Debates of May 4th, 2023

Opposition Motion—Interference by the People's Republic of China

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Madam Speaker, I believe the Prime Minister and the government will continue to build upon the work that we have already been able to do. We have put in place—

[The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Alexandra Mendès), Liberal, Alexandra Mendes]

I have to interrupt the hon. member.

The hon. member for Cypress Hills—Grasslands has a point of order.

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Cypress Hills—Grasslands, SK]

Madam Speaker, no less than five times today I have stood up in the House and I have asked the member across to apologize to the member for Wellington—Halton Hills for impugning his integrity—

[The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Alexandra Mendès), Liberal, Alexandra Mendes]

The Speaker has made a statement on this matter, and the Speaker will come back to the House.

The hon. parliamentary secretary.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Winnipeg North, MB]

Madam Speaker, as I have indicated, the government has been building and will continue to build upon the work that we have done over the last number of years dealing with election interference and the issues that we have before us today.

We have commissioned a special rapporteur, a former Stephen Harper appointment, the hon. Mr. Johnston, to conduct a report, which could ultimately bring in a request for a public inquiry. Will the Conservative Party of Canada support what the former governor general brings back to Parliament?

[Kerry-Lynne Findlay, Conservative, South Surrey—White Rock, BC]

Madam Speaker, it is true that David Johnston served honourably as our Governor General, but that was before he was chosen by this government to be the overseer of the election debates, and it was before he was named to the Trudeau Foundation as a director, a position he finally stepped down from after there were complaints that it put him in a rank conflict of interest, because the Trudeau Foundation had received $140,000 to $200,000, depending on the reports, from someone attempting to influence the government. That is why we said that it should be someone completely independent of this government, completely independent of the Trudeau Foundation, who would look into any of these matters.

We are calling for a public inquiry now, and they should vote for it.

[René Villemure, Bloc, Trois-Rivières, QC]

Madam Speaker, the Standing Committee on Access to Information, Privacy and Ethics recently heard from the chair of the EU Parliament's committee on foreign interference and disinformation. Raphaël Glucksmann told the committee that China's strategy was to sow chaos in the countries it targets. He also told us that the Chinese ideogram for writing “chaos” is the same as that for writing “opportunity”.

Can my hon. colleague believe that this chaos that has prevailed in this place since the beginning of this week is due to the actions of the Chinese government, which are paralyzing the House and forcing us to react to an extremely serious subject, but which is blocking the work of Parliament on foreign interference?

[Kerry-Lynne Findlay, Conservative, South Surrey—White Rock, BC]

Madam Speaker, because it was so long ago, most people might not know this, but I took my undergrad studies on Communism, so I am quite familiar with how Communism works. The member is absolutely right that it is often a matter of creating chaos and disorganization in a foreign government or in a foreign place that the Communist government wishes to either influence or take over, for that matter. This has nothing to do with it being China; it has everything to do with it being a Communist government that is acting in its own interest and not in the interest of Canada, and the chaos continues.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

Uqaqtittiji, the member talked about trust, and I think we all know in the House that Canadians need to trust their democratic institutions. However, this trust is being broken by foreign actors. That this trust is being broken down is evident in the House, and it is unfortunate that all of this stuff related to foreign interference is causing so much separation and segregation among Canadians.

I wonder if the member agrees that Canadians want us to build trust in our democracy and not tear each other apart.

[Kerry-Lynne Findlay, Conservative, South Surrey—White Rock, BC]

Madam Speaker, I always find the member very thoughtful in the House with her remarks.

Yes, I think trust is lacking. I think there is a lack of trust in this government for the very reasons that we have outlined here today: that it has not taken the steps necessary to create trust and give confidence to Canadians that it is protecting them. It does not matter what category of citizen a person is; we do not have categories in Canada. Whether a person is a newly arrived citizen or has been here for generations or since time immemorial, this government is tasked with our national security and safety, and needs to take it seriously.

[The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Alexandra Mendès), Liberal, Alexandra Mendes]

Order. It is my duty pursuant to Standing Order 38 to inform the House that the questions to be raised tonight at the time of adjournment are as follows: the hon. member for Bruce—Grey—Owen Sound, Labour; the hon. member for Spadina—Fort York, Democratic Institutions; the hon. member for Nunavut, Justice.

[Francesco Sorbara, Liberal, Vaughan—Woodbridge, ON]

Madam Speaker, before I begin, I just want to make a quick remark to the member for Wellington—Halton Hills. Obviously every member of Parliament, every person who has the privilege of representing their constituents and who was elected here to come do the good work that Canadians expect, is in solidarity with him. Of course, what is transpiring or has transpired is unacceptable.

I will be splitting my time with the member for Scarborough—Guildwood, a very learned and honourable member. It is a pleasure to split my time with him. I always look forward to his remarks, but he will have to listen to my remarks first.

Foreign interference is a matter of crucial importance. No country is immune to the threat of foreign interference. A country like Canada, which invests in democracy and is proud of the integrity of its electoral system, is liable to be considered an attractive target by bad actors, including individuals, organizations and even foreign governments, that may attempt to create tension or arouse suspicion about our government and our institutions.

However, I want to reassure Canadians. Our security and intelligence organizations keep close tabs on these threats and advise us on how to keep our citizens safe. We are continuously working on strengthening our safeguards.

The Government of Canada is always looking for new and innovative ways to improve the robust measures we have implemented to fight foreign interference. We look to the experience of our international partners to see what can and should be done in Canada. Accordingly, on March 6, 2023, the Prime Minister announced new measures to fight interference. I would like to go over some of those initiatives.

First is the creation of a new national counter foreign interference coordinator in Public Safety Canada to coordinate efforts to combat foreign interference.

Second are the applications for review by the National Security and Intelligence Committee of Parliamentarians, or NSICP, and by the National Security and Intelligence Review Agency, or NSIRA, on the state of foreign interference in Canada's federal electoral process and the way our national security organizations have reacted to this threat.

Third is the development of a plan to follow up on the outstanding recommendations by the NSICP, the Rosenberg report and other reviews on these matters. The report entitled “Countering an evolving threat: Update on recommendations to counter foreign interference in Canada’s democratic institutions”, was presented on April 6.

Finally, there is the $5.5-million investment to strengthen the capacity of civil society partners to prevent disinformation, promote democratic resilience and raise public awareness about foreign interference.

The Prime Minister also said that Public Safety Canada would launch public consultations. These consultations would help guide the creation of a foreign influence transparency registry in Canada to ensure transparency and accountability from people who advocate on behalf of a foreign government and that communities who are often targeted by attempts at foreign interference are protected.

The Minister of Public Safety launched those consultations on March 10, 2023. They will continue until May 9, 2023. The Government of Canada has also invested significantly in our ability to fight foreign interference.

The Government of Canada has also significantly in our ability to fight foreign interference. Budget 2023 allocates $13.5 million, starting in 2023-24, and $3.1 million ongoing to Public Safety Canada to establish a national counter-foreign interference office. Budget 2023 also allocates $48.9 million to the RCMP to protect Canadians from harassment and intimidation by foreign actors, increase its investigative capacity, and more proactively engage with communities at greater risk of being targeted.

These investments build on budget 2022, in which the government committed to providing $13.4 million to renew and expand the G7 rapid response mechanisms over five years in order to counter foreign threats to democracy.

What is more, $12.9 million will be invested to establish a research security centre of excellence at Public Safety Canada in order to protect Canadian research while strengthening the security posture of universities and research institutions.

These major investments will help build the Government of Canada's capacity and strengthen its ongoing efforts to fight foreign interference. As I said, we announced the launch of public consultations to guide the creation of a foreign influence transparency registry in Canada. Although protecting our country is the top priority, we also have to make sure we protect communities that are often targeted by attempts at foreign interference. These consultations with key stakeholders and the Canadian public will inform the path forward, including new measures to strengthen national security.

In addition to these consultations, the government is always working to ensure that our democratic institutions are protected from malign foreign influence. For example, before the 2021 federal election, we implemented the critical election incident public protocol, a mechanism to notify the public of a threat to the integrity of a general election. We also renewed the G7 rapid response mechanism to strengthen and share best international practices to address foreign threats to democracy in G7 countries.

Ahead of the 2019 election, we created the security and intelligence threats to elections task force. This task force coordinates the sharing of intelligence and information among the Communications Security Establishment, Global Affairs Canada, the Royal Canadian Mounted Police and the Canadian Security Intelligence Service. During the 2019 and 2021 federal elections, CSIS and the RCMP worked in close collaboration with task force members on coordinating efforts to fight foreign interference by raising awareness, assessing threats and preparing a government response to these threats. The task force remains active outside election periods as well, in light of persisting threats to democratic institutions, including foreign interference and disinformation.

However, protecting our institutions goes even farther. We are fortunate to be able to rely on the Canadian Security Intelligence Service. It investigates threats, advises the government and takes every measure necessary to mitigate threats to our national security. This includes threats from foreign actors.

I look forward to questions and comments.

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

Madam Speaker, there is a very important point that needs to be clarified today.

Earlier today, the member for Winnipeg North and the member for Kingston and the Islands implied that the member for Wellington—Halton Hills was aware that threats had been made against his family two years ago.

Could the member clarify who was correct, the member for Winnipeg North or the member for Wellington—Halton Hills?

[The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Alexandra Mendès), Liberal, Alexandra Mendes]

May I remind the hon. member that the Speaker addressed that issue right after question period. We will resume—

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

Madam Speaker, on a point of order, I was not aware of that. Could we reset the time and I will ask another question?

[The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Alexandra Mendès), Liberal, Alexandra Mendes]

Yes, please, from the top.

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

Madam Speaker, earlier today in my speech, I referenced the report that was tabled on March 12, 2020, from NSICOP. It said that the Government of Canada should have established a comprehensive strategy to counter foreign interference.

Why, after three years, have we seen no action from the government to take these critical steps to uphold Canadian sovereignty? Why do the Liberals continue to allow an illegal police station to operate in a Canadian city?

[Francesco Sorbara, Liberal, Vaughan—Woodbridge, ON]

Madam Speaker, I would like to thank my hon. colleague from Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, in beautiful British Columbia, for the very important question and for his participation in the debate today.

I am very happy that our government has launched consultations to set up a foreign agent registry. We need to be judicious and diligent on the foreign agent registry.

As I have said before in this House and publicly, I am in favour of a foreign agent registry modelled after those of other countries. We should obviously undertake to adopt best practices. That is what we are doing. We are consulting with our partners and with various parties, and that is the direction we should be going in.

[René Villemure, Bloc, Trois-Rivières, QC]

Madam Speaker, after hearing about Chinese police stations, interference attempts at universities and everything else, I wonder if my colleague is prepared to understand or actually accept the fact that there are regimes in this world that are ideologically and philosophically opposed to democracy and that the current Chinese regime is one of those regimes.

Does my colleague agree with me that the Chinese regime is hostile to democracy?

[Francesco Sorbara, Liberal, Vaughan—Woodbridge, ON]

Madam Speaker, I thank my colleague for his question, which is very important.

We must always stand for and uphold our Canadian values of human rights, minority rights and democracy. We must also always stand against any foreign actors that go against the values of democracy, human rights and minority rights.

As for our relationship with countries around the world, we must co-operate with many countries, we must challenge them when they do not fit our values and we must compete against them. That is what we have said in the past with regard to the relationship with the People's Republic of China and the Chinese government. We must compete with them and co-operate with them, but we must also challenge them when their values do not align with Canadian values.

[Alexandre Boulerice, NDP, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

Madam Speaker, I am going to paraphrase an expression to avoid using unparliamentary language. If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it probably is a duck.

There is something here that looks a lot like foreign interference, and the facts are piling up. After everything we have learned in the last few weeks, should there not be an independent, transparent inquiry to shed light on foreign interference? We need to restore the public's confidence in democracy, our institutions, the Prime Minister's Office and our security services.

[Francesco Sorbara, Liberal, Vaughan—Woodbridge, ON]

Madam Speaker, I thank my colleague for his question, which is very important.

As to whether there should be a public inquiry or not, an individual who is held in very high esteem will be making that determination and the determination on a number of recommendations the government will follow. I look forward to seeing those recommendations.

What we need to ensure is that all Canadians, the almost 40 million of us, have confidence in our electoral system, that there is no election interference and that we understand that in the world we live in, we must deal with foreign actors who do not have the best intentions here in Canada and in other parts of the world.

[Kevin Vuong, Independent, Spadina—Fort York, ON]

Madam Speaker, I want to read article 9 of the Vienna Convention on Diplomatic Relations into the record. It states:

The receiving State may at any time and without having to explain its decision, notify the sending State that the head of the mission or any member of the diplomatic staff of the mission is persona non grata or that any other member of the staff of the mission is not acceptable.

I would ask my colleague who sits on the government benches this: If setting up illegal police stations on Canadian soil or attacking or targeting a member of this House does not meet the threshold, what does meet the threshold to be able to kick someone out of our country?

[Francesco Sorbara, Liberal, Vaughan—Woodbridge, ON]

Madam Speaker, the issues and matters in front of the government and all members of this House are of very important, even critically important consideration. Obviously, whatever decisions are made will meet the proper threshold. I am not privy to all the information regarding what has transpired, so for me to opine on that would be—

[The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Alexandra Mendès), Liberal, Alexandra Mendes]

Resuming debate, the hon. member for Scarborough—Guildwood.