Debates of Feb. 7th, 2020

Royal Canadian Mounted Police Act

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the President of the Queen’s Privy Council for Canada and to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, when we think of the CBSA, we often think about that long border between Canada and the United States, where many of our fine civil servants do fantastic work 24 hours a day, seven days a week. However, we also have other border control officers, such as those at our airports. We have 12 or 13 international airports in Canada. Winnipeg is home to one of those.

We get, on average, about 2,500 complaints a year, which is significant. We want to treat them seriously, and this is why it is important to have an oversight committee.

Can my friend and colleague provide her thoughts on the fine work that our border control agents do, whether they are on the border or at our international airports?

[Marie-France Lalonde, Liberal, Orléans, ON]

Mr. Speaker, as I was saying I am so proud, and we should all be very proud, of the enormous work that our CBSA employees, over 14,000 of them, do.

We talked about 14 airports and 117 bridges. We have the largest aspect in the world of protecting our borders, and we have to say thank you, because in Canada we all want Canadians to be safe. That is what we are striving to do. I thank those employees for all of the exceptional work that they are doing every day.

[Dan Albas, Conservative, Central Okanagan—Similkameen—Nicola, BC]

Mr. Speaker, it is always an honour to participate in a debate in this chamber.

Also on many occasions, as we have come to expect in this place, it is not uncommon for members of the official opposition to debate in opposition to a government bill.

I am afraid that will not be the case today. I am participating in the debate on Bill C-3, an act to amend the Royal Canadian Mounted Police Act and the Canada Border Services Agency Act and to make consequential amendments to other acts. I will support this measure.

I have been asked why, as a member of the opposition, I would participate in a debate on a bill that I support.

It is a fair question. The answer, from my perspective, is why I am here today to take part in this debate.

For my first term of office I was elected in a riding that is very close to the U.S. border. Some parts of the riding I currently represent are a very short car ride to the Canada-U.S. border.

As other members of this place will know, when one's riding is either very near or includes a Canada-U.S. border crossing, one will deal with some significant and challenging border issues.

I want to share one of these challenging border issues with the House.

Not long after I was first elected, the provincial MLA in my region contacted me, a newly minted MP. The priest at a temple in the area, who legally lives in Canada, had gone on a weekend jaunt to the United States.

Upon return to Canada, at the Canadian border, the priest was detained for a period of time before ultimately being released with a seven-day deportation order.

The reason given by the Canada Border Services Agency for the deportation order was that the priest was not legally living in Canada. There was a problem, however. For whatever reason, the officers dealing with the priest that day wanted nothing of it. The MLA who had first been alerted to the situation tried to intervene on behalf of the priest.

To put it bluntly, that member of the Legislative Assembly of British Columbia was blown off. When the issue hit my desk, there were just four days before the deportation. From reviewing the paperwork, it was very clear an injustice had occurred, but what was the recourse? Where was the accountability?

It was, from my perspective, an alarming situation.

Because his paperwork had not been reviewed, because he had been issued a deportation order without a valid reason, and because I find it very troubling that power was being exercised with no oversight, I ended up sharing my concerns directly with the minister at the time.

From my experience, I have come to know that there are those ministers who run their departments, and there are also those ministers who are run by their departments. Fortunately, the minister at the time knew that department inside out and had the courage to tell the department they had made an error.

An injustice was remedied and the deportation order was cancelled. I am proud to announce that the priest is still in Canada and that he is now serving the city of Merritt. His family is proud of his new country. I am not here to take the credit. If anyone should get the credit it is the provincial MLA who reached out to me and is now retired.

Of course I will fully credit the minister for not hiding behind the department, as some ministers are prone to do.

While ultimately this was a quiet, good news story at the time, there was one further bit of troubling information for me.

I learned that the CBSA officers involved in this case were able to change the facts afterwards. In other words, the facts were changed after the incident. They were changed in such a way that the reasons for the deportation order were completely different than the reasons given initially. Although I am pleased with the outcome for the priest, the matter is engraved on my memory. I often wonder about this situation.

What would have happened if this man was not a fairly well-known priest who called his MLA for help?

What would have happened had the MLA refused to help him and said that it was a federal jurisdiction?

What would have happened if the MLA was a member of the opposition party?

At that time, I was on the same side of the House as the government. What if the minister in question was one who hid behind the department, as some like to do?

We could make many other assumptions, but practically none would result in a situation where justice is served.

I think we all know that there never really has been serious accountability at the border crossing, and this applies to both sides. Will this bill be the answer?

It is difficult to say. We shall see.

We all know that, if the bill passes, the public complaints review commission would be created and would incorporate the existing Civilian Review and Complaints Commission, the review agency for the Royal Canadian Mounted Police. This would be a large oversight body with two different mandates between the RCMP and CBSA.

Given the challenges in the very complex review process of the RCMP, it remains to be seen how adding CBSA into the fold would work. However, this process deserves the opportunity to attempt to succeed.

There is no question in my mind, and from what I have heard today from many in this room, that more accountability is needed at border crossings. While I do not mean to belittle us as members of Parliament, we cannot always hope that a member of Parliament is the solution for incorrect events that occur at the border.

For these reasons, I am prepared to support this legislation. I believe the legislation is a reasonable and needed effort to provide more accountability for what occurs at our border crossings.

I appreciate your presence today, Mr. Speaker, and I appreciate all the members of this great House, and I would like to thank them for listening to me so intently. I look forward to hearing both their questions and comments, and hopefully we can share something to the benefit of the Canadian public.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the President of the Queen’s Privy Council for Canada and to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, I suspect there are members who could reflect on files we have seen over the last number of years and find someone who has had a very unfortunate encounter, some far more serious than others, at one of our border control areas or with one of our border control agents. That is in good part why it is important we do this, and I do not think anyone is objecting to it.

We already have it in place for our RCMP, our correctional service officers and CSIS. Would the member agree that having these public oversight review groups assists in restoring public confidence in the system?

[Dan Albas, Conservative, Central Okanagan—Similkameen—Nicola, BC]

Mr. Speaker, absolutely, it is the job of every member of Parliament, particular those in the executive, to build confidence in all of our institutions. Canada is made greater when our public, our citizens, believe that the authority that has been entrusted through Parliament to these agencies is handled with trust and care.

I am assuming most of us have gone across the border into, for example, the United States. I must admit that my heart rate begins to go a little faster at the border, not because I have done anything wrong, but because I am subject to a process that is beyond my control.

If we can merge two processes into one, creating efficiencies and gaining public confidence that there is civilian oversight, then I think it is an idea worth supporting.

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to start by congratulating my colleague from Central Okanagan—Similkameen—Nicola for the excellent French he used in his speech. I think we can applaud him.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh!

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

We know that it is intimidating to speak in a language other than one's mother tongue in the House. I find that my colleague makes a great effort to speak French outside the House.

I would like to know why it is important to him to speak French and to use that language to communicate with Canadians.

[Dan Albas, Conservative, Central Okanagan—Similkameen—Nicola, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I thank the hon. member from Quebec for his question.

It is important to me to speak confidently with other members of the House. I believe that the experience of other members is important. We share our ideas with one another in a respectful manner. That is important to me.

My father grew up in Alberta. He was a Franco-Albertan. It is a part of my family history. I appreciate the congratulations from the hon. member, and I will endeavour to keep speaking French.

[Anita Vandenbeld, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of National Defence]

Mr. Speaker, I am very grateful today to have the opportunity to debate Bill C-3, which would create an independent oversight body, the public review and complaints commission, to review CBSA officers' conduct and conditions and handle specific complaints. This body would be a welcome addition to the strong accountability and oversight bodies already in place.

As I have seen, the bill has broad support in the House. I welcome the previous speaker's support and also that of the hon. member for Medicine Hat—Cardston—Warner. He said:

Public servants across the country must be held to the standards expected of Canadians, which is to uphold the integrity of people who are visiting or passing through our country, while ensuring our laws and international laws are upheld.

He went on to add, “This bill will align well with the values of many Canadians” and the values of his party's team.

I also welcome the comments from the member for Rivière-du-Nord, who expressed his gratitude for the bill being introduced. Likewise, the member for St. John's East provided supportive words, noting that his party would certainly be supporting the bill at second reading.

This multipartisan support is very encouraging, and I thank all members for helping to ensure the bill is as strong as it can be moving forward.

One thing that all members of the House agree on is the quality of the work that our border service officers do at the CBSA. The CBSA processes millions of travellers and shipments every year at multiple points across Canada and abroad.

Let us just look at some of the numbers. I know they have been mentioned in the chamber already in this debate, but it warrants repeating: 97 million travellers, 27 million cars, 34 million air passengers, 21 million commercial releases. Every day at 13 international airports, 117 land border crossings, 27 rail sites and beyond, CBSA officers provide consistent and fair treatment to travellers and traders.

This is particularly important because, as we know, travelling can be very stressful. For those who are more vulnerable, for asylum seekers, for those who do not speak either of our official languages, for those with disabilities, for those on the autism spectrum and for travellers who are travelling for the first time, it can be intimidating and even frightening to cross a border point.

As the Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness has said, the CBSA officers' professionalism when dealing with people crossing our borders is of the utmost importance. He has said that they are the most public of public servants, and they truly are the face of Canada.

For visitors, newcomers or Canadians returning home, our border officers are their first encounter. However, much more than that, they are responsible for upholding the integrity of Canada's borders. That means their work is integral to Canada's well-being. We are at a junction where border management and enforcement are truly front and centre for the government and for Canadians.

Nearly one year ago, the government introduced a federal budget, proposing investments of $1.25 billion for the CBSA. That funding includes support to modernize some of our land ports of entry and border operations, with the goals of ensuring efficiency and enhancing security. Members will recall that budget 2019 provided funds to close this important gap.

The idea has been to expand the Civilian Review and Complaints Commission, or the CRCC, to act as an independent review body for the RCMP and the CBSA. That is why the government introduced Bill C-98 last year, which received all-party support at third reading. It is why we are now introducing Bill C-3, with more time for debate and discussion. This bill aligns well with our commitment to accountability and transparency.

Under the proposals, the PCRC would handle reviews and complaints for both CBSA and the RCMP. Whether the complaints are about the quality of services or the conduct of officers, the PCRC would have the ability to review, on its own initiative or at the request of the minister, any non-national security activity of the CBSA. The PCRC would be available and accessible to anyone who interacts with the CBSA or RCMP employees and who seeks recourse. That includes Canadian citizens, permanent residents and foreign nationals, including immigrant detainees. The commission would investigate and offer its conclusions as to whether procedures at the border are appropriate or not.

These proposals would bring the CBSA in line with the rest of our security agencies, including CSIS and the RCMP, which are currently subject to independent review.

These accountability functions for border agencies are common in our peer countries and this bill would help us join that group. All of us would like to ensure that the public can continue to expect the world-class treatment the CBSA provides.

The CBSA has worked to ensure it has the resources and infrastructure in place to support this new review board. It already holds its employees to a high standard of conduct, and I am confident it will continue to uphold that standard.

As I have mentioned, this is coming at a time of renewed focus at our border. The agency is operating in a complex and dynamic environment. It must be responsive to evolving threats, adaptive to global economic trends and innovative in its use of technology to manage increasing cross-border volumes. Let us remember that some of those threats and trends are some of the greatest challenges facing parliamentarians and Canadians today.

The opioid crisis continues to pose a serious threat to the safety of Canadians, for example, and the CBSA plays a key role in detecting opioids at the border through new tools and methods. We have also seen rising rates of gun and gang violence in recent years. Again, the CBSA is front and centre here, remaining vigilant in combatting the illegal smuggling of firearms. It is keeping pace with rising volumes in the supply chain, including the growing prevalence of e-commerce. It is central to our economy and to our country's overall prosperity and competitiveness. It is undertaking all of this hugely important work in an environment where its clients demand a high level of accountability and transparency.

The professional men and women at our borders would be well-served by an independent review function for the CBSA. Canadians deserve it as well. That is why I encourage all members to join me in supporting Bill C-3 today.

[Randall Garrison, NDP, Esquimalt—Saanich—Sooke, BC]

Madam Speaker, I share the member's sentiments about the fine work the CBSA does most of the time and about how this bill would enhance public confidence in the CBSA.

I have tried to raise several times with government members who were in the last Parliament the issue of Bill C-23 from the last Parliament, the new Preclearance Act, which created a situation where U.S. border officials would be exercising similar powers of detention, questioning and even use of force against Canadians on Canadian soil, without any accountability or complaint mechanisms in place for the actions of those U.S. officers in treating Canadians on Canadian soil.

Is the member not concerned that we have created a new category where there is no accountability for the actions of those officials?

[Anita Vandenbeld, Liberal, Ottawa West—Nepean, ON]

Madam Speaker, I can assure my colleague that any officers who are operating on Canadian soil are subject to the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms and anything they do has to be in full compliance with the Canadian Charter of Rights.

[Tom Kmiec, Conservative, Calgary Shepard, AB]

Madam Speaker, I was listening to my colleague's speech. Bill C-3 is being brought forward early in this Parliament.

Could the member explain her thoughts about the opportunities that will exist at the committee level to bring in actual border guards, and I do not mean union representatives, I mean individuals who will be using the rules herein, to have their voices heard and does she think that would be a good idea?

[Anita Vandenbeld, Liberal, Ottawa West—Nepean, ON]

Madam Speaker, as the hon. member knows, a committee is able to bring in any witness it sees fit. A broad debate on this and hearing all different voices is incredibly important. I would imagine that the members who are on that committee will look at that as well.

[Larry Maguire, Conservative, Brandon—Souris, MB]

Madam Speaker, I would like to follow up on my colleague's comments in regard to the 117 various points that the CBSA is involved with across the country.

Could the member elaborate on that? We have had a lot of differentiation between the activities that take place in different border crossings across Canada, and they are not all along the border? There are airlines and those sorts of things as well.

We are all in favour of seeing those people come to the committee, as indicated, but what can the member do in her role to enhance that and are there any select areas of importance on which it needs to focus?

[Anita Vandenbeld, Liberal, Ottawa West—Nepean, ON]

Madam Speaker, a lot of those priorities will be set by the committee members.

As the member mentioned, there are 117 land border crossings. There are 27 rail crossings and all of our international airports as well. This is a large issue.

Also, I want to take this moment to reiterate the professionalism of the CBSA agents at these border crossings. With this incredibly large volume, obviously this is of major concern. I think we are all interested in making sure that is made better for both travellers and Canadians.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the President of the Queen’s Privy Council for Canada and to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Madam Speaker, it is always a pleasure to rise in this place and ask a question following a member's comments or speech.

My colleague was complimenting the fine work our border control agents do, day in, day out, seven days a week, 24 hours a day. When we look at the need to have a public oversight committee, I think it is important to emphasize that while there are approximately 2,500 complaints cases a year, our border control agents have millions of interactions that every year.

I wonder if the member can provide her thoughts on the large number CBSA agents deal with versus the number of actual complaints, as well as the importance of providing a process for those complaints.

[Anita Vandenbeld, Liberal, Ottawa West—Nepean, ON]

Madam Speaker, there are a small number of complaints, but every single day, day in, day out, there are heroic stories.

I recall the story of a 12-year-old minor who was travelling alone from Burundi and coming through the Ottawa airport. Her mother said that her daughter had never seen an escalator before and she was unaccompanied.

It was absolutely heartwarming to hear how our border services people, and everybody involved, were able to make sure that 12-year-old, who was alone for the first time in a foreign country, was able to find and be reunited with her mother. Every one of us has stories like that.

[Nelly Shin, Conservative, Port Moody—Coquitlam, BC]

Madam Speaker, it is an honour for me to stand in the House today to give my maiden speech.

I would like to thank my constituents in Port Moody—Coquitlam, Anmore and Belcarra for electing me and allowing me the privilege to serve as their member of Parliament.

I would like to thank my volunteers for knocking on thousands of doors through pouring rain and sweltering heat, and walking up many flights of stairs and steep hills to help me be here today. I am also grateful to my campaign chairs and managers, our EDA and generous donors for their incredible support.

From the idyllic Como Lake to the deep cedar forests of Anmore, the misty blue and green of Rocky Point and the pastel sunrises of Bedwell Bay, I am blessed to be part of a caring and diverse community that lives in the midst of breathtaking natural beauty.

As I was door knocking during my campaign, constituents expressed their concerns on affordability, housing, home ownership, bureaucratic red tape that hinders businesses from thriving, better access to mental health care, employment, the environment, infrastructure and many more issues. Today I want to renew my commitment to my constituents to keep working hard and do my best to ensure their needs are heard and dealt with.

I am blessed because of the prayers and encouragement of friends who cheered me on to the finish line and who continue to nourish my soul on this political path. I would like to thank my parents for their unconditional support and the values of sacrifice, perseverance and hard work they instilled as I watched them struggle to settle into Canada as first-generation immigrants. I would like to thank my sisters for their support as we continue to journey closely together through thick and thin.

I am here today because of the people who shaped me, the circumstances I have lived through, the choices I have made and a measure of providence. In 2008, after seven years of working for the public school system, I came to a crossroad very much like the one alluded to in Robert Frost's The Road Not Taken. I was grateful for the opportunities I had every day to make a positive impact on my students as a high school English and music teacher, but I felt a longing to explore more of what life had to offer.

My hunger for greater purpose and meaning in life compelled me to leave my permanent job and sell my home. I was then ushered into a wilderness journey of living within limited means, serving the hurting and the marginalized, and learning about the complexities of the human condition as I served as a missionary in different urban centres. I found myself listening to a lot of stories from the homeless, impoverished families, young drug addicts and adult survivors of childhood trauma. My heart broke and expanded as I came to a better understanding of the depth of human suffering, the cycles of dysfunction and the power of hope. I found joy in serving. I discovered that my life work is to help restore people's lives.

I am here today as a member of Parliament to continue working through the life assignment I discovered in the wilderness. I come with a vision of individual and national prosperity and filling in the gaps to make that vision possible.

I am grateful to be serving with a dynamic team of MPs and leaders in Her Majesty’s loyal opposition. I am coming to love each member as a brother or a sister. As a pianist, composer and supporter of the arts, I am particularly grateful for my appointment as deputy shadow minister of Canadian heritage. My view of the Canadian heritage portfolio is to strengthen the patriotism and unity of our diverse nation through the cultural institutions of our country. I look forward to the work I will be doing with the Hon. Minister Steven Guilbeault; shadow minister, the Hon. Steven Blaney—

[The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Alexandra Mendès), Liberal, Alexandra Mendes]

The member cannot use member's names in the House.

[Nelly Shin, Conservative, Port Moody—Coquitlam, BC]

I apologize, Madam Speaker. It was a rookie mistake.

I look forward to working with ministers and my colleagues across the aisle on this unique and dynamic portfolio.

When I look around this room at other members, I see passion for people and passion for causes. Whether or not we share the same views, we are all here because we have a part in a greater purpose. That greater purpose is to serve the people of Canada and their well-being, and to steward well the land we live on. I value the role of different political parties as important parts of a greater ecosystem to prune, refine and balance our mandates as lawmakers.

I hope we will always look to the people we serve as the heartbeat of our work and do so with the integrity, common sense and unity that Canadians expect of us and deserve. So many times at the door my constituents expressed their longing to see the parties working together for the greater good. They say more would get done.

I trust the 43rd Parliament we are serving in will provide ample opportunities for us to hit the reset button on Canadian politics and build a culture of honour that allows public discourse to unfold in a safe manner that allows transparency and constructive discussions to thrive.

On that note I would like to thank the Liberal government for bringing forward Bill C-3 for consideration. I support the bill because issues pertaining to the protection of Canadians in our communities is of great importance.

From what I have learned, Bill C-98 was introduced in the 42nd Parliament and reintroduced in our current session with slight modifications as Bill C-3. Bill C-3 proposes to repurpose and rename the Civilian Review and Complaints Commission for the RCMP to the public complaints and review commission.

I would like to thank the RCMP and CBSA members for their service of hard work to protect Canadians.

Public servants across our nation must be held to a standard to uphold the integrity of people who are visiting or passing through our country, while ensuring our laws and international laws are upheld. Therefore, an oversight agency, as used by police services across our nation, including the RCMP, is agreeable and long overdue.

Budget 2019 proposes to invest $24.42 million over five years starting in 2019-20, and $6.83 million per year ongoing, to expand the mandate of the Civilian Review and Complaints Commission for the RCMP. It is good to know that a budget has already been allocated.

Where I would like more certainty is on the efficacy of how the government will implement Bill C-3 in practice.

Oversight is a good thing. People need assurance that there is someone who will be able to look into actions that are not consistent with the law. The implementation of the bill should not be another expansion of bureaucracy. The public complaints and review commission should have investigative powers and the ability to review situations, provide feedback and determine the course of action and its scope and scale with anyone who violates our laws.

Bill C-3 would provide a mechanism for complaints about inappropriate actions by border officers. Police agencies have had civilian oversight and review for decades. It is common practice around the world to provide mechanisms for overseeing law enforcement.

However, to my knowledge, the bill is not clear on how officers who violate the law, code or principle will be held accountable. It is only clear that the public complaints and review committee can examine evidence, call witnesses and write a report.

Without clarity on how the officers will be heId to account, we run the risk of creating bureaucracy that appears to provide a mechanism of assurance for Canadians but that, in practice, will not resolve the issues addressed.

While I support this important legislation, I look forward to seeing how the House and the committee will examine the bill with proper scrutiny to provide certainty that it will be a bill that will be very practical and steer us toward just actions and resolutions, rather than giving the appearance of protection to Canadians.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the President of the Queen’s Privy Council for Canada and to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Madam Speaker, I want to compliment the member for sharing with us what brought her to this place and some of her background. It was delightful to listen to and I very much appreciate her story.

My question is about something the member said towards the tail end of her speech when she made reference to standing committees. This legislation will ultimately go to a standing committee, and that will be an interesting process in itself for all new members. Good ideas often come out of committee. Amendments will be brought forward with the idea of trying to improve the legislation.

Does the member have anything on her mind that she would like to see modified within the legislation as it is now, or does she support the legislation in general? It seems all parties support it in general.

[Nelly Shin, Conservative, Port Moody—Coquitlam, BC]

Madam Speaker, I very much support this bill. My comments have to do with giving it the proper dialogue, research, conversations and, as the member said, perhaps even innovative, creative ideas that may come to the table to ensure that it is bulletproof.

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

Madam Speaker, I want to point out that the member is the very first Korean-born Canadian member of Parliament to ever serve in this House. I congratulate her. It is also remarkable timing that she is giving her maiden speech the very week that we heard of her Liberal Party predecessor's massive number of breaches of the code of ethics continuing with the party.

I would ask the member to comment more fulsomely on some of the issues she heard at doors while she was going through her area in the Lower Mainland.

[Nelly Shin, Conservative, Port Moody—Coquitlam, BC]

Madam Speaker, I thank my colleague for his kind remarks.

When I was door knocking, some of the things I already mentioned in my speech had to do with affordability. Many of my constituents are struggling because the cost of living on the west coast is very high. The mortgage stress test has made it very difficult for first homebuyers and even those who are renewing their mortgages because of the stringency. The opioid crisis impacting young people has raised great concern for parents. Many people care about the environment, especially on the west coast where the beauty of our landscape and resources is a huge part of our lives and culture. There are other issues pertaining to mental health. I have met parents who have lost their children to drug addiction and some are roaming around East Vancouver.

Those kinds of issues came up and I look forward to opportunities to address some of those things. I have already done so on the opioid crisis. I look forward to collaborating with all members of the House on helping to bring resolutions to those issues.