point must be clarified. I am the industry critic. The Standing Committee on Industry, Science and Technology conducted a study of electronic commerce. We need not look any further to know that our world is ever-changing and that technology is evolving at incredible speed. New technologies are introduced every day. We are surrounded by all manner of electronic devices.

Section 184.4 of the Criminal Code mentions police officers, which, as I said, will have to be defined, because it also mentions “other person”. It states:

A police officer may intercept, by means of any electro-magnetic, acoustic, mechanical or other device, a private communication if the police officer has reasonable grounds to believe that

I see “or other” there. I would like to know what this “other” refers to and what it includes. Industry Canada requested and held public consultations regarding the 700 MHz spectrum auction.

Some points were raised during these consultations. I am referring to the documents written by Chris Parsons, a man who follows everything to do with electronics very closely, particularly since the introduction of Bill C-30. Mr. Parsons—and others; this is public information—pointed out that the people who appeared to testify were asked to talk about providing information through other means, such as the Internet, for example.

I will read what was requested of the participants:

The consultation has asked participants to provide comments on a variety of issues. What I focus on are the proposals revolving around 'lawful intercept' conditions of licensing Canadian radio spectrum. These conditions are addressed in paragraphs...operating as a service provider using an interconnected radio-based transmission facility.

Then, witnesses, people from various associations—in the online sector, for example—asked whether it was realistic to ask them how they do things when the legislation is silent on the issue. Bill C-30 had yet to be examined, so people were wondering. For example, the Canadian Wireless Telecommunications Association said:

The Department’s proposal to replace “circuit-switched voice telephony systems” with “interconnected radio-based transmission facility for compensation,” opens up several additional services to interception requirements, including internet services...

They went even further, saying that it was not up to them to act and that legislation needed to be put in place so they could understand where they stood.

That is why I wanted to mention those points. Bill C-55 is very important in the sense that everything in it must be clearly defined, particularly when it states that an officer may “intercept, by means of any electro-magnetic, acoustic, mechanical or other device, a private communication” while respecting public safety requirements in exceptional circumstances. However, I feel it is very important, as do the people of LaSalle—Émard, that a person's privacy be respected.

That is very important. Oversight and accountability mechanisms must be written into a bill such as Bill C-55.

I believe that the members will agree that these requests are completely fair and justified, especially in the interest of the common good and peoples' rights.