Debates of Nov. 24th, 2020

Official Languages

[Élisabeth Brière, Liberal, Sherbrooke, QC]

Mr. Speaker, our government and public servants are taking proactive measures to ensure respect of our two official languages. We react quickly and firmly to compliance issues and remind federal institutions of their official languages obligations. Our government took note of the recommendations made by the Commissioner of Official Languages in his report and we are fully committed to responding to them in a constructive and co-operative manner.

The Environment

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Mr. Speaker, it was my privilege to ask a question in the House a few weeks ago about the trucking industry and how it relates to environmental policy.

One thing that we can all agree on is that most Canadians are at the point where they believe that some plan is needed and that some actions need to be taken to help our environment and to reduce the amount of greenhouse gases we have. There may be disagreement on exactly what to do, but people would more or less agree that something needs to be done.

It was interesting to see Bill C-12 introduced by the government, a bill that had no plan and no targets. It was missing a lot of things, including consequences. If there were targets that were missed, there were no consequences for that in the bill. I found it ironic that the government has been unable to achieve the targets that Prime Minister Harper set years ago for 2030. The government is not on track to hit those targets either.

The trucking industry is significant in our country. Transportation accounts for about a quarter of the greenhouse gases produced in Canada, and of that quarter, the trucking industry produces a significant amount. Therefore, the trucking industry is a key player when it comes to reducing greenhouse gases in Canada. Roughly 90% of our goods travel by truck at some point in their lifespan. Ten million trucks cross the border every year between Canada and the United States, so there is a significant number of trucks on the road and they produce a significant amount of greenhouse gases.

As I spoke to members of the trucking industry, they were very much interested in playing a role in looking forward and developing future technologies and future plans to reduce the amount of carbon from trucking in the environment. Decarbonization of the trucking industry is what they would say. They would like to be a part of it. They would like to be at the table discussing plans for this. They know that, for their industry to succeed in the future, they are going to have to make changes and they want to be a part of those discussions. What they are asking for is to have a task force of engine manufacturers, the government, environmental groups, trucking industry players and drivers, all the players together around the table, coming up with a plan and a strategy for how to decarbonize the trucking industry going forward.

A few weeks ago, at the environment committee, I asked Marc D'Iorio, director general of energy and transportation at the Department of the Environment, if there were any plans to have a task force such as this. He said, “I'm not aware of direct work to create a working group. However, there are a number of measures being considered”, and he went on basically to say that they are going to come up with a plan and then they will tell others what it is.

I asked him to clarify. I said, “Are you saying that there have been no discussions to create a working group to get industry players in line with this, no efforts to get all of the people at the table to help develop these types of regulation?”

He said, “Not that I'm aware of.”

I asked the same question of the Minister of Environment and Climate Change, and his answer was that “obviously there is a need for consultation”, but that there was no plan for that.

When we come up with something as important as a plan for reducing carbon in the trucking industry, it is important that all the players have a role to play, that all the players' input is gathered and considered, and that a good plan is developed, because we have to make sure, not only that we reduce greenhouse gases but that the plan is workable. It has to allow industry to survive and produce its service at a price that is going to work and that customers will be able to pay. If government goes in and just creates regulations and dumps it on the industry, that is going to be a problem.

Therefore, I would hope that the government would see this and see the logic of getting all the players at the table up front to develop a plan together, so that everybody has a say in it and a good plan can be developed. Then we will have no need to rework the legislation later.

My question for the government is the same question: Is the government planning to have a task force made up of all these industry players as it develops regulations for the trucking industry?

[Chris Bittle, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Transport]

Mr. Speaker, it is unfortunate the hon. member asked us to prepare a response to a question on the air sector and then came with a question on the trucking industry.

I find it ironic that the hon. member wants to talk about the environment. His party has brought no effort to the table to address climate change. I appreciate that he and his party are finally taking an interest in reducing greenhouse gases. He knows we are the party that put a price on carbon pollution. His party wants to make it free to pollute.

I know the transportation industry is eager to move forward to decarbonize, and the minister is more than willing to discuss with all sectors of the industry, from the air sector to the trucking sector, and shipping. We have made announcements across the various areas of transportation and I know that, as a government, we are focused on significant investments. We have invested heavily, as a government, in public transit infrastructure and made historic announcements. The last Parliament alone, there was $70 billion toward our environment plan.

It is disappointing to see the hon. member talk about the environment. I really hope that he moves forward and he encourages his party and his leader to move forward on a credible plan for the environment, because we have not seen that yet.

I would like to thank the member for the opportunity to speak to the question. As such, we are more than willing to discuss with the trucking industry, and we are more than willing to have discussions on the environment. We have had a credible plan so far. We will continue to move forward and we look forward to working with various sectors of the transportation industry across the board.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Mr. Speaker, it is interesting that the member would be disappointed that I would be talking about the environment. I think the environment is something we care about on all sides of the House, and Conservatives, if members look back in history, have a very strong record on the environment. I also find it ironic that the Liberal government has been unable to put a plan in place to achieve even Prime Minister Harper's standards for 2030, which were set many years ago.

It is an interesting conversation. However, I would reiterate that it is one thing to set a plan and then hope that everybody can achieve it, but it is a far better strategy to get all the players around the table. I would encourage this government to follow through on that, to speak to everybody and get them around the table, so that when plans are developed, they are workable for industry and they achieve the goals that they set out to achieve. It is my insistence that the government look at this task force concept with the trucking industry.

[Chris Bittle, Liberal, St. Catharines, ON]

Mr. Speaker, it is rich that the hon. member talks about meeting targets, when his party has voted against every major effort to meet those targets and develop programs to meet those targets.

Of course, we will meet with industry. Of course, we will look for better ways to meet those targets and exceed those targets. Canadians want clean air and clean water, but one would not know that by looking at the Conservatives' track record.

COVID-19 Emergency Response

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

Mr. Speaker, it is an honour and privilege to rise again, after over 40 times now, to stand up for small businesses, the unsung heroes of the COVID-19 pandemic, which closed their doors to protect public health.

We were glad to see the government finally fix its flawed, broken commercial rent program that was landlord-driven to make it tenant-driven, but we are extremely disappointed that the government will not backdate it to April 1. Many of these businesses are in arrears with their landlords or riddled with debt, yet the government refuses to go backward, even though it knows that most of the businesses are in deep trouble, especially with the second wave. The Minister of Finance and Deputy Prime Minister said the government is moving forward, but that debt is moving forward with small business owners, who did not get any help.

I want to talk about the businesses that were completely left out: start-ups. There is a whole subset of businesses that did their part, started up and closed their doors for public health. However, any of them that opened after March 1 or later and closed their doors for public health, or were ready to open after March 15, were prevented from getting any of the programs. This is totally unacceptable, and I want to talk about a couple of them.

Graham Hafey opened V2V Black Hops Brewing, down in Langford. He is a veteran. He served in the Canadian military and used his life savings to open a for-profit social venture where part of the profits go to helping veterans with PTSD. He has already donated $6,500, but he has not gotten any help through the commercial rent program or the wage subsidy, and has not been able to access the loan program. His business is looking at going bankrupt. We are in the middle of the second wave and it has closed its doors, because of the health order from Dr. Bonnie Henry, to protect public health. He is getting no help.

Another constituent of mine, Lisa Jaster from Courtenay, owns The Lost Faucet sauna house. She opened in February 2020. She cannot get the CEBA loan and has paid thousands of dollars to contractors. She does not have a fighting chance without any support. She has been completely abandoned by the government.

I am thinking about my colleague from Victoria, who has been fighting really hard for Peter Wood, who owns Bear & Joey Cafe in Victoria. He put his life savings into developing this business. He opened in March and has been doing takeout. He has 30 staff members. Now B.C. is in the second phase of the lockdown and he is paying $11,500 a month in rent. He cannot get any help from the government. His business has been abandoned, like many businesses across this country.

These businesses actually have the ability to demonstrate that they are genuine and have invested in small business through presenting one or more of the following: proof of loans and financing, proof of long-term leases and contracts for building and construction. They often demonstrate that they are going to be impacted by the second wave by comparing revenue from one period to another, because some of them have been open for several months now. However, with the winter months ahead, they have had to reduce capacity or close their doors. They are demonstrating, post-2020, that they are operating at a loss and are not going to be able to keep their staff.

The sense of urgency for these businesses could not be greater. Why is the government abandoning them? It is unfair. These businesses have invested in our communities in our country and they are job creators. The government need to step up to the plate. We have solutions and we want to work with the government. We hope it will do something to support these small businesses.

[Sean Fraser, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Finance and to the Minister of Middle Class Prosperity and Associate Minister of Finance]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my hon. colleague for his intervention on behalf of small businesses in Canada.

To break from my prepared remarks for a moment, let me first extend my empathy to the business owners he mentioned who are struggling in his own community. He can rest assured that I am having similar conversations with businesses and have been having them from the outset of this pandemic.

However, the suggestion, implicitly or explicitly, that we have abandoned small businesses is disingenuous in the extreme. The hon. member knows that to help keep Canadians safe, we decided to make it more affordable for businesses to do the right thing and shut down or reduce traffic through their premises.

We did through Bill C-9, which just received royal assent a few days ago. It extends the wage subsidy to next summer and, importantly, creates the new Canada emergency rent subsidy. This is going to provide a subsidy of up to 65% to businesses that have lost revenue as a result of this pandemic and up to 90%, with the additional lockdown support, to those that have been ordered to close as a result of a public health order.

With respect to the wage subsidy, it is contributing directly to help 3.8 million Canadian workers stay on the payroll. It does not just help them keep getting paid. It also helps their employers retain and rehire them if they had to furlough them to make ends meet throughout this pandemic.

We have advanced the Canada emergency response benefit, which self-employed people were eligible for. It has helped keep food on the table for nine million Canadians. We have advanced the Canada emergency business account to provide interest-free loans, partially forgivable loans, and we are now increasing them from $40,000 to $60,000, up to $20,000 of which will be forgivable.

The reality is that we have done what we can to meet many needs of many businesses. We have even established the regional relief and recovery fund for businesses that did not qualify for some of the supports I mentioned.

While I appreciate fully that the hon. member has the best of intentions in trying to defend the small businesses in his community, I do not believe it is appropriate, and in fact I think it is ludicrous, to suggest our government has abandoned small businesses, as we have launched more support for them than any other government in the history of our country.

Small businesses should know they have a friend in our government. We have been there for them from day one of this pandemic and we will be there for them until it is over.

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I have a lot of respect for the parliamentary secretary, but clearly the government is tone deaf. He did not hear what I had to say. Small businesses that started after March 15 have been abandoned. They have not been able to access the wage subsidy. They have not been able to access the loan program. They have not been able to access the commercial rent program, even the new one. Even Bill C-9 does not help those businesses. They have been completely abandoned. He needs to address what the Liberals are going to do for them.

We kicked and screamed so the wage subsidy would go from 10% to 75% and so the Liberals would fix the commercial rent program and expand the CEBA program. The member can count on me to be kicking and screaming until they fix their programs to help support the start-ups that have been completely abandoned by the government. I will be back here tomorrow and will be back here the week after. Until the government helps them, the New Democrats will be in their corner.

The Liberals need to stop patting themselves on the back and start doing things to fix these broken programs so the people who need the help the most get it.

[Sean Fraser, Liberal, Central Nova, NS]

Mr. Speaker, we have been listening to feedback from Canadians from the very beginning. The hon. member drew attention to the fact that when we listened to stakeholders we increased the wage subsidy from 10% to 75%.

With respect to the emergency business account, we have increased the threshold from $40,000 to $60,000, and widely expanded eligibility. With respect to the Canada emergency rent subsidy, we have now changed the program to make it tenant-oriented, with a direct application to make it more accessible.

We are going to continue to listen to how these programs can be improved. In fact, we have made adjustments to some of them to help new businesses that initially did not qualify on the basis of a year-to-year comparison so they could compare their revenue with that from earlier months, pre-pandemic, in the same year.

It is a challenging thing to help businesses through the pandemic, but we are going to continue to listen to small business stakeholders so we can implement policies that will save as many businesses as possible and allow many workers to remain on the payroll so they can put food on the table for their families.

[The Deputy Speaker, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

Pursuant to an order made Monday, April 20, 2020, and Standing Order 81(4), the motion to adjourn the House is now deemed to have been withdrawn and the House will now resolve itself into committee of the whole to study all votes under Department of Fisheries and Oceans in the main estimates for the fiscal year ending March 31, 2021.

I do now leave the Chair for the House to resolve itself into committee of the whole.

[For continuation of proceedings, see part B]

[Continuation of proceedings from part A]

(Consideration in committee of the whole of all votes under Fisheries and Oceans in the main estimates, Mr. Bruce Stanton in the chair)

Fisheries and Oceans—Main Estimates, 2020-21

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

Today's debate is a general one on all votes under Department of Fisheries and Oceans. The first round will begin with the official opposition, followed by the government, the Bloc Québécois and the New Democratic Party. After that, we will follow the usual proportional rotation.

Pursuant to order made earlier today, within each 15-minute period, each party may allocate time to one or more of its members for speeches or for questions and answers.

In the case of speeches, members of the party to which the period is allocated may speak one after the other, but the time allocated for speeches must not exceed 10 minutes. The Chair would appreciate it if the first member to speak in each period would indicate how that time will be used, particularly if the time will be shared.

The order also specifies that, when the time is used for questions and answers, the minister's answer should approximately reflect the time taken by the question. I would note here that the Minister of Fisheries and Oceans will be joining the debate remotely. As such, there will be pauses from time to time for connecting to the debate. In addition, the Chair will receive no quorum calls, dilatory motions or requests for unanimous consent.

I also wish to indicate that in committee of the whole, comments should be addressed to the Chair as they always are in normal debates in the chamber. I ask for everyone's co-operation in upholding all the established standards of decorum, parliamentary language and behaviour.

We will now begin tonight's session.

The House in committee of the whole, pursuant to Standing Order 81(4), consideration in committee of the whole of all votes under Department of Fisheries and Oceans in the main estimates for the fiscal year ending March 31, 2021.

The hon. Leader of the Opposition.

[Erin O'Toole, Conservative, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Chair, this Parliament has been gripped by the disputes over the fishery in Atlantic Canada and in Nova Scotia. This is important to all Canadians and to rural communities. This is why I am proud that we have chosen the minister to provide direction on what the government is doing to resolve a crisis to provide for an indigenous fishery, but also to ensure that the lifeblood of rural communities in Nova Scotia and Atlantic Canada are preserved.

I am going to start with a question for the minister.

Every time someone in the House rises, it is a special occasion to represent one's constituents. Perhaps the most special moment for most members is their maiden speech, the first time a new MP gets to speak in the House of Commons and what the member uses that opportunity for.

What was the minister's first speech in the House of Commons as a new MP?

[Bernadette Jordan, Liberal, Minister of Fisheries]

Mr. Chair, when I was first elected in 2015, my maiden speech, I believe, was on how proud I was to represent my community, and that still stands today. As the member for South Shore—St. Margarets, it is extremely important to me and I will continue to do the best I can to represent my community.

[Erin O'Toole, Conservative, Durham, ON]

Mr. Chair, the member's first speech was on the lobster fishery. She said:

The south shore of Nova Scotia is world renowned for the quality of its lobster, and this industry is vitally important to the sustainability of many rural communities, as well as to the greater provincial economy.

What has the minister been doing to sustain the rural fishery in those communities?

[Bernadette Jordan, Liberal, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

Mr. Chair, I apologize to the Leader of the Opposition. I am afraid my Internet cut out while he was asking his question and I did not hear it. Is there any way I could have him repeat it, please?

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

Absolutely. I will ask the hon. Leader of the Opposition to repeat his question.

[Erin O'Toole, Conservative, Durham, ON]

With pleasure, Mr. Chair. It is important for the minister, indeed all members of the government, to reflect on her passion in her first day as a member of Parliament on December 7, 2015.

Part of the minister's remarks then were:

The south shore of Nova Scotia is world renowned for the quality of its lobster, and this industry is vitally important to the sustainability of many rural communities, as well as to the greater provincial economy.

What has the minister done in 15 months to sustain the fishery, the lifeblood of those rural communities?

[Bernadette Jordan, Liberal, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

Mr. Chair, there have been a number of measures that we have taken to ensure we are addressing the fishery and to ensure we are sustaining it for the long term.

During COVID-19, we invested close to half a billion dollars in the fish harvester benefit and grant program, which delivered financial support to self-employed harvesters across the country, who have been facing hardships brought on by COVID-19. This special program was initiated to address the needs of harvesters who could not access federal funding. It was actually the only program that was delivered for a specific industry because it was extremely important that fish harvesters had what they needed.

We are also investing in the Atlantic fisheries fund, the Quebec fisheries fund, the B.C. SRIF fund. We are also ensuring that money is available for processors—

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

The hon. Leader of the Opposition.

[Erin O'Toole, Conservative, Durham, ON]

Mr. Chair, in her 15 months as minister, how many direct meetings has the minister had with commercial fisheries groups in Atlantic Canada?

[Bernadette Jordan, Liberal, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

Mr. Chair, I continue to meet with commercial harvesters on a regular basis. I have been doing that since I was first appointed as Minister of Fisheries and Oceans. I will continue to do that.

I have met with harvesters from right across the country, not just in Atlantic Canada. It is an extremely vital role that I have the conversations with commercial harvesters. That is something I continue to do—

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

The hon. Leader of the Opposition.

[Erin O'Toole, Conservative, Durham, ON]

Mr. Chair, I am looking for the number of meetings with commercial harvesters in rural Nova Scotia.

[Bernadette Jordan, Liberal, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

Mr. Chair, I have met continually with harvesters from Atlantic Canada, from rural Nova Scotia, over the last year since I have become the Minister of Fisheries and Oceans. I will continue to do that. It is vitally important that we hear what their needs are and that we address them.