Debates of Oct. 8th, 2024

Innovation, Science and Industry

[Karina Gould, Liberal, Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

False, Mr. Speaker. That member sat in your chair at one point, and I think he would have an interesting perspective if the opposition was not following his ruling as he is doing.

I quote, and I repeat what you said, Mr. Speaker:

I believe the best way for this to be achieved would be to follow the usual course for a prima facie question of privilege, that is, a referral to the Standing Committee on Procedure and House Affairs.

The government is willing to do that. We are willing to vote in favour of it. The only party that is holding Parliament up are the Conservatives, because they do not want the truth out there.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh!

[The Speaker, Greg Fergus]

I am going to ask the hon. member for South Shore—St. Margarets, please, not to take the floor unless recognized.

[Andrew Scheer, Conservative, Regina—Qu'Appelle, SK]

Mr. Speaker, if the government House leader scrolled up just a little more in your ruling on the website, she would see where you ruled that withholding evidence after a parliamentary production order is a contempt of Parliament.

We are talking about Liberal insiders funnelling cash into their own pockets. Why do they not want to get to the bottom of this?

While Conservatives are putting forward real solutions to lower taxes, make housing more affordable and end the crime wave that the Prime Minister unleashed, the government is going to great lengths to keep this information hidden. It is effectively obstructing justice.

Why not let Parliament get back to work and hand over the evidence to the RCMP?

[Karina Gould, Liberal, Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, I am not sure the opposition House leader believes his own spin. He could scroll down a little and see what you, Mr. Speaker, asked of him, which was to prepare a motion that you said you would accept to send it to committee to be studied.

We welcome that. We will get this studied. Let us get this out of the House. There is only one group of MPs that does not want that to happen, because what will come out is that the Conservatives are trying to abuse the extraordinary powers of this place, override the rights of Canadians and get rid of police independence.

That is not acceptable.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

Mr. Speaker, this is a case of $400 million and 186 conflicts of interest that are benefiting Liberal insiders, lining their pockets while Canadians are lined up at food banks. The response from the government to a parliamentary order to produce the documents is, first of all, to break the order so that it can bury it at committee.

Conservatives want to make sure that this corruption, this scandal sees the full daylight that is deserved and a referral to Canada's Royal Canadian Mounted Police, so it can decide to take a criminal investigation—oh wait, we have learned that that is already investigating the latest corruption with these Liberals.

Will the government turn over the documents today?

[Karina Gould, Liberal, Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, your ruling was very clear: send this to committee.

There is only one group of MPs that is afraid of that going to committee. We are prepared to vote on that. Let us send it to committee. Let us have that debate. The only group of MPs that is obstructing its own obstruction, the Conservatives, do not actually want to help Canadians. All they want to do is serve themselves and their own partisan interest.

Let us get this out of the House. Let us get it to committee, so that we can get back to the important work of serving Canadians.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

Mr. Speaker, she says she wants to get it out of the House. She wants to get it out of the sunlight, the daylight. The Liberals want to bury it at committee. They do not want Canadians to know about the latest example of Liberal corruption. We see that conflicts of interest are very common over there. That Prime Minister broke the law twice. The Public Safety Minister broke the law. The trade minister broke the law. The Liberal-appointed chair of this green slush fund broke the law.

Every time these Liberals get a chance, they enrich their friends. They want to hide it from Canadians. Conservatives want to get the truth. We want to get accountability, and we want Parliament to be able to get back to work for Canadians. Will they turn over the documents today?

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh!

[The Speaker, Greg Fergus]

Order.

The hon. Minister of Innovation.

[François-Philippe Champagne, Liberal, Minister of Innovation]

Mr. Speaker, we already have the Bloc, but now we learn we have the blocker-in-chief, the Conservatives. How ridiculous for Canadians watching at home. The Conservatives are blocking their own motion, if we can imagine that.

We know that the Conservatives know how to count to six, so let me explain to them. There has not been one report, there have not not been two reports, there have not been three reports, but there have been four independent reports to get to the bottom of this.

We got to the bottom of this. Let us get back to work and expect better from all of us.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lévis—Lotbinière, QC]

Mr. Speaker, according to a senior official, there is a lot of negligence and laziness. There is also sheer incompetence, and the situation is simply untenable.

The lapses at Sustainable Development Technology Canada are on par with the sponsorship scandal when it comes to allocating funds. Canadians' tax dollars are being squandered without any consideration, and nothing is being done on the other side of the House to address the situation.

Will the Liberal government deal with this scandal as quickly as possible?

[François-Philippe Champagne, Liberal, Minister of Innovation]

Mr. Speaker, the Conservatives are waking up, as though this were news.

We took action quickly and decisively. There have been not one, but four reports: two by national law firms, one by an accounting firm and one by the Auditor General.

We have investigated and we have taken action. It is time for Parliament to get back to work in the interest of all Canadians.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lévis—Lotbinière, QC]

Mr. Speaker, in the green slush fund scandal, the government is openly refusing to provide the RCMP with the documents it needs to investigate the corruption at SDTC, where, as the Auditor General pointed out, the Liberals allowed their friends to benefit from taxpayers' money.

Will the Liberals stop hiding things and provide the evidence to the police so that Parliament can work in the interest of all Canadians?

[Jean-Yves Duclos, Liberal, Minister of Public Services and Procurement]

Mr. Speaker, let me be very clear. My colleague, the government House leader, has already clearly explained the situation.

However, since the member is talking about the RCMP, I am going to read an important comment made by the RCMP commissioner, who said, and I quote:

I would like to emphasize...that the RCMP is operationally independent and strictly adheres to the principle of police independence. In a free and democratic society, this ensures that the government cannot direct or influence the actions of law enforcement.

That includes members of the House.

Seniors

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

Mr. Speaker, across all age groups, 79% of the population is in favour of increasing OAS, regardless of age.

No need to be between the ages of 65 and 74, everyone agrees. Why is that? It is because people respect seniors and stand with them. If we can improve the living conditions of those who need it, people are all for it. Even in the House, everyone agrees except for the Liberals.

When are they going to listen to reason, show they have a heart and give royal recommendation to Bill C‑319?

[Steven MacKinnon, Liberal, Minister of Labour and Seniors]

Mr. Speaker, the Bloc Québécois has never taken a single opportunity to support our seniors.

They said no to the guaranteed income supplement. They said no to dental care, which today benefits 14,000 people in Shefford. They said no to housing measures for seniors.

When will the Bloc Québécois say yes to seniors?

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

Mr. Speaker, since he was appointed Minister of Seniors, the member for Gatineau's only accomplishment has been to turn his back on people aged 65 to 74.

All he does is play petty politics when he should be thinking big. He promotes Liberal interests when he should be thinking of the collective interest. He is an old-style politician, devoid of statesmanship. It is not too late. He can still take action for the common good.

Will the minister finally come to his senses, set partisanship aside and grant a royal recommendation?

[Steven MacKinnon, Liberal, Minister of Labour and Seniors]

Mr. Speaker, when it comes to seniors, I would take the track record of the 35 Liberal members from Quebec over the doings of the Bloc Québécois any day.

The Bloc members voted against dental care. They voted against the guaranteed income supplement. They voted against investments in housing for seniors.

Every time we have made a proposal for Quebec seniors, Bloc members rose in unison to say no. The 35 Liberal members from Quebec always say yes to seniors.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

Mr. Speaker, on top of that, the minister is using conspiracy theories to justify the fact that he has no intention of doing anything at all for seniors. He tells them that the big bad separatists have a secret plan to take away their pensions.

These are the same old scare tactics from the 1980s.

He talks about winning conditions and independence, but so do we. We believe that improving seniors' living conditions is a good thing and helps ensure their independence.

Instead of fearmongering, will the minister work for people and give a royal recommendation to Bill C-319?

[Steven MacKinnon, Liberal, Minister of Labour and Seniors]

Mr. Speaker, I will tell the House what seniors are afraid of. They are afraid of having dental care taken away from millions of Canadians. These seniors, certainly seniors in Gatineau, are wondering what the Bloc Québécois is doing with the Conservative Party in favour of austerity, cuts to child care spaces, cuts to dental care and cuts to health insurance.

Together with the Conservatives, the Bloc Québécois is putting our seniors and Canadians at risk.

Innovation, Science and Industry

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

Mr. Speaker, there is so much Liberal corruption that they are covering up their cover-up of the $400 million corruption of the Liberal green slush fund. The Speaker ruled that the NDP-Liberals violated a House order to turn the green slush fund documents over to the RCMP for investigation. How much worse is the corruption that the NDP-Liberals are refusing to respect the order of the Speaker, pushing aside all the work of doubling the housing costs that the Liberals have done, inflation and crime? We can get back to the business of the House if the NDP-Liberals just end the cover-up and turn the documents over to the RCMP.

Why will they not?

[Karina Gould, Liberal, Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, if we are going to be mansplained to, they can at least try to get it right. The fact of the matter is you ruled very clearly that this matter should go to the House committee. If the members opposite would like to read the full ruling, they can go do that, or I can table it in the House for them to read. I would encourage them to not just cherry-pick parts of the ruling, but to actually follow it, as opposed to what they are doing. We are happy for this matter to move on, for it to go to committee, for it to be studied. It is only the Conservatives that are holding this place up.

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

Mr. Speaker, every time I meet with a Liberal, I have to check for my wallet. They just took $400 million of taxpayer money and funnelled it to Liberals in the green slush fund. Why are they ignoring an order of the House? Why are they preventing us from getting to the business of the House, since they will not turn over the documents to the RCMP?

If the Prime Minister will not end the cover-up, will he at least call a carbon tax election so Canadians can get the green slush fund money back?

[Arif Virani, Liberal, Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, every time I meet a Conservative, I have to search for some semblance of reason. When we talk about what is going on here, let us think about why your ruling said to send it back to the committees. Your ruling said that because this has never been done. What happens normally when we ask for documents in law enforcement? We go to a court of law. We do not go into a partisan arena, such as the House of Commons, because a court of law, a judge, weighs things called charter interests, like the expectation of privacy, like the right to be free from unreasonable search and seizure. Those are important considerations. We will stand by them every time.