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Crucial Fact

  • His favourite word was federal.

Last in Parliament May 2004, as Canadian Alliance MP for Calgary Southwest (Alberta)

Won his last election, in 2000, with 65% of the vote.

Statements in the House

Supply April 27th, 1995

Madam Speaker, the minister concluded her remarks by expressing her desire to co-operate, collaborate and work with the provinces, and we applaud that. That is constitutionally correct and is the only way the system will be fixed.

However in the course of her remarks she used an unfortunate phrase. I trust it was a slip of the tongue when she asked rhetorically how we can coerce the provinces into national standards if we do not retain the present system.

Surely the minister is aware that she is losing her capacity to coerce the provinces as federal cash transfers decline. She is also aware that it is possible to have national standards without coercion as we have, for example, in the field of education where there is the universal standard that everyone under 16 years of age gets a free education. That was established as a national standard without any national education act or coercion on the part of the federal government.

This talk of coercing the provinces into national standards as her financial position weakens is completely contrary to the spirit of federalism and what she said later on. I should like to give the minister an opportunity to withdraw that statement and indicate that she did not mean in any way, shape or form to say she favours coercion of the provinces, which is a polite word for blackmail, into national health care standards.

Supply April 27th, 1995

In response to the first question: Is the current system the most cost effective in the world? No, it is not. This is obvious. This is not a matter for debate. Study after study has indicated that the costs are out of control with respect to the Canadian system and therefore it cannot be the most cost effective.

The fact that more and more Canadians are seeking health care outside the Canadian system itself is evident that there is something wrong.

The government itself professes a great abhorrence of the American system. We do not agree with the American system. We are not advocating anything of the kind. However, because of the actions of the government, it is driving more and more Canadians to subsidize the American system to the tune of hundreds of millions of dollars a year because they will not stay on the waiting lists here.

The hon. member is a physician himself. Has he ever sent a patient to get health care in the United States because they could not get it here or were on a great waiting list under our current system?

Supply April 27th, 1995

I have two comments. I appreciate the fact that the member is concerned about superficiality. I would earnestly suggest if she reads the speech the Prime Minister gave on this subject in Saskatoon and if she reads the speeches that have been given by the Minister of Health, we have a superficiality that betrays the government's position today.

With respect to core services, we think core services should be those services deemed essential to the health care of Canadians as defined by health care users, practitioners, local administrators and provincial governments.

I explained in my speech specifically that we should not try to say what those services are. That is what got Ottawa into trouble in the first place. It made a commitment to a whole range of services which it could not continue to fund.

At every public meeting and meetings with the medical community that I have had where I have put this health care matrix up, you can get an excellent discussion and definition from those people if you put up that matrix. I suggest that if the minister and the member want to know, go and ask the people whose opinion on that definition is the one that counts.

Supply April 27th, 1995

Madam Speaker, I would remind the minister that while there is only a handful of us here in the House her remarks on this subject are being carefully monitored these days by the practitioners and administrators and particularly by the provinces. The statements made here that completely deny the reality of the health care system do no service to this House nor to the government's position on the seriousness of the problem. They create the impression that we literally do not understand how the system works. That is a discredit to the minister and the government.

From what the minister says, we can tell her views of what Reform said during the election are based on what a clipping service says Reform is about. They bear no resemblance whatsoever to the positions we have articulated, particularly the Reform colleagues with medical backgrounds.

With respect to her particular question of how we facilitate the payment for services for people in this category of poor services, the minister could not have been listening to what I said. We say we should define a set of core services that are essential to the care of Canadians. Those are the services to which we would dedicate entirely the federal and provincial contributions to the funding of medicare. Those services would be brought within the financial reach of every Canadian no matter where they lived, regardless of their ability to pay. The non-essential services can be provided through other financing sources such as insurance and even user pay. That is perfectly clear.

These proposals have been presented by other health care reformers in the health care field itself and in the provinces. It is time for the minister to acknowledge them for what they are, not to pretend they are something else.

Supply April 27th, 1995

There was a promise to provide a new blueprint for social reform. It was broken without apology or explanation when the Minister of Human Resources Development failed to deliver his green paper.

There was a promise not to increase the tax load on the long suffering, overtaxed Canadian taxpayer. It was broken to the tune of $500 million a year with the imposition of a 1.5 cent a litre tax on gasoline.

There was a promise of a more open Parliament where MPs would be free from party discipline. It was dictatorially broken when Liberal MPs who voted against the government's gun control bill were stripped of their committee positions.

The first part of the motion we are considering draws attention to yet another broken Liberal promise, one of the most serious of all. For the benefit of members, this is the connection between broken promises and the motion.

When national medicare was introduced at the federal level by a minority Liberal government 30 years ago, Prime Minister Pearson solemnly promised Canadians, the provinces and the House that the federal government would pay 50 per cent of the costs. This was the fiscal promise on which medicare rested. This was the condition insisted on by the provinces and promised by the federal government, a promise without which the provinces would not have agreed to national medicare.

The Liberals even wrote that promise into the old 1966 medical care act, section 5, which stated that "the amount of the contribution payable by Canada to a province in respect to a medical care insurance plan is an amount equal to 50 per cent of". It then went on to list the various cost components of the plan.

What is the state of that sacred promise today? Today the federal government's contribution to health care funding is not 50 per cent as promised. It is now less than 23 per cent and falling.

The Prime Minister and the health minister can profess their undying commitment to the principles of medicare until they retire from public life clutching their two-tier MP pension. The truth of the matter is that every day, every hour in every province, in every community, in every part of the country, whenever and wherever Canadians draw on national medicare, the government is breaking its fundamental promise to pay 50 per cent of the bill.

Because it is breaking that fundamental financial promise it is slowly undermining the other principles of medicare. It undermines accessibility as waiting lists get longer and longer. It undermines comprehensiveness as more and more health services are delisted from provincial insurance plans. It undermines universality as the system evolves into a multi-tier system with access to the various tiers being tied increasingly to ability to pay.

The second part of the motion before the House proposes a solution to this dilemma, which I will get to in a moment. Before I do so I would like to clear away one of the myths of medicare, a myth to which the Prime Minister and the health minister cling, a myth which prevents a clear diagnosis of the problem and the solution. That myth is that Canada has a one-tier medical system to which all Canadians have universal access regardless of ability to pay and opening up the Canada Health Act will lead to a U.S. style two-tiered system where ability to pay is the key to access.

The indisputable fact is that Canada already has a multi-tiered health care system, access to which has been made more restricted by rising health care costs and declining federal support. The challenge is to reform medicare so that one of those tiers contains all the essential health services required by Canadians, financed by sufficient federal and provincial funding so that no Canadian is denied access to those services because of inability to pay.

How to do that I will discuss in a moment. Lest there be some simple minded folk among us who still cling to the notion that Canada still has a single-tiered medical care system, let me submit evidence to the contrary.

I could quote from the exhaustive 1994 health care study by Dr. Ralph Sutherland and Dr. Jane Fulton entitled "Spending Smarter and Spending Less". On pages 98 and 99 of that study, they discussed the myth of the one-tier system and dismiss it as nonsense. They end by saying that the two-tier system is and always has been a reality in Canada.

They then go on to discuss how to make a multi-tier system work for the benefit of all Canadians which is the real challenge and real problem. Rather than quote extensively from the academic or technical literature, I prefer to share with the House a note I received just yesterday from a Canadian physician to whom I put the question, does Canada presently have a one-tier or two-tier system?

He says flatly that a two-tier system already exists. Should a person be admitted to a hospital, he or she can obtain a private room should he or she have the funds to pay for it or an insurance program that covers it. Otherwise this is not available.

People can hire a private duty nurse for 24-hour care if they can afford to pay for it. Many nursing and home care services are also available should the patient be able to afford to pay for them.

Recently midwifery has been introduced. Again this is only available to those who can afford to pay for these services. People can have access to procedures such as abortions in private facilities if they are able to pay the private facility fee.

People who can afford to may have an insurance plan to cover the cost of pharmaceuticals. Those who cannot afford to pay this fee must pay for it out of their own pocket.

The Workers' Compensation Board in this province has contracted many private facilities to provide services for its clients in order for them to obtain these services more quickly than possible in the public system and thus get them back to work in a more timely fashion.

Members of the military have been flown to the base hospital in Ottawa to have surgical procedures performed rather than being on a waiting list. I have also recently learned that the military purchases surgical procedures such as arthroscopies at private clinics as it is cheaper than purchasing the same procedures through the public sector.

As well, we all know the ultimate two-tier system is available to those who can afford to pay for it by leaving the country and having services provided in the United States.

Many leading edge technologies and therapies are not available in this country. In order to obtain them one must leave the country and purchase them in the U.S. A country of our stature should be ashamed of the fact that it is not able to provide those services.

He concludes by saying: "As I hope is demonstrated by the above examples, almost all aspects of health care in Canada are two-tiered and available to people on a private basis except for the physician's services. This and certain procedures which are only available in public hospitals are the only services that are not presently available in two tiers in this country".

Why on earth the Prime Minister and the health minister would continue to deny the existence of a multi-tiered health care system or to pretend that the five criteria of the Canada Health Act preclude such a system is beyond me. Childlike belief in the myths of medicare at the highest levels of the federal government must end if the problems of Canadian health care are to be resolved.

The second portion of the motion before us indicates the way in which Reform believes the government could guarantee universal access for all Canadians to a set of essential health services regardless of ability to pay in a multi-tiered system.

In order to provide secure funding for health care into the 21st century, substantive discussions and negotiations are required among all the key players: representatives of health care users, taxpayers, health care practitioners, health care administrators, health care insurers, the provinces and the federal government.

Reform proposes that these discussions and negotiations should focus on completing a health care funding matrix such as that shown on page 48 of the Reform taxpayers budget.

This is the type of framework for refinancing health care, saving medicare, which the Prime Minister and the federal government should have provided through that national health care forum which they have not. This is the framework required to produce meaningful amendments to the Canada Health Act, amendments which the health minister continues to fail to provide. This framework suggests that the first item on the agenda should be a discussion of how best to divide essential health services into core services and non-core services.

The core services would be those health care services most essential to Canadians, the financing of which would be guaranteed by the federal and provincial governments up to some minimal national standard. They would be those services which make the most demonstrable contribution to improving the health of Canadians and which must be provided in the most cost effective way possible.

These core services would constitute the heart of medicare. All Canadians would be guaranteed access to these services across the country up to some national standard regardless of their ability to pay.

Provinces and individuals would be allowed to provide and secure services that went beyond the core services if they so desired. The federal government would not be involved in the financing of such services.

Services designated as non-core services, for example, cosmetic surgery as distinguished from more necessary surgery or

fibreglass casts for broken limbs as distinct from plaster casts, would be funded through a more flexible combination of funding sources, including private insurance and user pay.

To those members opposite who will challenge us to elaborate on what should be considered core and non-core services, I would invite them to listen carefully to my medical colleagues, the member for Macleod and the member for Esquimalt-Juan de Fuca, and ask questions at the end of those remarks.

I would encourage all MPs to refrain from getting too deeply into that discussion. It is not our role in the federal Parliament, either constitutionally or practically. It is not the role of a distant federal government that is paying less than one-quarter of the bills to define those services. That is the old way. It is the top down way. It is the Meech Lake approach to medicare. It is the centralizing way and it is not the way of the future.

The definition of those services must primarily come from health care users, the people who use them, from the practitioners who actually practice them and from the administrators at the local and provincial levels. We should do everything we can through parliamentary committees, personal speeches and dialogue, through the national health care forum to facilitate those discussions and to listen. But we should not try to dictate the final division of services.

After those discussions occur, our role will be to commit federal funding to whatever Canadians define as core services, up to some minimal national standard in co-operation with the provinces.

There is no question in my mind that there is an urgent need for health care reform in Canada, particularly in light of the failure of the federal budget to eliminate the deficit. These reforms are required to preserve the best features of the present system; to prevent the funding system from being completely destroyed by interest on the debt; to provide flexibility to allow the provinces' health care administrators and physicians to better adapt to the health care needs of Canadians.

Canadians are asking and will continue to ask: From whom is the leadership for health care reform going to come? I would suggest it is not coming from the federal government under the current Prime Minister or health minister. They resist every proposal for change. They resist the diagnosis that would lead to real proposals for change. They charge anyone who advocates change with being an enemy of medicare, which is a reactionary position, or a proponent of U.S. style health care, charges which are completely untrue. They are only dragged into the discussion of health care reform at all by their officials telling them that if they do not do something, the system is going to collapse and they are going to carry the blame.

Therefore I suggest that the leadership for health care reform, and it is occurring in many spheres, where the public is now ahead of the politicians and the government, must come from the patient user community, from taxpayers, from the medical community, from administrators and local governments, from provincial authorities, from the bottom up, not the top down.

If in 1960 Ottawa had had the monopoly it has today on setting terms and conditions of health care services and financing, the present medicare system would not have come into being. Canadian medicare did not start in Ottawa. It did not start anywhere near Ottawa. It started in Saskatchewan and it really started there in an operational sense with the Swift Current Hospital District in that province.

The concept was incorporated by the old CCF into its political platform and then stolen by the federal Liberals. I can assure concerned citizens and real health care reformers across the country they will find allies and advocates of sensible change to the health care system in the Reform caucus.

I urge all hon. members who wish to save and advance the best features of Canadian medicare to support this motion.

Supply April 27th, 1995

moved:

That this House recognize that since the inception of our national health care system the federal share of funding for health care in Canada has fallen from 50 per cent to 23 per cent and therefore the House urges the government to consult with the provinces and other stakeholders to determine core services to be completely funded by the federal and provincial governments and non-core services where private insurance and the benefactors of the services might play a supplementary role.

Madam Speaker, I rise to address the Reform motion before the House, but before I do so I would like to say a word about broken promises.

One of the reasons there is so much public cynicism about politics and government is that governments consistently break their promises. This Liberal government, for example, is not yet two years old but already it has littered the political landscape with broken promises.

For example, there was the promise to base key federal appointments solely on competence rather than patronage, a promise routinely broken almost every week.

There was the promise by the now Deputy Prime Minister to resign if the GST was not replaced within one year of the election, shamelessly broken on October 25, 1994.

There was the promise not to alter federal-provincial transfers without the full co-operation of the provinces, which was broken by the introduction of the Canada social transfer in the February budget.

There was the promise to provide a new blueprint-

Atlantic Groundfish Strategy April 26th, 1995

Mr. Speaker, if the minister could tell me when we are going to go, I am perfectly willing to go.

TAGS is part of a bigger project. It was originally billed as a test run for the whole human resources approach to social security reform. The test has been a failure. TAGS was meant to tie income support to training, education and retraining, and it has not done that. Instead it is another example of a Liberal social megaproject that simply does not work. It is based on principles that do not work.

Has the minister learned anything-and I know this is a challenging question-from his disastrous social experiment? How will the failure of TAGS affect his overall program of social policy reform?

Atlantic Groundfish Strategy April 26th, 1995

It is not working.

Atlantic Groundfish Strategy April 26th, 1995

Mr. Speaker, we all know that TAGS is a fiscal disaster, but the most tragic aspect of the program is the fact that it fails the very people it was designed to help.

When TAGS was announced it was supposed to break the cycle of dependency. The government predicted not that 25,000 fishery workers would be counselled but that they would be retrained for new jobs in new industries. Yet $40 million later HRD officials admit that less than 12,000 people have even participated in the program, that precious few have found any work, and that now money is being diverted from the training aspects of the program back into dependency support.

How does the minister plan to change TAGS so as to produce the results and the hope for affected Canadians in Atlantic Canada about whom he professes to be so passionately concerned?

Atlantic Groundfish Strategy April 26th, 1995

Mr. Speaker, this week the federal debt passed the $550 billion mark. Yet the government's mismanagement of taxpayers' money continues. The latest example, TAGS, the Atlantic groundfish strategy with $1.9 billion committed over five years, is a program already headed for a $385 million shortfall. Worst of all, it provides little in the way of concrete results.

My question is for the Minister of Human Resources Development. How much more federal money is the government planning to commit to this ill designed and unsuccessful program?