Debates of Oct. 6th, 2025

Military Justice System Modernization Act

[Charles Sousa, Liberal, Mississauga—Lakeshore, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I wish to reflect on the very nature of why this bill is important. As noted, there have been expert independent recommendations made by two justices recognizing its importance. One of the major priorities is the civilian enablement of the justice system to have more independence and protection for our armed forces and the individuals involved. All of us agree with that. I believe the opposition agrees with it as well. Let us support Bill C-11.

[Harb Gill, Conservative, Windsor West, ON]

Mr. Speaker, this legislation is long overdue, and I believe the Minister of National Defence himself admitted this today. One of the most important issues for any military is maintaining discipline and readiness.

By shifting more offences to the civilian system, which is already overburdened as it is, how will the government maintain the swift discipline and operational effectiveness necessary to military service? How is the government going to strike a balance between justice for victims and the chain of command's need for operational order?

[Charles Sousa, Liberal, Mississauga—Lakeshore, ON]

Mr. Speaker, having visited Latvia and Estonia, having gone to our bases in the U.K. and having been recently in Petawawa during military exercises, I was able to meet and talk first-hand with some of the soldiers and men and women on the front lines. Believe me, the soldiers, officers and leaders want discipline, but they want fairness and transparency and for their troops to be cared for. They recognize the civilian system is an appropriate step forward.

[Julie Dzerowicz, Liberal, Davenport, ON]

Mr. Speaker, it is always such a pleasure for me to rise in the House to speak on behalf of the constituents of my amazing downtown west Toronto riding of Davenport.

Today I am speaking in favour of Bill C-11, an act to amend the National Defence Act and other acts. The legislation, if passed, would amend the National Defence Act in response to long-standing concerns raised by victims and survivors of the Canadian Armed Forces community. It includes a suite of targeted amendments to modernize the military justice system and build on supports to victims and survivors.

In my role as the chair of the Canadian NATO Parliamentary Association, I know first-hand the impact that our brave men and women of the Canadian Armed Forces have on operations at home and abroad. We know that to fulfill our role as a NATO ally, we must have forces that are ready, able and agile. This all starts by ensuring that we provide our forces with a safe and professional work environment. This is the most effective way for our forces to train and to build up their skills for the difficult jobs we ask of them. This is why I am so pleased to rise today to speak about the important work that is being done to modernize our military justice system and to restore trust in the Canadian Armed Forces, also known as the CAF.

In the spirit of the debate, I will focus mainly on the initiatives surrounding Canadian Armed Forces personnel, including our military's efforts to recruit and retain more people and to ensure that their work environment is one that is free from discrimination and harassment.

Let me be clear from the start: Our people remain at the heart of everything our military does. It is, of course, vitally important they have the right equipment to stay agile and effective on the battlefields of the 21st century, but it is the people across the institution who make everything possible. Having the right number of people in the right jobs, each of them contributing to the collective efforts of moving our organization forward, has only become more important in recent years.

We have seen the return of strategic competition on a global scale, with authoritarian leaders from around the world vying for power and influence. They are not afraid to violate international laws and norms in the process. Canadians see this and know this. They see Canada on the world stage, with folks wearing the maple leaf proudly on their uniform around the world.

Here in Canada, Canadians have also seen the Canadian Armed Forces members called on more and more to respond in their own communities when natural disasters strike. As our military continues with its digital transformation efforts, and as we begin to account for the influence of emerging technologies like AI and quantum computing, we remain committed to keeping the human factor, the human decision-making and the human operational planning at the very heart of this work.

This is a time of rapid global change, change that puts our country and our continent at risk, change that threatens our closest allies and partners. Our efforts to build our forces back up to their full authorized capacity and set the groundwork for future growth are essential. When the Department of National Defence and the CAF were developing Canada's defence policy “Our North, Strong and Free”, they recognized this fact. That is why the policy puts forward an ambitious plan to rebuild the Canadian Armed Forces' authorized forces strength of 71,500 regular force members and 30,000 primary reserve force members, as well as to lay the groundwork for future growth. It also commits to expanding the size of the civilian workforce across many different critical functions, from training to building infrastructure and from staffing to IT.

First and foremost, “Our North, Strong and Free” commits the Canadian Armed Forces to taking a more agile and adaptive approach to recruiting that includes using digital technology to improve the applicant experience, speed up the required screenings and connect with the new pools of applicants. It also includes innovative measures like a new probationary period for applicants, streamlining the security clearance process, re-evaluating medical eligibility requirements and abolishing outdated processes and criteria wherever possible.

The CAF is also modernizing training by optimizing new members' transition into service, streamlining training activities and providing new recruits with meaningful work more quickly and more effectively.

Through these efforts, they will also redouble their commitment to building a military that looks like Canada and draws on the skill and talent in all parts of our society. We know that having a military that accounts for and engages with the diverse perspectives and experiences of people across our country makes us stronger, more resilient and enables better decision-making.

The Canadian Armed Forces' recruiting efforts through the defence policy are broad and far-reaching, and this year we have hit the highest recruitment numbers in 10 years. That is great news. In addition to significantly boosting recruitment numbers across the country, the CAF is also looking at ways to make the military a viable lifelong career for those members already wearing the uniform. Key to this is modernising how the military manages its personnel, including providing improved career support and delivery of services by better incorporating digital technologies into these activities.

The Canadian Armed Forces is re-examining its policies around compensation and benefits, HR leave and other supports for work-life balance, some of which date back decades. As part of these efforts, the Canadian Armed Forces has accelerated the development of an electronic health record platform that improves the continuity of care for mental and physical health services for CAF members as they are posted across the country.

Our federal government has also created a Canadian Armed Forces housing strategy, improving access to housing wherever CAF members and their families are posted, including building new housing and rehabilitating existing developments. We are making generational investments in affordable child care for military families on bases right across the country, because we know that having safe, reliable child care is important for everyone. This includes CAF members, many of whom face difficulties in finding this kind of care when they deploy. Services like these are obviously essential for them and for their loved ones.

Our efforts in recruitment and retention also closely align with our military's larger culture change efforts. Through “Our North, Strong and Free”, the CAF has re-affirmed its commitment to continuing the important work of building a safer, more respectful and inclusive work environment for all those who serve.

The legislative changes to the National Defence Act through Bill C-11 would ensure that CAF members can have confidence in the military justice system, as well as continuing to implement recommendations drawn from four external reports. These include the “Independent External Comprehensive Review” and the “Third Independent Review of the National Defence Act”, overseen by former Supreme Court justices, Justice Louise Arbour and Justice Morris J. Fish, respectively. I will let my colleagues discuss these reports, and how they are influencing our military's efforts, in more detail.

Through “Our North, Strong and Free”, the Department of National Defence has also committed to spending billions of dollars acquiring new equipment and infrastructure to support CAF operations around the globe. Many of these investments are focused on bolstering the CAF's presence in the Arctic year-round. Securing the Arctic is an important component in the defence of NATO's western and northern flanks and directly supports broader NATO deterrence efforts.

Finally, “Our North, Strong and Free” re-affirms the CAF's critical role around the world, supporting our allies and partners in need. This includes Ukraine, which continues to fight for its very existence in the face of Russia's illegal and unjustified invasion. In the Indo-Pacific, where Canada is bolstering its military presence in support of our regional partners, we are also supporting our allies and partners in need, as well as, of course, in Latvia, where the CAF continues to lead forward land forces in defence of NATO's eastern flank.

As Canada makes a generational and historic series of investments in our national defence, we must never lose sight of the people who serve Canada and Canadians. The brave men and women of the Canadian Armed Forces are at the heart of Canada's national defence. CAF members are deploying in dangerous situations around the world to bring hope. CAF members are repairing and upgrading equipment so their counterparts can quickly and safely deploy.

Through Bill C-11, we would also be supporting our people by modernizing the military justice system, making sure it stays aligned with Canadian law and that it is responsive to the needs of our people in uniform.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Mr. Speaker, the member spoke about many things related to international peace and security that were different from the bill, so my question will focus on those issues as opposed to the substance of Bill C-11.

The member spoke about the threat to international peace and security associated with Russia's genocidal invasion of Ukraine, and about the Canadian response. I am very concerned that the government chose to create waivers to titanium sanctions. It has a pattern of talking about sanctions and then creating big holes in those sanctions. We still have waivers to titanium sanctions in place that allow the import and use of Russian titanium, and we continue to have barriers to the export of oil and gas that could play a key role in displacing Russian gas exports.

I would like to know what the member's position is on these issues. Why, in particular, has the government put in place titanium sanction waivers to allow the Russian titanium industry to continue to benefit from trade with Canada?

[Julie Dzerowicz, Liberal, Davenport, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I want to reiterate, because I do want to continue to focus on Bill C-11, that members of our Canadian Armed Forces are always going to be there, not only keep to Canada safe but also to make sure that we fulfill our role as a NATO ally. For us to be able to do so, our forces have to be ready, able and agile.

I hope the member opposite will support Bill C-11, because it would contribute to making sure we have a very strong and free Canadian Armed Forces that will make sure we are doing our part in the world as well.

[Luc Thériault, Bloc, Montcalm, QC]

Mr. Speaker, looking beyond the sexual scandal and abuse of power highlighted in the 2015 Deschamps report, does my colleague not also find it scandalous that it took more than 10 years to draft legislation to address the culture of silence in the CAF?

[Julie Dzerowicz, Liberal, Davenport, ON]

Mr. Speaker, change does take time. What is most important for me is that we have the bill right now in the House and that there is an opportunity for all the members of the House to ensure that we pass the bill. We have made considerable progress over the past several years to enact meaningful and durable cultural change in the Canadian Armed Forces. If we pass the bill, we will continue to make those changes.

[Greg Fergus, Liberal, Hull—Aylmer, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like my colleague to tell us about the importance of supporting our soldiers overseas on missions outside Canada and, more importantly, of ensuring that our female soldiers can have confidence in the system that determines when there has been a breach of the rules against sexual misconduct in the CAF.

[Julie Dzerowicz, Liberal, Davenport, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank the hon. member for his advocacy.

We have already made considerable progress over the last few years to enact meaningful and durable cultural change within the Canadian Armed Forces. I am pleased to let the House know that we have also provided support and resources for any of the survivors or victims. A key resource is the sexual misconduct support and resource centre, a centre that provides vital services, including a 24-7 support line, peer support services and independent legal services.

We know there is more to do. We are on it. That includes passing the bill.

[Terry Dowdall, Conservative, Simcoe—Grey, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I know about the balance, as in my riding, between the military, which is very important, and agriculture. I know the government purchased roughly 1,600 acres for an Arctic over the horizon radar system. There seems to be a clash. The municipality and the Simcoe Federation of Agriculture are not against the actual technology; what they are against is the site of up to 4,000 acres.

If it affects food security and there is going to be an appropriation of land, how will that play out against protection for our military?

[Julie Dzerowicz, Liberal, Davenport, ON]

Mr. Speaker, the Canadian Armed Forces is always there to keep Canada safe. It is our obligation as a government to ensure that it has the resources, tools and equipment to be able to do so.

The legislation that we are discussing today would help our Canadian Armed Forces build a more inclusive, respectful and safe workplace. It is important for everyone to pass it.

[Helena Konanz, Conservative, Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I will be splitting my time with the member for Nanaimo—Ladysmith.

I am honoured to rise today to speak on behalf of the wonderful people of Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay.

Today, I rise to speak to Bill C-11, legislation that proposes long overdue changes to the National Defence Act and related laws. Let us be clear, the bill did not emerge out of nowhere. The Liberals have had 10 years to tackle sexual misconduct in the military, and they chose not to.

Bill C-11 is in response to deeply troubling and at times heartbreaking failures within our military justice system, failures that have been well known and well documented for far too long. I commend the Minister of National Defence for finally introducing this legislation, but I must say that it comes too late for too many. Survivors of sexual misconduct in our Canadian Armed Forces have been waiting, some for years, for a justice system that hears them, respects them and protects them. Instead, they faced delay, deflection and denial.

For years, Parliament has been presented with irrefutable evidence, independent reviews, government reports, surveys and the voices of survivors all pointing to a military culture where not only is sexual misconduct alarmingly common but also justice is often watered down, delayed or even denied altogether. Professor Elaine Craig of Dalhousie University published a 2020 report revealing high rates of plea deals in military courts, deals that allowed perpetrators to sidestep serious convictions. Survivors seeing their cases diluted, dismissed and delayed have lost confidence not only in the process but also in the leadership. Who could blame them? They are not just afraid of legal outcomes. They fear career ruin, retaliation and ostracism if they step forward. In a system where justice is inconsistent, the silent message has been, “Don't speak up. It's not worth it.” We need to change that.

Bill C-11 aims to address some of these long-standing issues, and among the long-awaited provisions are the transferring of sexual offence cases from military courts to civilian jurisdiction when the incidents occur in Canada. This has been a long-awaited step towards impartiality, but we need to investigate further whether sending these cases to the civilian system, as many have been since 2021, will be successful given the severe backup in our civilian justice system.

The bill would also modernize appointments to key military legal positions, including the provost marshal, directors of prosecutions and defence counsel services. Conservatives have been pushing for many years to strengthen safeguards against interference, improving complaint processes and enhancing independence within the military justice system.

Importantly, the bill would also implement recommendations from the Arbour report, which has been mentioned quite a bit in the House today and was led by retired Supreme Court justice Louise Arbour. She did not mince words when she quoted that Canadians learned that “investigations were perfunctory, the victims were not believed and often they—not the perpetrators—were punished by senior officers”. That is not just a legal critique. It is a condemnation of a broken system, which has been going on for years, and the numbers confirm it.

According to Stats Canada's 2023 survey on sexual misconduct in the Canadian Armed Forces, nearly 2,000 members of the regular force, about 3.5%, reported experiencing sexual assault in connection to their service. The rates were even higher among young members and indigenous service members. It is a troubling fact for so many reasons, including that we are having such a difficult and challenging time in recruitment.

We have known about these issues for more than a decade. The landmark Deschamps report in 2015, which is also mentioned here, sounded the alarm that victims feared reprisals or removal from their units and had concerns about not being believed or being stigmatized as troublemakers. The culture of silence still exists. It is the result of a systemic failure to build trust.

Since then, the warnings continued and have been ignored by the Liberal government in the last decade. We have seen the 2018 Auditor General's report, the 2021 Fish report, a 2021 status of women committee report, a 2021 ombudsman report and, finally, the 2022 Arbour report. It is clear it is time to transfer these cases to civilian courts, reform the system and listen to the victims. This should have happened long ago. We also need to work on the civilian courts, as we know they have their own issues. It is not like the Liberals did not have all this information for the last decade.

Bill C-11 would give the current Minister of Defence increased powers over key appointments and prosecution guidelines. That is no small matter. Given the government's track record of interference, Canadians have every right to ask, and they are asking, if the minister and the government can be trusted with more power.

Let us not forget that in 2021, the House had to censure the former Liberal defence minister for his handling of known sexual misconduct allegations in the military. We witnessed Liberal cover-ups, committee filibusters and a failure to hold top officials accountable, even when the government knew about the serious misconduct at the highest level of military command.

Any expansion of ministerial authority must come with serious safeguards. The government must explain how it will prevent abuses, protect victims and guarantee independence in the military justice system. Our brave men and women in uniform make enormous sacrifices to protect us every day. Members of the Canadian Armed Forces deserve to know how these changes would apply to them, whether they serve here at home or are deployed abroad. They deserve a justice system that protects them in return.

Let us be clear. This legislation is not a gift and it is not charity, but the bare minimum of what we owe to those who serve. It should have happened years ago. We cannot afford another decade of inaction. We cannot offer more empty promises. We certainly cannot allow the government to pat itself on the back for action it was shamed into taking.

This is why Conservatives will scrutinize this bill closely. We will stand up for victims. We will demand transparency, independence and real reform. We will not let the government off the hook for its past failures, but work to ensure those in uniform finally get the justice and protection they deserve.

To all those who have served and continue to serve, we hear them, we stand with them, and we will fight for the justice they have been denied for far too long.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, I am wondering if the member can provide her thoughts with regard to the recommendations. There were 48 specific recommendations brought forward, and 47 of those are well under way, and hopefully, will in fact be dealt with before the end of the year. The one there is a lot of hesitancy about is Bill C-11. Bill C-11 is recommendation number 5, and it is what we are debating today. I will be able to provide more detail on it.

Would the member not agree that at the very least, the Conservative Party of Canada should commit to getting that legislation, in whatever form, passed before the end of the year?

[Helena Konanz, Conservative, Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC]

Mr. Speaker, it is really interesting to me that the Liberals and the member seem intent on pushing this through so fast when these issues have been around for years. In fact, last year, it was filibustered and debated in committee, yet it was killed when Parliament was prorogued.

The bill did not appear out of nowhere. It was in response to deeply troubling failures within our military justice system that have been going on for years. It is interesting that the member is interested in it going so quickly.

[Jean-Denis Garon, Bloc, Mirabel, QC]

Mr. Speaker, in March 2015, and I would like to point out that we are in 2025, former Supreme Court justice Marie Deschamps tabled a scathing report on sexual abuse and allegations of sexual misconduct in the armed forces. A month later, the Harper government appointed Jonathan Vance as chief of the defence staff.

Then there was the Fish report, but the government was not satisfied with that report so it asked former Supreme Court justice Louise Arbour to produce a new report. Justice Arbour herself was surprised that she was being asked to redo work that had already been done. It is now 2025, and earlier I heard a Liberal member tell us that change takes time, and yet it took 10 years to introduce a bill to protect the most vulnerable members of our armed forces.

Does my colleague not find this to be a clear demonstration of the disregard for women, among others, in the Canadian Army?

[Helena Konanz, Conservative, Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I completely agree with the member. It has been a long 10 years, with many people being hurt by the lack of legislation, which needed to come forward a long time ago. Survivors of sexual misconduct have been waiting for years for the Liberal government to do something about this, and they need to be heard.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank my colleague for her excellent speech and for her important work in Parliament.

A former member of the House, who was, as it happens, from the same province, former defence minister Sajjan, was given an opportunity to receive some information about very serious issues of this nature from the ombudsman and tragically chose not to deal with that information at the time. I do not think we have heard anything from the Liberals thus far in today's debate about how that unfolded or contributed to where we are today on these issues.

I wonder if the hon. member has comments on what happened then and why action was not taken when information was initially available.

[Helena Konanz, Conservative, Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC]

Mr. Speaker, my colleague's question is pertinent to this debate because it exemplifies the fact that so many important and troubling issues have occurred in the last few years concerning this deeply troubling issue in the military system, which should have been acknowledged, moved on and changed a long time ago. Unfortunately, the Liberal government chose to avoid the issues that needed to be addressed.

[Tamara Kronis, Conservative, Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC]

Mr. Speaker, Canadians hold deep pride in the men and women who wear the uniform of the Canadian Armed Forces. They serve in dangerous places with courage to defend the values and freedoms we hold dear. We ask them to put country before self, to risk their lives so that we can continue to live in safety and freedom. For far too long, too many of those who have served have had to fight another battle, the battle to be heard, to be believed and to be treated with dignity when they come forward as victims of sexual assault or misconduct within the very institution that demands the highest standards of honour and integrity.

That is why today's debate on Bill C-11, the government's new military justice reform bill, matters. Our conversation today is not just about amending sections of the National Defence Act. It is about the culture, credibility and future of the Canadian Armed Forces because of the way that Bill C-11 now intersects with our criminal justice system. It is also about the way we prosecute crime, in general, in Canada.

It has been more than a decade since the 2015 report of former Supreme Court justice Marie Deschamps rocked Canada with her findings on sexual misconduct in our armed forces. She made 10 recommendations. Operation Honour followed and was supposed to change both culture and outcomes, but years later, the Auditor General reported that Operation Honour had little measurable success. Investigations were still slow, accountability was still weak and the culture in some parts of the military continued to allow perpetrators to avoid serious consequences. Justice Deschamps called the Liberal government out for its failure to act in this regard.

The next report came in 2021. It was done by former Supreme Court of Canada justice Morris Fish. It gave the Liberal government another failing grade and made 107 recommendations. In 2022, former Supreme Court of Canada justice Louise Arbour delivered yet another comprehensive external review, this time with 48 recommendations, again emphasizing broken trust and calling for action.

Three former Supreme Court of Canada justices laid out a road map for reform, and yet, as the Liberals hesitated, as progress stalled, as survivors were left waiting, it was Conservative pressure through parliamentary questions, committee hearings and public advocacy that forced this issue back onto the national stage again and again. We can fairly say that without the sustained efforts and tenacity of victims, Bill C-66, which still died on the Order Paper when the Liberal government prorogued last time, and now Bill C-11 may never have been introduced.

The Liberals will now claim credit for these reforms, but it is Conservative MPs who ensured that the voices of victims were not forgotten and that meaningful change could not be avoided. The fact that we are still here 10 years after the Deschamps report debating the same issues with the same victims still waiting for change is a damning indictment of the Liberal government's ability to deliver results.

Even with all of this to work with, Bill C-11 still includes some very strange inconsistencies. Term lengths and reappointment rules differ across positions. The director of military prosecutions and the director of defence counsel services would serve seven-year terms with no reappointment, but the provost marshal, on the other hand, serves for four years and can be reappointed. There seems to be no clear rationale for these differences.

Similarly, giving the Minister of National Defence the power to issue prosecutorial guidelines in specific cases and giving the Governor in Council authority over appointments and removals, which is cabinet, opens the door, intentionally or not, to political interference. The minister's involvement in reviewing inquiries and authorizing acting appointments could compromise independence and BillC-11 does not fully clarify how offences outside of Canada would be handled. I hope the Liberals will collaborate with Conservatives on these issues and others raised by my colleagues and that they will be ironed out as the bill progresses through our parliamentary system.

Beyond the wording of the bill, however, we cannot ignore the context in which this debate takes place. The government has promised to grow the Canadian Armed Forces to meet our NATO obligations. It has pledged to recruit and retain thousands of new members in the coming years. That will require trust that every person who joins our forces will serve in an institution that protects them, upholds the law and embodies the values that we defend abroad.

That brings me to a very serious concern. The government is proposing to transfer all sexual offence cases from the military justice system to civilian courts. The principle makes sense: Justice must be independent. However, modernization is not just a word; it is a commitment to follow through. It means resourcing reforms properly. It means ensuring civilian authorities are ready to handle the additional caseloads. Right now, our civilian court system is in crisis. Court backlogs are staggering. Serious criminal cases have been stayed or dismissed because of delays. Victims of assault, including sexual assault, are waiting years for their day in court. Therefore, when the government says it will hand military cases to the civilian system, we have to ask how the civilian system would cope. What additional resources would be provided to the provinces along with this downloading to ensure these cases and others do not end up stayed for delay?

While we are speaking about justice, let us talk about the need to reform Liberal bail. Just this afternoon, the Liberal government voted down a Conservative private member's bill that would have tightened bail provisions for repeat violent offenders, including sexual offences. These are people who, under the current government's lax laws, have been released time and time again and have shown a staggering ability to reoffend. The Liberals talk about protecting victims, but when they had the chance to take common-sense steps to keep dangerous criminals off our streets, they said no to reform and yes to Liberal bail, which would apply to these cases under Bill C-11 the same way it applies to other cases in our justice system.

Canadians deserve a government that takes justice seriously. Our men and women in uniform deserve a military where justice is not only done but is seen to be done and is done expeditiously. The integrity of our justice system, civilian and military, depends on consistency. The Liberals cannot claim to stand for victims in uniform if they turn their back on victims in our communities. They cannot say that they believe in accountability for the forces if they do not demand it in our courts.

The government has to move beyond symbolism and performative legislation. It must demonstrate through action and results that it understands the gravity of the trust that it has broken and the responsibility it carries to restore it. If we fail to get this right, then we fail not only today's soldiers, sailors and aviators, but also those we hope will serve tomorrow.

Canada is vulnerable. Our allies are increasing their defence commitments. The global security environment is becoming more dangerous. We will ask more of our military in the years ahead. Leadership begins with integrity at home. Before we can ask our soldiers to defend Canada's values overseas, we must prove that those values govern our own institutions. The rule of law, equality and justice must not be words in a report, but living principles in every part of our justice system.

For the sake of our soldiers, sailors and aviators serving in Canada and abroad, let us get it right. The time for excuses has long passed. Fix the criminal system, or get out of the way and let us do it. Let us ensure that the civilian courts have the capacity to deliver justice quickly and fairly. Above all, let us commit across party lines that never again will the men and women who serve Canada have to wonder whether their own government will stand up for them when they need it most.

[Viviane LaPointe, Liberal, Sudbury, ON]

Mr. Speaker, the member talked a lot about the Liberal government's track record when it came to supporting the Canadian Armed Forces. We know the legislation we are debating today is significant, as well as some of the investments we have announced over the past few months.

What does the member have to say about the fact that the lowest level of defence spending ever, in the history of the Government of Canada, was made under the Conservative Harper government?

[Tamara Kronis, Conservative, Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC]

Mr. Speaker, this bill is about the prosecution of serious criminal offences around sexual misconduct. The government has had 10 years and six months to bring this forward. We need to get it right and we need to work together to do that.

[Jean-Denis Garon, Bloc, Mirabel, QC]

Mr. Speaker, once again, this is an interesting and necessary bill, but we have to wonder why it took 10 years to introduce it. First, the Liberals requested so many reports that they virtually ran out of former Supreme Court justices to ask. They asked for a bunch of reports. Then they introduced a bill and let it die on the Order Paper.

It would be fair to ask whether the Liberals were simply not interested in military justice, because when the Canadian Forces ombudsman tried to meet with Minister Sajjan, not only did the minister refuse to meet with him, but he did everything but hide in washrooms and broom closets to avoid meeting with the ombudsman.

My question for my colleague is this. Why, for 10 years, were the Liberals so uninterested in military justice, which is so important to the most vulnerable people and members of our armed forces?

[Tamara Kronis, Conservative, Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank my colleague for his question. I think he has raised a point that really needs to be addressed.

We have gotten to a point on this file where the trust is so low that we need to move these kinds of offences into the criminal justice system. I really cannot help but wonder what would have happened if the Liberal government had acted faster during the 10 years it had to do this. I wonder if we could have gotten to a point where members of our armed forces had an opportunity to work this out internally and were able to build that trust.

We cannot go back. We can only move forward, and for as long as this has taken, we hope the government will take our advice and continue to work on this bill.

[Ted Falk, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank the member for Nanaimo—Ladysmith for an excellent speech. I think she clearly identified some of the issues and concerns she has with this legislation.

Earlier today, we had the Liberals vote against being tough on crime and instead, support their soft-on-crime approach by voting against the jail and not bail motion that Conservatives put forward. The member identified that she does not necessarily have confidence that victims of sexual violence and assault in the military will receive justice in our courts.

Does the member think that because of the Liberals' failure to pass legislation that is effective and brings justice to victims?