Martin Cauchon

[Canadian Environmental Assessment Act, October 31st, 1994]

Mr. Speaker, on the question of funding for people who want to proceed and be accepted in the consultation process, we should have a look at what we are doing. Actually the minister of human resources in his consultations on social reform decided that he will proceed with some funding for organizations across Canada.

I believe that on that specific point we have to respect the discretionary power of the minister. It depends on what process we are going ahead with. If it is a huge transformation in that field against it then the discretion of the minister will be used accordingly. I am very much in favour of the discretion that we kept in that bill.

[Canadian Environmental Assessment Act, October 31st, 1994]

Mr. Speaker, I must say that this is an interesting question, one that was partially answered in my speech.

As I said, there is already a joint committee sitting at the level of all the environment ministers of all the provinces. They are all sitting in order to discuss what we are going to do about the environment in this country.

They are trying to set national standards so that we can have legislation or at least an environmental policy that will be consistent from coast to coast.

As I mentioned in my speech-

Unfortunately the Minister of the Environment of the province of Quebec declared weeks ago that it does not want to participate any more in that process. According to the minister it is a question of jurisdiction; the environment belongs to the provinces.

So, as I mentioned in my speech, that question has already been answered. The problem is that the Quebec Minister of the Environment refuses to participate in this process and, as I explained earlier, that is where there is a lack of objectivity. Every time we try to sit down with the government of Quebec or the Official Opposition to discuss national standards or other issues for the benefit of Quebecers and all Canadians, they refuse to take part in such discussions.

I think it is time we start telling Quebecers that the federal government is not as bad as some people would like them to believe and that the present federal government is actually very open.

This brings me to say a few words about the issue of social reform. You will understand that we cannot give these people any credibility when we have just undertaken a social reform process in which we want to consult Canadians so that they can participate in the development of a new government policy.

We are just through the first stage, which was the tabling of a discussion paper. The consultation process will follow-actually, it has already started. So we are still in the early stages of this reform and the ministers responsible in Quebec are already complaining that the federal government wants to interfere in areas under provincial jurisdiction, that the federal government is again picking on Quebec. I do not understand anything any more. If the government presents a discussion paper and wants to consult people, if this is interpreted as wanting to invade Quebec, I will have to take Politics 101 over again.

I do not understand anything any more, but it is obvious. Since the federal government wants to act openly and present a bill to reform part of our federal system, namely our social programs, they absolutely do not want to see this process succeed.

I must say that it is the same with the question of the environment. When we are discussing that subject, they do not want to enter into discussion with our government. They want to separate. They want to move apart so they will not be with us any more. As such it is going to be very difficult to deal with them over the next few years.

[Canadian Environmental Assessment Act, October 31st, 1994]

Mr. Speaker, I am especially happy today to join the Minister of the Environment in speaking to Bill C-56, an Act to amend the Canadian Environmental Assessment Act.

I think that in analyzing this bill, we must pay close attention to the actions of Opposition members, particularly members of the Official Opposition. In addressing environmental assessments, the Bloc Quebecois clearly showed that its mandate has nothing to do with protecting Quebecers' interests. In fact, the Bloc stubbornly criticizes the proclamation of the Canadian Environmental Assessment Act, which was designed by its own leader. These actions confirm that the only goal of the Official Opposition, the Bloc Quebecois, is to look after the interests of Quebec's separatist government.

As the leader of the Bloc has often said, the environment has no borders. In an interview published in the October 13 edition of The Gazette , the hon. member who is the leader of the Bloc Quebecois said this in English:

The problem is that the word environment never appears in the Constitution so the provinces and the federal government are condemned to work jointly. They have to work together. If they do not it is chaos.

All levels of government share a great and noble responsibility with regard to the environment. All levels of government in Canada have a responsibility to ensure that development is carried out in a rational way while at the same time respecting the natural balance.

It is clear that Canadians want jobs, but not at the expense of their children or the environment. Of all the tools available to protect the environment, the environmental assessment is undoubtedly the most effective. In fact, environmental assessment is inexpensive preventive medicine. It gives us advance warning of the possible environmental impact of a project and it promotes informed public participation in the decision-making process.

If members of this House agree that environmental jurisdiction is shared and that environmental assessment is a good way to prevent pollution, how can we explain that some members opposite stubbornly insist on condemning the proclamation of this bill? Let us briefly look together at the so-called problems raised by the Bloc's environment critic.

When the Minister of the Environment on October 6 announced the government's decision to proclaim the law, the Bloc critic condemned this as a federal attempt to interfere in provincial jurisdiction. Of course, such reaction from the Bloc Quebecois is quite natural. I must say that I was stupefied when I heard those remarks about Bill C-56.

In fact, what Bill C-56 does is exactly the opposite of what the Bloc is again trying to have all Quebecers believe. If the federal government wanted to meddle in provincial affairs or make things difficult for Quebec by interfering with its economic development, it would not propose the Canadian Environmental Assessment Act. It would keep the famous 1984 EARP Guidelines Order and it would use it systematically.

Why? Because that order allows the federal government to examine the environmental impact of any proposal over which it has a decision-making power. Do you know how the term "proposal" is defined in the order? It is described as any undertaking or activity over which the government has a say in the decision process.

In concrete terms, this means every project, activity and initiative in which the federal government is involved. It also includes all direct and indirect subsidies to provinces, including equalization payments, as well as every Canada-Quebec agreement on regional development, and all federal subsidies to businesses. That definition also includes hundreds of licences, permits and authorizations delivered every day by the federal government.

When he was Canada's Minister of the Environment, the Bloc Quebecois leader did read the EARP Guidelines Order. He also read the Supreme Court decisions and he quickly realized that if the order were to be applied like an act, as instructed by the courts, the federal government would find itself in an impossible situation. This is why he demanded that a reform be implemented as quickly as possible. I must admit that the Bloc critic did a nice song and dance. She said that the Canadian Environmental Assessment Act was unacceptable because it differs from Bill C-78 which, as you remember, had been submitted to Cabinet by the member for Lac-Saint-Jean just a few days before his sudden resignation from the Conservative government.

For once, the Bloc critic is partially right when she talks about differences. Dozens of amendments were proposed by the House of Commons committee and by the Canadian Council of Ministers of the Environment, which represents the interests of all the provinces regarding environmental issues.

Let us examine the main amendments together briefly. First of all, approximately ten changes to the Bouchard bill were meant to facilitate the alignment of the federal and the provincial processes. Thus, the Minister of the Environment is now required to consult the provinces and to co-operate with them before any review panel is formed. Other amendments give the federal authorities the power to delegate to the provinces the preliminary reviews, the in-depth studies, the mitigation measures and even the follow-up programs.

Therefore, what we have here is a possible delegation of most of the environmental assessments done by the federal government. Some other changes promote public participation. Several clauses were added to restrain the discretion formerly afforded the federal authorities.

The Bouchard bill was amended so that the uncertainties about the implementation of the legislation would be reduced, including in the area of federal activities. But the preamble of that bill was changed to include the concept of sustainable development.

Therefore, the Bloc critic is right. The Bouchard bill was amended in several important ways. I would like her to say, for the benefit of the House, what amendments are rejected by her party. In fact, all of the amendments to this famous bill we just saw and reviewed are consistent with the vision of this government, a vision where the objective is to make sure we can act according to the present policy, based first and foremost on a progressive federalism.

This bill means that we are going to work together with all the provinces and also with the general public, and that is what irks the Official Opposition. This bill is a prime example of how federalism can work when you believe in it. That is the problem with the Official Opposition. When they talk about federalism, they certainly do not want this system, which is probably the best system in the world, to operate properly. That is why they say every time that if the Leader of the Bloc left the Conservative government at the time, it was because he believed and knew that the system no longer worked.

I think it is too early to throw in the towel on a system that is evolving and responding to the needs of the people. Not just in Quebec but in Canada as well, people say that federalism has problems. My answer to that is thank God federalism has problems, because this means people have changed, people have evolved, and our duty as parliamentarians at the federal level, as members of this House, is to reflect on these changes and get together to ensure that the political system under which we live, that the federal system under which we are evolving also evolves in line with the expectations of the public.

This was just a brief digression. I will get back to the bill.

And if the Canadian Environmental Assessment Act were an attempt by the federal government to encroach on Quebec's jurisdiction, as I said earlier, let the Bloc critic explain why four successive federal Ministers of the Environment came from the Conservative Quebec caucus and were so closely involved in this reform? They designed it, tabled it in the House, made amendments, passed it and defended it during the last federal election. According to the philosophy of the Bloc Quebecois, we would have to say that probably all the Quebecers who were committed to this bill were on the wrong track.

In fact, the question is: Does the Bloc have a monopoly on brains? Were these people who spoke out in favour of the bill all wrong? The answer is simple. As I said earlier, the bill is such an eloquent example of viable federalism that obviously they would be ill-advised to react positively to the bill, since these people, and I am probably repeating myself, are intent on only one thing, and that is the separation of Quebec.

Unfortunately, in the process they have lost the ability to think objectively, thereby jeopardizing the interests of all Quebecers. Well, the people who supported this bill were not all wrong. The comments of the critic for the Bloc Quebecois seem to point to the presence of a transmission belt linking her office with the Quebec government's Department of Intergovernmental Affairs. The problem of the Bloc Quebecois right now is that it is only a mouthpiece. We could say that it is the secretariat of the Parti Quebecois. Members of the Bloc no longer have their own identity, their own way of thinking. They do not have a specific way of being, a specific philosophy. They are like puppets controlled by the government of Quebec which is following a separation agenda.

Since I am informed that time is flying, I will simply say that this bill, like many an initiative from this government, is a highly symbolic expression of dialogue. We proved in the past that when there is a will to co-operate we can progress. Let us remember, for example, the St. Lawrence-Vision 2000 project.

This is a vibrant example of federal, provincial and municipal co-operation. Let us remember the agreements under the infrastructure program which helped renew our social infrastructure and put a number of people back to work. Recently, last June in fact, there was an agreement between the provinces to do away with economic barriers. Is it not proof that federalism works?

Clearly, this legislation is in the same vein and shows the same kind of vision. This is why members of the Official Opposition have every reason to make the people of Quebec believe that this legislation is useless and even harmful to the whole of Quebec.

In 1981, 13 years ago, the government of the Parti Quebecois passed the Environment Quality Act. At the same time, it adopted regulations listing the kind of projects which would be subject to hearings by the Quebec Bureau d'audiences publiques sur l'environnement.

Unfortunately, the Quebec government forgot to proclaim certain key sections of the regulations and today, 13 years later, the Parti Quebecois government's process only deals with dams, roads and marinas. There is no public assessment of industrial projects, no public assessment of mining projects and no public assessment of aluminum plants.

I would like to conclude, if I may, Mr. Speaker, on a very important point, namely the harmonization of the federal and provincial processes. For the past several months, the members of the Canadian Council of Ministers of the Environment have been looking for ways to facilitate harmonization. Their objective is to agree on the implementation of the principle of one environmental assessment for each project, regardless of the number of decision-makers. It is an arduous task requiring the participation of all provinces.

Nevertheless, the Quebec environment minister recently announced that he was withdrawing his officials from the federal-provincial consultations on environmental assessment. This decision could hurt Quebec businesses as well as Quebecers looking for a job. The president of the Conseil du patronat du Québec recently condemned this hasty decision on the part of the Quebec environment minister. Other organizations are to follow suit.

To conclude, if the Bloc members want to show that they are more concerned about the interests of Quebecers that they are about their obsession to separate, they should do two things in this House. First, they should support the proclamation of the Canadian Environmental Assessment Act and the amendments proposed by the environment minister.

Second, if these people were acting reasonably and for the sake of all Quebecers, they would recognize the appropriateness of this bill for the future of Quebec, the future of Canada and the well-being of federalism. They would also have the courage to demand that the Quebec environment minister change his mind and take part again in the work of the Canadian Council of Ministers of the Environment on the harmonization of the environmental assessment process. This is what they would do if only they had enough courage.

[Bilingualism, October 27th, 1994]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of National Defence.

Everyone here knows how important it is to make the Royal Military College in Kingston bilingual.

Can the minister tell us what he intends to do to really make this college bilingual and then to have this principle of bilingualism respected and maintained?

[Department Of Canadian Heritage Act, October 27th, 1994]

Mr. Speaker, I welcome this opportunity to speak this morning to Bill C-53, which I see as important and essential to Canadian society because of what it represents. All members who spoke to the bill in this House expressed the view that it was basically a housekeeping bill. In fact, the purpose of this legislation is simply to reassign departmental responsibilities.

We have heard criticism from the two opposition parties. Certain details, certain aspects of the bill were criticized, of course, but in addition, and this is what irks me, they took this opportunity to criticize the federal government's role in the cultural sphere. I think that if we are to have a constructive debate, my comments should deal mainly with the federal government's role in this area. According to the opposition parties, the federal government should withdraw from anything that resembles cultural affairs, should stop working with major agencies like Telefilm Canada and, listen to this, should get rid

of an agency as important as the Department of Canadian Heritage.

The opposition parties even claim, and this I found hard to take seriously, that the federal government will use these institutions against the province of Quebec and even against the French fact in Canada as a whole. It takes all kinds, but this takes the cake!

Such comments seem unwise, to say the least, considering the current political context in this country.

I want to make it clear that the federal government's role in cultural matters is a fundamental and entirely legitimate one, and I hope that this short speech will reassure opposition members.

Why is this role so important? The federal government's role is important because of the way Canada was built. We all know that Canada is a wonderful mosaic of various cultures, with two official languages. We also know that Canada as a country has opted for social values based on tolerance, mutual respect, multiculturalism and promotion of the Canadian identity. In this respect, the federal government's role as Canadian umbrella, a Canadian vehicle for promoting our identity as Canadians, is fundamental.

As parliamentarians we must take the broader view and keep this debate removed from what I call constitutional squabbles. Quebec and the rest of the country have already suffered enough as a result of this quarrelling which in most cases has been of no benefit to the people of this country and often puts an extra burden on Canadian taxpayers. We should recall the purpose of this bill and especially the Canadian government's role, and stop this constitutional nitpicking.

It is obvious that you have gathered from my remarks that I am wary of what the Official Opposition is affirming, but also of the Reform Party, which wants to go ahead with unweighed and often unjustified cuts that would go against some basic principles stated by the Prime Minister of Canada, principles he has stated and, indeed, states regularly, in this House. The federal government must respond to the budget situation, while remaining at the service of the population and, in this role, promote Canadian identity.

Of course, we must rise above constitutional disputes, but without losing sight of the objectives set by the government in terms of government administration. The government wants to make sure that we can stay away from any form of duplication. It also wants to make sure that we can streamline government operations and I might add that it is desirable that government administrations at all levels be streamlined.

Bill C-53, to establish the Department of Canadian Heritage, is part of this streamlining process respectful of authority, or

should I say the powers inherent to the three levels of government, specifically the municipal, provincial and federal levels.

The department the Bloc Quebecois would like to see abolished is also the backbone of institutions such as national museums, the Canada Council-allow me to list a few more key organizations-Telefilm and the National Film Board and various programs encouraging interprovincial distribution, exportation of our cultural products and promotion of Canadian talent internationally.

In fact, I would add that the federal government is making use of the legislative or statutory instruments within its jurisdiction, such as copyright or income tax, to encourage or oversee artistic creation and cultural diffusion.

Of course, the provinces and municipalities, as I said, also have a role and since each government has an important role in these fields of jurisdiction, I should say that they have a key role, a complementary role, in fact, with respect to culture.

Far be it from me to challenge the authority of these levels of government. I would even go further by stating the obvious fact that Quebec's powers are special, since it is the centre of French culture in North America. But, of course, this does not prevent the Canadian government from assuming its own responsibilities of encouraging interprovincial trade, sharing a common heritage, structuring the markets for cultural products by using the tools that it alone has at its disposal.

I understand that the way the Bloc sees things, Quebec's goal is to keep anything federal off its territory; however, to say that the break-up of the country is necessary because the federal government's intervention harms Quebec culture is the kind of intellectually twisted argument that they usually give us, unfortunately, and give all Quebecers especially. I think that this attitude is meant to justify at any cost a case that they consider has been proven beyond question. They deliberately want to tarnish a record in which all Quebecers can take pride.

To conclude, I recently heard some Bloc critics and I was deeply offended as a Quebecer. Some Bloc critics say that they want to confine the whole province within a single definition, that of a nation. I must say that Quebec is not a definition. Quebec is made up of people who have pride, their customs and culture, a culture that they want to extend throughout Canada and internationally. There is also a French community that is alive and well outside of Quebec.

The federal government's role and the purpose of this bill are to make it possible-and I conclude-for this French community to flourish more and for the two official languages to live together better, all for the sake of promoting what we call a Canadian identity, of which I am proud.

[Infrastructure Program, October 25th, 1994]

Mr. Speaker, I want to point out that, one year ago today, this government received its mandate from Canadians. Since then, numerous commitments have been fulfilled, including the Canada-Quebec infrastructure program, which has resulted in the implementation of several projects.

Thanks to federal contributions of some $90 million, this year the city of Montreal was able to start urban infrastructure projects of over half a billion dollars. On top of improving the residents' quality of life, these infrastructure projects will result in the creation of some 4,800 new direct and indirect jobs, during the construction work itself as well as in the following months.

During the first year of its mandate, the government strived to create jobs, restore confidence and rebuild the credibility of the federal administration. Contrary to the Parti Quebecois government-

[Supply, October 25th, 1994]

Bleak reality.

[Collège Militaire Royal De Saint-Jean, October 21st, 1994]

Mr. Speaker, it is about time that Bloc members recognize and give credit to efforts made by both levels of government and concerned Quebecers to find a new vocation for the Collège militaire royal de Saint-Jean.

On July 19, both governments reached an agreement under which the federal government will provide $25 million over five years to set up a university study centre. Starting September 1995, Quebec will be in charge of the centre's operations. Everyone agrees that this plan will boost the local economy.

Moreover, a working group made up of representatives from the business world, labour, financial institutions, and socio-economic agencies came on board in early September with a view to drawing up an action plan concerning labour re-training and the economic diversification of surrounding communities.

As further proof of the merits of joining one's efforts to those of the various stakeholders, the college is still alive and has a new vocation.

[Social Security Programs, October 20th, 1994]

I see that it hurts when people tell the truth, but the Liberal government has most people's support.

Now for the question of where we will get the money to continue paying pensions, I said that the Liberal Party is committed to protecting seniors and old age pensions and that is what we will continue to do. If there is ever a reform, it will be for later generations and not for those who today are collecting the benefits to which they contributed.

We as the Liberal Party and the government are acting responsibly. We are making a social choice based on respect for those who built this federation.

Basically, I find it quite odious that such a question can be raised today. Clearly, the answer depends on a social choice, a logical social choice. Of course, if the Reform Party were in power, a party which is obviously suffering from the ostrich syndrome and all they do is try to make cuts everywhere, society would have no services. This government promised something in the election campaign and that is what we are doing: to be a responsible government which will attack the deficit while continuing to meet our obligations and maintain services for everyone. I want to tell you that seniors are a priority for us and we will respect them.

[Social Security Programs, October 20th, 1994]

Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. member for his question. When we talk about trusting the government, you need only take a glance at the opinion polls in Canada to see that the Liberal government enjoys the support-