Debates of May 5th, 2014

Opposition Motion--Safeguarding of Personal Information

[Scott Andrews, Liberal, Avalon, NL]

Mr. Speaker, to the member, you are not getting it. This is the information that they are requesting. It is not—

[The Deputy Speaker, Joe Comartin]

Order. I would remind the member for Avalon to address his comments to the Chair. I do not know if I am getting it or not, but I think it is a bit rude to suggest that I am not. Therefore, perhaps you could address your comments to the Chair, not to other members of the House please.

[Scott Andrews, Liberal, Avalon, NL]

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I hear you. I do not know if you get it, but I know the member for Burlington is not getting it when he talks about metadata and how the basic subscriber information is just people's address, phone number, and that. It is also their IP address. He talked about opening that mail from Canada Post and getting into his neighbour's mail. Part of subscriber information and metadata is the envelope, the mail that he just took out of his neighbour's box. He looked at who it came from and who it was going to. That is part of metadata. That is the part of this whole debate that is getting lost on the members of the government. It is metadata. It is not just people's address. We should not coat it over as just being people's address. It is also their IP address, and that information that is on the envelope, whether it is a mail envelope, a phone call, or a phone record. He is missing the point.

My question for the member is this. Would he give up his IP address voluntarily for the House if it is not such a big important piece of information? Does he have a problem with the outside of the envelope being provided as basic subscriber information?

[Mike Wallace, Conservative, Burlington, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I do get it, contrary to the hon. member's question. If the police came to me and asked me who I called and what I said to them, I would be happy to provide it for them voluntarily because I have nothing to hide. I am not sure whether that would happen with my colleague from the other side.

On the voluntary piece, I have no issue with that. However, I do understand that once we get into that, it is important that people have the right to privacy, to say, “No. If you want to see who I've talked to and what we've talked about, if you want to see what websites I'm looking at and the information that I'm passing back and forth using the Internet, yes, you do need, if that's your decision, a warrant to get that information”. That is what is still and continues to be protected under the law.

[Robert Aubin, NDP, Trois-Rivières, QC]

Mr. Speaker, to begin, I would like to say that I have the pleasure of sharing my time with the hon. member for Chicoutimi—Le Fjord.

One day—yes, I said one day—is not really enough time to debate such an important issue. That is why I feel it is so important that the government listen to as many viewpoints as possible, from as many regions of the country as possible, so that it can hear and understand that beyond those telecommunications companies, there are real individuals. Those individuals did not necessarily give permission for their personal information to be shared.

I do not know if it was because the news about the amount of data that had been passed on came as a bombshell, but when I was preparing my speech, I was transported back in time, almost to the days of my youth. Like many MPs in the House, I presume, I had the sublime pleasure of reading George Orwell's 1984, which won an award as one of the best science fiction novels. At the time Orwell was, in a way, telling us about what we are discussing here today.

Since I read the book rather than seeing the movie, I had to imagine the setting myself. I never imagined a setting that looked like Quebec or Canada. I imagined a futuristic world that did not really exist. However, that is exactly what we are seeing with the topic we are discussing today. The fact that, right now, the government does not really know how big a problem this is, what data are being disclosed and the reasons why that is happening makes us think that Big Brother must have lost control somewhere along the way. In the book, things seemed to be a lot more under control. Things were not necessarily being done more intelligently, but they were a lot more under control.

We have often heard the government say how important it is to respect private companies and that the federal government has no business getting involved in companies' internal affairs. That position could make sense ideologically if it was consistently applied, but it seems that what is good for the goose is not always good for the gander.

We have now learned that the Conservative government no longer follows that rule. Not only does it frequently intervene in collective bargaining processes, for example, but it also solicits the support of telecommunications companies in obtaining Canadians' personal information. The Conservatives have been saying that the companies are not required to respond and that if they refuse to provide the information requested, then the government has to get a warrant.

That is all well and good, but I should have a say when it comes to my own personal information. The same is true for all Canadians. The telecommunications company should not be deciding willy-nilly, depending on its mood or which way the wind is blowing, whether it will agree to share my personal information with or without a warrant on the pretext that I have a service contract with that company.

Telecommunications companies have said that they disclosed personal information to the federal government 1.2 million times in 2011 alone. Based on the exponential growth of our means of communication and the huge increase in sales of telecommunication tools, one can only imagine that the 1.2 million instances of disclosure in 2011 have now reached an unimaginable number. However, one thing is for certain: that number is definitely higher than the bar set in 2011.

It is not the government's role to interfere in people's private lives. What is more, this practice has become so routine that one has to wonder whether it is not simply a nation-wide spying system set up for all sorts of reasons. As the employment insurance critic, I also have to wonder about this when I see the type of investigations being conducted by many EI investigators.

This information reveals the government's appalling approach to forcing telecommunications companies to disclose information, often without a warrant, as was mentioned earlier. For a government that claims to respect law and order, this is deeply hypocritical.

What is really happening? On April 29, 2014, the Interim Privacy Commissioner of Canada, Chantal Bernier, revealed that telecommunications companies had disclosed vast amounts of information to government organizations, including the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, the Canadian Security Intelligence Service and the Canada Border Services Agency, as well as to certain provincial and municipal authorities that are unknown and cannot be named. The list would be even longer if we could get the information we do not have.

Information provided to the commissioner's office in late 2011 shows that wireless telecommunications companies responded to 784,756 government requests for information about customers. Surely that all happened very respectfully; surely companies had the right to say no. All the same, the government made 784,756 requests for information about Canadian cellphone customers. Nowadays, there are very few Canadians who do not have a cellphone.

Most of the requests were made without a warrant or judicial oversight. Telecommunications companies have refused to reveal how, why and how often they provided information to government organizations because they say that the government provided no guidelines or specifics about the rules. Somebody must have those answers.

I thought that this debate would help clarify some of these questions. Today, we heard in the news that the Prime Minister's Office was investigating to assess the scope of the problem. This is a huge mess. It is as though chaos has taken over in the departments and everyone is doing what they want, and as though the left hand does not know what the right hand is doing, which means that no one—or virtually no one—is held accountable.

The very first question we have is, why did the government make all of these requests? I do not understand why the government needs so much information. What can it do with all that information? I can obviously understand why certain government agencies or the police would need that information. We heard about that earlier. There are some excellent examples of situations on which everyone quickly agrees, and where information is needed to track criminals. However, it makes absolutely no sense that the government is requiring telecommunications companies to provide personal information on Canadians 1.2 million times a year, possibly without a warrant—and, as I mentioned earlier, probably even more times in 2014 than in 2011.

I want to compare this to the stigma associated with EI recipients, who are treated like fraudsters before their file is even opened. I get the impression that this way of looking at Canadians is becoming more common. The government starts by assuming that people have something to hide. It asks for information and then decide. That is not how it works in a lawful society.

Is the law so permissive that the government has the right to monitor Canadians and to invade their privacy so easily? I would like to learn more about this. Unfortunately, the government has not provided any clarifications today. If it wants to track Canadians, it needs to have a good reason. If it has one, then it should go about things the right way and enact legislation. If that is not the case, we will have to find better ways to protect Canadians' privacy and personal information from the government's prying eyes. Without specific legislation, anything goes. I do not think that is how the rule of law works, nor do I think it is how a democratic government should operate.

What this motion is calling for today is quite simple and totally reasonable. We are calling on the government to listen to the Privacy Commissioner. Already we have a problem, because this government is not in the habit of listening to commissioners, but that is what we are asking for nonetheless. Commissioners are impartial officers of Parliament who provide a neutral perspective on situations and deserve to be heard, not to mention listened to. We are therefore calling on the government to listen to the commissioner and make public the number of disclosures made by telecommunications companies at the request of federal departments. We are calling on the government to tighten the rules governing the disclosure of personal information without judicial oversight and to update the privacy protection laws.

The NDP believes that we can effectively prosecute criminals and give them the harshest sentences under the law without treating Canadians disrespectfully, as though they were criminals, and without infringing on their rights.

[Daryl Kramp, Conservative, Prince Edward—Hastings, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I think everyone in the House recognizes the need for a balance between security and privacy. Striking that balance, of course, is an ongoing battle and always be, particularly with the technological changes taking place and that will take place in the future. We are very blessed in that we have a number of levels of scrutiny, whether it is the independent officers, accounting agencies, or everyone from ombudsmen to people who are dedicated to that duty.

As well, we have warrants. Being a person who at one particular point was involved in the judicial field, I can certainly appreciate the necessity and the opportunity on many occasions to use warrants, particularly in trying to find that balance between protecting the privacy of individuals and securing the ultimate protection and safety of our citizens, which to my mind is probably our number one priority as parliamentarians.

To try to put this in perspective, how many other countries in the world require a warrant? I would ask him to be mindful of that, because this could come back on him in a different perspective than he might consider, should he not be aware of this reality.

[Robert Aubin, NDP, Trois-Rivières, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague for that good question. It allows me to talk about something I did not have time to get to in my speech.

Since this morning, I have heard a number of parliamentarians on the government side talk about this notion of balance. I admit that I have great difficulty with that because when we talk about balance, we mean the two sides of the scale. For the scales to be balanced, each side must have equal weight. It is like saying there are just as many reasons to request personal information without a warrant as there are to request personal information with a warrant, but that is not true.

We have to put in place privacy protection and make exceptions where necessary. I think everyone can agree on that. However, everyone will also understand that we are not in the process of balancing the scales and that the times when it is acceptable to obtain personal information without a warrant will be the exception, not the rule based on a balance that we must find.

[Carol Hughes, NDP, Algoma—Manitoulin—Kapuskasing, ON]

Mr. Speaker, once again my colleague is quite right: the Conservatives are headed in the wrong direction.

This government is providing more access to Canadians' personal information, not just to the United States, but to just about anyone, even mayors. That does not make sense. Telecommunications companies are receiving an increasing number of requests. Personal information must be protected.

We have already heard in the House that a Canadian was refused entry to the United States because of a past mental illness, even though he did not have a criminal record. That is happening more and more and that is what worries us.

Could the member comment on that?

[Robert Aubin, NDP, Trois-Rivières, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague for her interesting question which echoes the case of one of my constituents.

A citizen of Trois-Rivières was refused entry to the United States because of information that he had never provided. He came to my office and the first question he asked was where had that come from and who had gained access to his medical file. I am not certain this is the case in every situation, but it is obvious that the disclosure of personal information and people's files is a growing problem.

On the Internet, you can look up an address or telephone number using Canada 411. However, I have the impression that an increasing number of organizations, including mayors and customs officers, now have an “Ottawa 11” that gives them a citizen's complete background. That is completely unacceptable because very often the information is completely unrelated to a criminal record or any kind of offence that should be disclosed.

[Dany Morin, NDP, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I am troubled by the Conservative government's behaviour. I do not know what people think of a Big Brother state, but personally, I am very worried about a state like that controlled by the Conservative government opposite. The government has a long record of acting unethically and cheating during elections. I am not comfortable with the government using the tools it has to invade people's privacy.

People might remember that former minister Vic Toews introduced a bill that would have done basically the same thing we are talking about today: spy on people to find out what they are doing on the Internet. We were criticized for opposing that bill. Mr. Toews even said that we were siding with pedophiles. What an utterly reprehensible thing to say.

Canadians are not stupid. Overall, they obey the law. People in other countries think we are good people, even naively nice people.

The government is collecting information about our lives without a mandate and without judicial or police authority, regardless of what kind of legal activities we are engaged in. It is important to point out that, so far, no Conservative member has shown that charges or convictions have resulted from most of the 1.2 million government agency requests for Canadians' private information. That makes me wonder if the government even sent requests to my Internet service provider, Vidéotron, to spy on me.

We know that this government likes to divide and demonize its adversaries. Just think of all those who opposed the proposed pipelines that could result in environmental disaster. They consider anyone who opposes the pipelines to be environmental terrorists, which is simply appalling. That worries me.

I think that people at home should also be wondering whether the government has made confidential inquiries about them.

We, as MPs, do not ask, but when the authorities who are tasked with protecting Canadians' privacy ask the government or the nine Internet service providers what happened, how much data was shared and if they can get the details, those Internet service providers keep silent. Only three of the nine Internet service providers gave the Privacy Commissioner information about the number of requests made by the government and its agencies.

I have a lot of questions. There were 1.2 million requests for personal information; that is a lot of Canadians. Why were those people targeted? For what reason? There is still a lack of transparency. We still do not know why those requests were made.

Members on the other side of the House of Commons are saying that it was to put criminals in jail or identify cases of fraud. Normally, when the police or the RCMP investigate, they have the tools they need to conduct a proper investigation and avoid creating a Conservative Big Brother state.

The government says that there could be cases where a person's life is in danger. We know that, luckily, the RCMP is able to intercept, via the Internet, a message of distress from someone who wants to commit suicide. I can understand why, at that point, they do not get bogged down in the details and request a warrant. There is not enough time. The federal government has a good relationship with Internet service providers, so police can act quickly and save the life of someone in distress.

I doubt that the Conservatives would have us believe that 1.2 million Canadians wanted to commit suicide in 2011. That is not the only statistic we have. However, for 2011, the federal government and its agencies made 1.2 million requests to access information from Internet service providers.

These companies provided the government with responses 784,756 times. We conclude that for some requests, the Internet service providers did not provide any results. In the meantime, as I was saying earlier, only three of the nine Internet service providers wanted to talk about the number of requests they received from the government. If we apply the rule of thirds and extrapolate, we can therefore say that the number of requests made by the government is somewhere in the millions.

That is why the NDP felt the need to move a motion today. My colleague from Terrebonne—Blainville is doing excellent work to try protect people's privacy from the Conservative government.

Let us be honest. I get the impression that we are increasingly in the “far web” instead of the “far west”. The Conservative members across the way are comfortable with the idea of the far west, but to them, the “far web” is version 2.0.

That is why I am proud to support my colleague's motion, which I find quite reasonable. I hope that my Conservative colleagues will vote in favour of the following motion:

That, in the opinion of the House, the government should follow the advice of the Privacy Commissioner and make public the number of warrantless disclosures made by telecommunications companies at the request of federal departments and agencies; and immediately close the loophole that has allowed the indiscriminate disclosure of the personal information of law-abiding Canadians without a warrant.

I do not see what could be controversial about this motion. In light of how the Conservatives have been talking about it, I get the impression that they will vote against it.

I think it is important to note that law-abiding citizens are not subjected to investigations without a warrant. There were problems after the events of September 11, 2011, all over the world and in the United States and Canada. People would show up at the border only to be turned away for reasons that were unclear. People wonder how border officials had access to that information, and that is very concerning.

For anyone watching at home who just turned on their TV and who is wondering what we are talking about, we are talking about the absurdity of disclosing private information on Canadians to government agencies 1.2 million times.

On April 29, 2014, Interim Privacy Commissioner Chantal Bernier revealed that telecommunications companies had disclosed astronomical amounts of data to government agencies, including the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, the Canadian Security Intelligence Service, the Canada Border Services Agency and certain provincial and municipal authorities. For example, telecommunications companies said that they had disclosed personal information to the federal government 1.2 million times in 2011.

I want to talk about IP addresses, which have come up a lot in the debate today. This address is like our identification card or business card when we are on the Internet. Every time a person goes on the Internet, whether it is via a computer, laptop or cellphone, they leave a stamp with an IP address on each site they visit. This information is also shared with the Internet service provider.

This means that when someone uses the Internet and does anything they legally have the right to do, a file is generated on their activity. Unfortunately, if the government can analyze and compile this information, this is a huge invasion of privacy, and I am very concerned about that. I think we deserve better than that in Canada.

I hope that the government will backtrack and allow people to live in peace.

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Minister of State (Western Economic Diversification)]

Times have changed, Mr. Speaker. We have seen how we interact with each other and with the world around us. This has changed with the Internet and with the way that we do business.

As my colleague mentioned, when people leave their footprint online, they are visible. He makes it seem like the government is somehow hacking into our personal information.

What does he think happens when he goes on Google? How does that little Google search button know what he is looking for? How does it predict what is in his mind with respect to what he is searching for?

When he goes to Wikipedia to make a change, why does it track our IP address?

The point I am trying to make is that there is also an onus on us to be aware much as we would have been in years gone past. We should be aware of who we are calling, where we are physically.

First, could my colleague comment on our government's get cyber safe initiative, which aims to educate people on how to act online? Second, given that basic subscriber information is restricted to that narrow scope of focus that my other colleagues have talked about today, could he name one other jurisdiction in any western country where a warrant is required to get basic subscriber information? Could he delineate between the use of the government on that as well as Google or Amazon.ca and if we should perhaps step into that territory as well?

[Dany Morin, NDP, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague for her many questions. I will not have much time to answer all six questions, but I will answer the first one. I will answer the rest if I have the time.

When we use search engines such as Google or Bing, and our information is corrected, we make the choice to use them. That is a big difference. When the Government of Canada investigates us, as indicated by the 1.2 million requests made in 2011, we do not have a choice. Essentially, it is a question of free will.

I personally have much more faith in Google than in the Conservative government. In fact, I would prefer to vote for Google rather than for the Conservatives in 2015.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Winnipeg North, MB]

Mr. Speaker, I was somewhat surprised by the minister's question. It is almost as if the Conservatives are telling people what they should be looking at on the Internet or participating in on the Internet. I will have to reread exactly what the minister said.

It is important to realize that the Privacy Commissioner is an officer of the House. In 2011 she submitted an inquiry, and we have now found out that over 1 million requests went out which affected close to 800,000 Canadians. The government is trying to give the impression that these requests were all through warrants, but that is not the case. Thousands of names, addresses, and who knows what else are being released. We do not know what is being done with that information after it is received.

A litany of questions could be asked with regard to all the information that is provided, such as what happens when it is collected, what kind of safeguards are there. Maybe the member could comment on that.

[Dany Morin, NDP, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Mr. Speaker, although my Liberal colleague has a valid question, he is being smug.

The previous Liberal government and the current Conservative government both decided to take no action for many years. I have a very concrete example. The Privacy Act, which is supposed to protect Canadians' personal information and to ensure that the government is accountable for it, has not been updated since 1983, and predates the Internet, Google, email, Facebook and Twitter. That covers the Liberal and Conservative tenures.

The Internet existed when the Liberals were in power, but they, too, did nothing. As for the Conservatives, they prefer not to protect people. In 2015, Canadians who want to protect their privacy will have only one viable option: to vote for the NDP.

[The Deputy Speaker, Joe Comartin]

It is my duty, pursuant to Standing Order 38, to inform the House that the questions to be raised tonight at the time of adjournment are as follows: the hon. member for Saanich—Gulf Islands, The Environment; the hon. member for Windsor West, Canada-U.S. Relations; and the hon. member for Thunder Bay—Superior North, The Environment.

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Wild Rose, AB]

Mr. Speaker, before I begin, I will indicate that I will be splitting my time with the hon. member for Kootenay—Columbia. With his experience as a former police officer, I certainly look forward to hearing his perspective on this issue. Of course, I also welcome this opportunity to add my own voice to the debate today surrounding electronic surveillance and privacy. I will indicate, as well, that I will be opposing the motion put forward by the NDP member for Terrebonne—Blainville.

When Canadians hear that law enforcement and intelligence agencies are asking telecommunications service providers for customer data, a reasonable question to ask is what these agencies are looking for. How can we know that the government is balancing the need for tools for law enforcement with the rights of citizens to not have their privacy unduly interfered with by the state? That is a reasonable question. The answer, of course, is that oversight mechanisms are in place to ensure that both telecommunications service providers and law enforcement and intelligence agencies stay within the boundaries of the law in that regard. In my time today, I will look at two excellent examples of how accountability and transparency sit at the very forefront of our government's activities.

First and foremost, every year the Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness tables the annual report on the use of electronic surveillance That is tabled in Parliament so that all Canadians can read for themselves how law enforcement agencies are using interception, one of the key electronic surveillance tools, to assist in criminal investigations.

This annual report is an important accountability tool. It paints a clear picture of when and why law enforcement and intelligence agencies are requesting authorization from a judge for a warrant in order to intercept communications. It includes information, such as the number of applications made for authorizations, how many are granted and refused, and a general description of the methods of interception used, along with plenty of other information. This is a transparent and fully accessible reporting function that our government fulfills under Canadian law.

Another example of transparent action is the comprehensive response that Public Safety Canada provided to written Question No. 233, which was tabled on March 24 of this year. The member for Terrebonne—Blainville requested that Public Safety Canada and its portfolio agencies provide thorough data on when and why law enforcement and intelligence agencies are requesting information from telecommunications service providers. Again, with this response being tabled here in Parliament, it is open and accessible to all Canadians to better understand how these agencies are requesting and using electronic data.

In fact, the government's response to Question No. 233 provides a comprehensive look at how law enforcement and intelligence agencies work and why they need to request information from telecommunications service providers. The response provides clarity on what has unfortunately become a clouded debate about what is happening with the personal information of Canadians. In his response, the Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness was clear: public safety agencies work within the strict confines of Canadian law to strike an appropriate balance between privacy rights and public safety.

It is helpful to look at the information provided by these agencies, as it helps to further clear up any misconceptions that are being put forward by the opposition parties and the media.

First, let us look at the Canada Border Services Agency. For the year ending March 31, 2013, the CBSA made 18,729 requests for basic subscriber information from service providers. Again, to be clear, this basic subscriber information only identifies who the individuals are, including things like their name, address, phone number, email address, or IP address, and nothing more. The CBSA is authorized to make these requests when border services officers believe that the information is necessary to support an investigation into contraventions of legislation that the agency is responsible for enforcing.

Next is the Canadian Security Intelligence Service, or CSIS. CSIS carries out a complex and serious mandate. Its job is to investigate and advise the government about suspected threats to our national security.

Because today's world functions online, our intelligence agencies must also function online in their investigative work. Usually that means that CSIS would make requests to the telecommunications service providers for basic subscriber information. In some instances, this basic information is not enough. In the face of a serious national security threat, the service can go to a judge to request a warrant for electronic surveillance or intercepting private communications.

However, no matter what the situation, CSIS conducts its activities in full accordance with the law. Indeed, it is subject to a number of checks and balances when doing its work. This includes full and independent review by the Security Intelligence Review Committee, as well as a review by the Privacy Commissioner, the Auditor General, and other officers of Parliament.

Finally, I would like to turn to the RCMP. Police, of course, must have the proper tools at their disposal to investigate criminal activities. Those criminal activities are increasingly taking place online. These activities run the full gambit, whether they are trying to bust a drug gang or human smuggling ring, investigating a threat of physical violence, or trying to identify anonymous child predators who are distributing child abuse images on the Internet. That is to name just a few examples. Police need access to basic subscriber information to do this critical work, to keep Canadians safe from these criminal activities. In some cases, this is the only avenue to advance a criminal investigation.

For the most serious cases, the RCMP may make application before a judge for an interception authorization under part 6 of the Criminal Code, to access real-time content of private communications, such as emails and phone calls. However, in doing so, the RCMP must first demonstrate that it has exhausted all other investigative avenues. Furthermore, the RCMP reports on its use of interception authorizations through the aforementioned annual report on the use of electronic surveillance in Canada.

The RCMP's collection and use of information gathered during investigations, including basic subscriber information, is scrutinized for compliance with the Constitution during the trial stage. If the information is not collected in a lawful manner, the trial judge could exclude the evidence.

These are just a few key examples of how our government is responding to the concerns of Canadians on why and when law enforcement and intelligence agencies are requesting information. Canadians can rest assured that our Conservative government will continue to work to ensure an appropriate balance between giving police the tools they need to do their job and protecting the privacy rights of Canadians.

We will also work to ensure that we keep criminals behind bars, where they belong. That is why we have introduced more than 30 tough-on-crime measures since coming to office. Unfortunately, the NDP has obstructed and opposed virtually all of these important measures. Canadians know that when it comes to important issues of public safety, only our Conservative government can be trusted.

[Charmaine Borg, NDP, Terrebonne—Blainville, QC]

Mr. Speaker, there seems to be a lot of confusion about what an IP address is. Everyone is saying it is just an IP address. Well, an IP address can tell a lot about a person. In some cases, it could tell where someone has been, what they are doing, which computers they have logged into, and which Wi-Fi ports they have logged into. If I sign into different Wi-Fi ports all day long, someone can see where I have been all day long.

My question for the member opposite is, can he give me the definition of an IP address?

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Wild Rose, AB]

Mr. Speaker, obviously what the member is trying to get at is the idea that this could be the basic information that must be provided.

When law enforcement agencies and others are requesting other information, when they seek to intercept communications or to have access to private communications, obviously in those cases there is a need for a warrant.

Probably the best way that I can respond to the concerns that the hon. member is trying to raise would be the quote from a spokesperson from Bell. They indicated:

Bell will only provide law enforcement and other authorized agencies with basic 411-style customer information, such as name and address, which is defined as non-confidential and regulated by the CRTC [...] Any further information, or anything related to an unlisted number, requires a court order.

When we read that, it is quite clear that we are talking about basic subscriber information. When we are looking at the ability to intercept communications by law enforcement agencies and others, of course there is a need for a warrant to be obtained for that.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Winnipeg North, MB]

Mr. Speaker, going back to 2011, the Privacy Commissioner put in a request, and we found out that there were 1.2 million requests for private information. Those were without warrants, of course.

The member made reference to Canada border control, saying that there were 18,000 and something requests from that one organization. He did not say how many requests that CSIS has put through, nor the RCMP.

I would be interested in knowing if he has that information. That would be valuable to the debate.

Could he also provide us with any indication of who else there is? Out of that 1.2 million requests, we know that 18,000-plus came from Canada Border Services Agency. What about the other million-plus requests? Can he provide us with that sort of breakdown? Further to that, what is done with the information once it has been collected by the party requesting it?

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Wild Rose, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I do not have the exact figures at my fingertips, but I will reiterate what I have already indicated to help reassure the hon. member. There is a process. All government agencies that request information must follow the law, follow that process.

We are talking about basic subscriber information, a name and address, the kinds of things that are publicly available, in many cases on 411. In order for someone to have access to private communications, et cetera, and in order for the agencies to request that, there must be a warrant obtained.

I hope that will reassure the hon. member regarding some of the concerns he has identified. In order to get anything other than basic subscriber information, there is a need for a warrant.

[Elizabeth May, Green, Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC]

Mr. Speaker, since the member's position was made very clear, I suspect that he will be voting yes to this motion. If there really are no disturbing warrantless access requests, there would be no reason not to accept the advice of the Privacy Commissioner and to make public any number of warrantless disclosures.

I am encouraged that the hon. member plans to vote for this resolution.

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Wild Rose, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I am not sure what speech the member was listening to, but certainly in the speech I gave, I indicated I would be opposing the motion and the reasons for that.

I would encourage her to listen more closely in the future.

[David Wilks, Conservative, Kootenay—Columbia, BC]

Mr. Speaker, It is a pleasure to rise today and highlight the measures our government is taking to protect the privacy of Canadians.

As members of this House are aware, the Personal Information Protection and Electronic Documents Act, PIPEDA, has been in force since 2001. I would like to focus my comments on one area in particular, and that is the role of the Privacy Commissioner of Canada in promoting compliance with PIPEDA and increasing accountability among organizations that collect, use, or disclose personal information.

First, let me begin with a bit of an explanation of how the act works when it comes to compliance. Under PIPEDA, the Privacy Commissioner serves as an ombudsperson. Individuals who feel their personal information has been improperly handled by an organization have the right to complain to her office.

The commissioner has the power to investigate, enter premises, compel evidence, mediate a settlement, make recommendations, and publish the names of those who contravene PIPEDA. In short, the privacy commissioner investigates complaints and works with companies to make sure they comply with the act for the protection of all Canadians. The commissioner has a range of powers, but as an ombudsperson, takes a co-operative and conciliatory approach wherever possible. This encourages the resolution of complaints through negotiation and persuasion.

At the conclusion of an investigation, the commissioner releases a report of findings that outlines whether or not the organization in question has contravened the act and whether or not the complaint was resolved. This report also includes notice of any action taken or proposed to be taken by the organization. It may also include reasons why no action was taken.

Under PIPEDA as it now stands, the commissioner or individuals can apply to the Federal Court for a hearing on any matter related to the original complaint within 45 days of the commissioner's report. The court has the authority to order the organization to change its practices. The Federal Court can also award damages to Canadians when their privacy has been violated and they have suffered from some form of harm as a result. That is how compliance currently works.

However, as technology has evolved, we as members of this House must ensure the commissioner is able to hold organizations more accountable for their handling of personal information for the protection of Canadians and their privacy. It is for that reason that our government has proposed increased power to enable the Privacy Commissioner to better do her job. It is clear from the remarks from the Privacy Commissioner of Canada that our government is on the right track.

Before our government tabled Bill S-4, she said, “I welcome proposals...” in this bill. This bill contains “...very positive developments for the privacy rights of Canadians”.

We work with the Privacy Commissioner of Canada, we protect the best interests of everyday Canadians and we make sure that we move forward to modernize our digital privacy laws. This is why we are proposing this bill, which includes three important changes to keep companies accountable when dealing with Canadians' personal information.

First, we want the commissioner to have the authority to negotiate compliance agreements.

Second, we want to extend the length of time the commissioner or individuals have to bring matters before the court. Instead of the very limited time of 45 days, we would extend that timeframe to one year.

Third, we want to give the commissioner greater power to name and shame organizations that are breaking the rules.

Let me describe each of these changes in a bit more detail.

Going to court to resolve a dispute can be costly both for the organizations implicated and the Office of the Privacy Commissioner.

A compliance agreement is a powerful tool that provides an alternative to taking an organization to court. These are voluntary but binding agreements between the commissioner and the organizations that recognize they need to take action to improve their privacy practices.

These agreements benefit both sides. They can provide an organization with certainty and clarity about what specific steps they need to take, and a specific timeline to ensure they are compliant with the rules. These binding agreements also give the organization the certainty that it will not face court action by the commissioner—

[The Deputy Speaker, Joe Comartin]

Order.

[Charmaine Borg, NDP, Terrebonne—Blainville, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to point out one thing. We are not debating Bill S-4 right now. We are debating the opposition motion moved by the NDP, which specifically calls for transparency measures when it comes to the 1.2 million instances of disclosure of personal information. We are also asking that the government close the loophole in the legislation.

This really has nothing to do with Bill S-4. I am certain that we will have the opportunity to debate the bill and I will be pleased to participate in that debate, but now is not the time to do that.