Debates of May 15th, 2023

Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation—Main Estimates, 2023-24

[The Chair, Conservative, Chris d'Entremont]

I just want to make sure everybody keeps their comments down.

The hon. leader of the official opposition.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Mr. Chair, we have established that on the American side house prices are roughly half of what they are on the Canadian side. I have asked why multiple times. It cannot be population; they have 10 times the people. It cannot be land mass; they have less land than we do. The answer is that government gatekeepers block construction. He claims he is doing something about that, but he has been in this role and his Prime Minister has been in this job for eight years. If they were going to solve the problem, they would have by now, but everything is worse.

Will the minister tell us, how much is the cost of red tape and taxes for the average unit of housing in the city of Vancouver?

[Ahmed Hussen, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

Mr. Chair, we are witnessing the biggest gatekeeper in this House. He has voted against every measure to build more supply, to support homebuyers and to build affordable housing. He talks about the gatekeepers and red tape. Why did he vote against the housing accelerator fund, a $4-billion program to do precisely what the leader just mentioned, which is to help municipalities increase their capacity to build housing of all types for all families and individuals in Canada?

Their record is voting against all and somehow doing less on housing and magically hoping the problem will take care of itself. We are doing everything we can, despite their opposition to everything we are doing.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Mr. Chair, it costs roughly $600,000 for red tape alone in the city of Vancouver, and what has that minister done as a consequence? He has shovelled more billions into the coffers of municipal red tape gatekeepers.

Our proposal is precisely the opposite. We will link the number of dollars a big city gets for infrastructure to the number of houses that actually get built. We will require more housing to be built to get more infrastructure dollars, and we will fine gatekeepers who block infrastructure and block housing. We are going to attach dollars to result, remove the gatekeepers and speed up and lower the cost of building permits in order to get it done and to bring it home.

[Ahmed Hussen, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

Mr. Chair, on this side of the House we believe in the right to housing, and they do not. The leader is two years behind schedule. We introduced the concept of combining infrastructure investments for housing two years prior. We introduced the housing accelerator fund, a program to do exactly what he is claiming he will do in the future, which is to connect infrastructure and also make sure that local policies lead to more housing supply.

[The Chair, Conservative, Chris d'Entremont]

I am going on to the next one in the list, the hon. Minister of Housing and Diversity and Inclusion.

[Ahmed Hussen, Liberal, Minister of Housing and Diversity and Inclusion]

Mr. Chair, I am thankful to be invited to rise in the committee of the whole to speak to the main estimates for the CMHC, the Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation, and to discuss the Government of Canada's priorities for housing, ongoing activities and our plans for the future to give more people a place to call home.

Housing affordability is one of the most important issues to Canadians. Everyone deserves a dignified place to call home.

Everyone deserves a place of sanctuary—

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh!

[The Chair, Conservative, Chris d'Entremont]

Order. Members can take their conversations outside while we are in committee of the whole.

The hon. minister.

[Ahmed Hussen, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

Mr. Chair, everyone deserves a place where they can raise their family, plan for the future and belong to a community. Unfortunately, families across the country are struggling with the rising cost of living, especially the rising cost of housing, both for homeowners and for renters.

Housing is a basic human need. It is also an economic necessity.

Our economy is built by people, and people need homes to live in. In other words, investing in housing is good social and economic policy. That is what the Government of Canada has been doing since 2016. With each successive budget, we have made major housing investments, including launching Canada's first-ever national housing strategy. This comprehensive, $82-billion, 10-year plan will ensure hundreds of thousands of Canadians have a place to call home, particularly for those most in need, and it is succeeding by addressing housing affordability from every possible angle.

The greatest part of the strategy, the greatest driver of affordability, is creating more housing supply and building more homes around price points to make housing more affordable, whether someone is a renter or a homeowner. Unfortunately, in many parts of the country, we are seeing a housing supply shortage, and we need to build more homes for our growing population.

According to research by CMHC, we need to build 3.5 million homes by 2030 to achieve affordability. This is above and beyond the current rate of construction. That is why, in budget 2022, we made housing supply a top priority. Budget 2022 introduced initiatives that will put our country on the path to double the rate of housing construction and meet Canada's housing needs over the next decade. That is why we included measures to build on that momentum in budget 2023.

A new initiative that I am especially excited about is the housing accelerator fund. This $4-billion program will help local governments cut red tape and build the housing that we need. This summer, we will start to receive proposals from local governments that increase housing supply and align with federal priorities to create dense, affordable and inclusive communities.

This multi-year initiative will remove barriers to the construction of new housing at the municipal level.

It will help cities and towns reduce their backlogs and get more shovels in the ground faster. It will create an estimated 100,000 new housing units in the initial phase and lead Canada to doubling housing construction. We will work closely with our municipal, provincial and territorial partners to develop this initiative, and I am confident that it will bring a much-needed systemic change that will make a long-lasting difference.

In addition to this fund, we are also reinvesting in proven programs that are making a difference, like the rapid housing initiative. This program was created in the early stages of the pandemic to respond to the urgent needs of those experiencing homelessness or those who are at risk of experiencing homelessness. The first two rounds of the rapid housing initiative exceeded expectations and are quickly creating more than 10,000 permanent, deeply affordable housing units. Now we are investing another $1.5 billion over two years to extend the initiative, and this is expected to create over 4,500 new deeply affordable housing units, with 25% of those units dedicated exclusively to women-focused housing.

The national housing co-investment fund is another program that has built or renovated more than 300,000 affordable housing units for Canada's most vulnerable people. Our government has advanced $2.9 billion in funding under this fund. We also aim for the fund to become more flexible and easier to access, allowing for the creation and renovation of 21,000 affordable rental units for Canadians who need them the most.

We have also reallocated $500 million from the co-investment fund to launch a new co-operative housing development program. Co-operative housing projects will also receive support through the $1 billion in loans reallocated from the rental construction financing initiative. We are working closely on this program with the co-operative sector, a sector that has, for decades, played an important role in providing affordable housing in communities across the country.

While building new housing is critical to housing affordability, so is modernizing some of Canada's aging rental housing. Some of the programs I have already mentioned address this issue.

Now, we are about to launch a new program that will make all new rental buildings more energy-efficient and affordable to operate. It will also extend their lifespan. Ensuring that we create more housing supply is only part of the equation. We have also introduced measures to protect homeowners from unfair practices like blind bidding or being forced to waive inspections. For example, we are working with provinces and territories to jointly develop a homebuyers bill of rights, backed by federal investments of $5 million over two years.

We are also directly supporting low-income Canadians by providing rent assistance through a one-time top-up to the Canada housing benefit.

Recently, to support low-income renters in these challenging times, we have provided a $500 payment via the one-time top-up to the Canada housing benefit. Another very important initiative is Canada's homelessness strategy, reaching home, which supports the most vulnerable. The Government of Canada is investing nearly $4 billion over nine years, a doubling of the funding under this program. The program supports communities in establishing coordinated access. This is an integrated, systems-based approach that prioritizes people most in need of assistance and matches individuals to appropriate housing and services in a streamlined and coordinated way.

Reaching home is having a significant impact. In its first three years, it has funded over 5,000 projects, which helped place over 46,000 people experiencing homelessness in more stable housing, while over 87,000 people benefited from prevention and from shelter diversion services. These temporary spaces during COVID were also put in place when shelters had to reduce their capacity to ensure physical distancing. In fact, over 214,000 temporary accommodation placements were made to support individuals in need. Reaching home is playing an important role in supporting the national housing strategy's target of reducing chronic homelessness by half by 2027 or 2028. It also contributes to the federal government's commitment to ending chronic homelessness by 2030.

What I have mentioned today are just a few of the many important housing initiatives we have introduced. However, this should give members an overview of the breadth and depth of our commitment to housing. We are leaving no stone unturned in our work to ensure that every Canadian has dignity through calling a place “home”.

Our goal is to foster prosperous communities where everyone can thrive.

I thank members again for their time today, and I am happy to answer any questions they have regarding CMHC's main estimates.

[Darren Fisher, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Seniors]

Mr. Chair, I want to take a moment, if I could, to ask the minister a question. First of all, I wanted to thank the minister for the rapid housing investment. We have seen great successes with the RHI in Halifax and in the Dartmouth area. I have spoken to the mayor, Mayor Mike Savage, in Halifax, and no one really and truly knows more about what to do with the housing money than the municipalities do. I think partnering with them directly has been a real win.

I would like to ask the minister whether there is a way of moving in a more flexible way so that we can work with the municipalities and allow them to be flexible to build what they need with the funds they get.

[Ahmed Hussen, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

Mr. Chair, we know, in Canada, that one of the challenges we face is the lack of an adequate supply of housing. We have the fastest-growing population in the G7, but we have comparatively less housing supply.

One of the keys to unlocking additional housing supply of all types, including affordable housing, but also all the way to home ownership, is to work with local governments of municipalities and regions to increase their capacity to develop systemic changes that would enable them to permit and deliver housing faster. That means investing in their capacity to do more, including in the infrastructure related to housing, but also changing their internal systems to make sure we are permitting and delivering more housing in Canada.

[Mark Gerretsen, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons (Senate)]

Mr. Chair, I can tell the minister and the House that, during my time as mayor in the city of Kingston, there was absolutely no support from the federal government with respect to housing. It was absolutely silent, and it was nowhere to be found. I remember the initiative on the affordable housing development strategy that the Province of Ontario set up, in the absence of the federal government's wanting to be part of that.

However, one thing I find most offensive, which comes from the Leader of the Opposition routinely, is when he refers to mayors in this country as being “woke” mayors or “gatekeepers”. It is not just me and it is not just former mayors who happen to be Liberal. I feel sorry for the member for Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry and the member for Parry Sound—Muskoka, who were also mayors in their communities. Their leader is now going around the country calling all mayors “woke” mayors for not being able to deliver on the needs of Canadians.

I know that the minister has travelled this country extensively, talking to mayors and municipal leaders throughout the country, and has come to Kingston on a number of occasions and met with the mayor of Kingston, even when I was not present in those meetings. I am wondering whether he could inform the House as to how effectively he thinks he might have been able to do that job had he been running around previously calling mayors “gatekeepers” and referring to them as “woke” mayors.

[Ahmed Hussen, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

Mr. Chair, I really appreciate this question, because it gives me an opportunity to talk about the divisiveness of the leader of the official opposition in calling the mayors, the elected officials in this country, “woke”, and denigrating them and calling them “incompetent”.

We need to work with local governments, we need to work with mayors and we need to work with municipalities to increase housing supply, to build more affordable housing and to build more affordable rental units, and that kind of approach will not get one single affordable housing unit built. What it will do is alienate another level of government elected by Canadians to represent their interests.

On this side of the House, what we are doing is working with mayors, increasing their capacity to permit and deliver housing faster and enabling them to make the systemic changes that are necessary, through the housing accelerator fund investment, so that we can have more housing supply in Canada.

[Sukh Dhaliwal, Liberal, Surrey—Newton, BC]

Mr. Chair, first of all, I want to commend the minister for giving us three ample housing projects. One of them was particularly for women at risk.

The minister had meetings with three mayors, including the mayor of Surrey. Surrey is one of the fastest-growing municipalities in Canada, with 1,200 people moving in every month. I wonder how the minister's plan will help mayors, like those he met with, and what the discussions were.

[Ahmed Hussen, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

Mr. Chair, that is absolutely correct. I found the mayor of Surrey, as well as the members of Parliament from the region of Surrey, to be very open to working with our government to meet the needs of all types of housing advocates in Surrey.

Surrey has benefited greatly from the rapid housing initiative. While I was there to announce the third round of the rapid housing initiative in Surrey, I was talking to the current mayor of Surrey about the housing accelerator fund and the opportunities the fund will provide for Surrey and other fast-growing regions and municipalities in Canada that are dealing with the pressures of a lack of enough supply for their fast-growing population. What I found in Surrey and in other parts of Canada is that mayors are welcoming the federal investments under the housing accelerator fund. They lack the capacity to do more. They want us to invest in their capacity to do more, and we will do exactly that, while incentivizing them to speed up their permitting and delivery of housing locally.

[Soraya Martinez Ferrada, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Housing and Diversity and Inclusion (Housing)]

Mr. Chair, what does the minister think is the biggest difference between us and the Conservatives? I want him to talk about fighting for Canadians, defending their right to have a home.

[Ahmed Hussen, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

Mr. Chair, that is a very good question, and it points to the fundamental difference between this side of the House, our government, and the official opposition. The Conservatives do not believe that Canadians have a human right to a dignified place to call home, but we do, and the evidence is there: Whenever we bring investments to the floor of the House to invest in Canadians, they vote against them.

[Denis Trudel, Bloc, Longueuil—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Mr. Chair, I must admit that I am a bit surprised by the rhythm of the conversation this evening, by this sort of rallying back and forth, and I am not sure we have really gotten any answers to our questions. Nevertheless, this is a very serious issue. We have an opportunity, this evening, to discuss with the minister, the person responsible for housing, something very serious that is happening in Quebec and Canada, namely, a severe housing crisis. This is very serious, and it is not a laughing matter. There must be a commitment.

I would like to use my time this evening to have meaningful exchanges with the minister so we can try to find solutions. I want to emphasize the word “solution” because right now solutions are lacking. The minister rightly said that housing is a right. I believe that. I do not know whether the Conservatives believe it, but I believe that housing is a right. It is a right, and I do not think that we are really dealing with that issue right now in Canada and Quebec. We are not able to house the most disadvantaged members of our society. That is a real problem.

Let us do something meaningful. I want our exchange to be constructive. After this 15-minute discussion, I would like us to have some solutions, because at this time, strategy or no strategy, there is a growing number of people in the streets. There are people whose lives were shattered by the pandemic or by something else, and we are not managing to house the poorest in our society.

I had a conversation with an economist at the Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation, or CMHC. I did not have this discussion with some radical left-wing group or something like that. This was an economist at the CMHC who said that in the next 10 years, in Quebec alone, to address both accessibility and affordability, we will need to build 1.1 million housing units. That is what we need to deal with the current crisis. The private sector alone will undertake the construction of 500,000 housing units. This means that in the next 10 years there will be a shortfall of 600,000 housing units that need to be built to give people a roof over their heads and ensure that it is a decent roof they can afford.

What is the plan? What solutions is the minister proposing this evening?

[Ahmed Hussen, Liberal, Minister of Housing and Diversity and Inclusion]

Mr. Chair, the federal government is determined to help Quebeckers find safe and affordable housing. Since 2015, we have invested more than $6.5 billion in Quebec to help more than 45,000 families and individuals secure the housing they needed.

The bilateral agreement between the governments of Canada and Quebec will result in a combined investment of an additional $3.7 billion over 10 years to improve housing conditions in Quebec. That is what federal leadership on housing looks like for Quebeckers. As part of our commitment to end chronic homelessness, we are providing more than $400 million to Quebec. As part of the rapid housing initiative, we are working with the Government of Quebec to invest $563 million to create 3,200 new housing units in the province. We have also announced $9.9 billion through the affordable housing innovation fund to help build or renovate 2,675 affordable housing units in Quebec.

[Denis Trudel, Bloc, Longueuil—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Mr. Chair, I was in Montreal today for an event organized by the United Way of Greater Montreal. All the community housing organizations in the greater Montreal area were there, along with advocates for housing assistance and assistance for families, victims of domestic violence and people with disabilities.

Everyone was at the event, which revealed some really interesting things. Several speakers gave presentations throughout the morning. The two words that received the most applause all morning were “social housing”. All the organizations around Montreal are thinking right now that this is the solution.

As the minister pointed out, we have a supply problem in Canada. Everyone who spoke today emphasized this supply problem in Quebec and in Canada. They all said that one of the most important solutions to provide proper shelter for the most disadvantaged is social housing.

I would like the minister to tell us how many real social housing units have been built in Quebec since the national housing strategy was implemented.

[Soraya Martinez Ferrada, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Housing and Diversity and Inclusion (Housing)]

Mr. Chair, I was in Montreal this morning too. I was there with my hon. colleague opposite. One thing I heard about this morning that I think he would agree with is the issue of social diversity.

Yes, we need to build social housing, we need to build affordable housing, and we need to work on meeting the entire spectrum of housing supply needs, but we also have to address market speculation. We have to keep working on the things we have already started, like banning foreign nationals from buying property here in Canada, and charging a 1% tax on residential buildings and properties in Canada that are owned by non-Canadians. We also have to keep doing more. On that point, we agree.

[Denis Trudel, Bloc, Longueuil—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Mr. Chair, I repeat my question: How many social housing units have been built in Quebec since the national housing strategy was launched?

[Soraya Martinez Ferrada, Liberal, Hochelaga, QC]

Mr. Chair, these are the figures I can give him: Since 2015, investments in the national housing strategy in Quebec have led to about half a million housing units being renovated or built in Quebec.

[Denis Trudel, Bloc, Longueuil—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Mr. Chair, I did not understand the answer. Does that mean half a million social housing units were built in Quebec?