Yves Lessard

[Committees of the House, February 5th, 2008]

Mr. Speaker, I am going to point out that I am happy to speak at this point in the debate on the motion by my colleague from Montmagny—L'Islet—Kamouraska—Rivière-du-Loup. This is a timely motion, even though it was presented at the Standing Committee on Finance on November 28, 2007. That shows how the Bloc Québécois had already been involved for many months in trying to get the government to take initiatives to help these two sectors: forestry and manufacturing. I would even say many years, since this is the kind of thing we were already doing when the previous government was in power.

What makes this motion even more relevant today is that it gives us an opportunity to do something about the measure taken in relation to the $1 billion trust. Other colleagues have in fact told us that this $1 billion is too little. In fact, $1 billion is not enough to meet the crisis. It is allocated unfairly and means that the two sectors concerned are not really being supported to a level that meets the problem they are having. When we look at the $228 million in Quebec for two sectors, we see that we are getting $114 million per sector over three years. That means an average of $36 million per year. When we look at the extent of the crisis in both those sectors, that is too little.

I will illustrate my point by saying that in Quebec we are talking about 536,000 jobs and $22 billion in wages, 17% of all jobs in 2005 and nearly 21% of income from employment; that is three times more than in Alberta. In recent years, and particularly the last three years, 88,000 jobs have been lost in forestry and the sawmills. There are 230 towns and villages that depend mainly on the forestry industry and 160 towns and villages that depend exclusively on the forestry industry: nearly one half of the forestry-based communities in Canada. The forestry industry is central to how the land has been settled in Quebec. This is worth pointing out.

The manufacturing crisis, I would point out, is very serious; it looks like this: 78,000 manufacturing jobs have been lost in Quebec since the Conservatives came to power. It is as if our friends from Quebec, who were strutting around just now, had not seen this. As well, 21,000 jobs have been lost in the forestry industry alone, including related service industries like transportation and forestry equipment. That is half of the total job losses in Canada since April 2005. The statistics end in the summer of 2007, however, but there are situations that have worsened in a number of municipalities and my colleague, the member for Saint-Maurice—Champlain, illustrated this clearly a moment ago.

The Conservative government is arguing that it has reduced taxes to help these industries. But when companies are not making any money and people are not working, tax reductions are useless. Where they are useful is in industries that are booming, such as the oil industry. My colleagues who were strutting around do not seem to realize that the oil companies will save $2.8 billion in taxes over the next three years.

They will save $2.8 billion over three years. That means $922 million in 2008 alone. That is what this government has done: it has taken steps to support the sectors of the economy that are working well, but it has done nothing to support industries in difficulty. That is the Conservative doctrine: support the oil industry and the war industry.

[Committees of the House, February 5th, 2008]

Mr. Speaker, I want to begin by congratulating the hon. member for Joliette, for the quality and relevance of his remarks.

At this point, I think it is quite appropriate to show and reaffirm that the Canadian government has the means to take action, and that it must do so right away. The crisis is going on now, and people are suffering now.

I have a question for my colleague. He spoke very briefly about the impact of this on workers. For example, the measures proposed by the Bloc include $1.5 billion to help workers. Out of that amount, $60 million would be allocated to POWA, the Program for Older Worker Adjustment. When plants shut down, 20% of the workers affected are over 55 years of age. I wonder if my colleague could elaborate on the relevancy of this measure.

[Youth Criminal Justice Act, February 4th, 2008]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague from Brome—Missisquoi who, by the way, is doing a great job on the whole issue of social housing.

I wanted to mention it because the issue of housing is not extraneous to crime. In fact, as has been said, faced with poverty, individuals have to deal with a whole set of factors, such as inadequate housing that is too expensive and the lack of affordable housing.

Employment insurance is part of the problem. In fact, 60% of the unemployed do not receive any employment insurance benefits. This situation leads to impoverishment and young people with nothing to do. When parents are poor, children are poor also.

My colleague is quite right. Various measures are being taken in my riding. Cities are hiring street workers; this was unprecedented in semi-urban or rural ridings. It is now part of our reality.

I was speaking earlier about the organization POSA. With limited means, these people are able to rent a small space where they create tools for youth who they find in parks and in the street, and some of whom have already committed petty crimes, as is often the case. They get them interested in, for example, the arts, trades or different aspects of life. They try to reintegrate youth by helping them to identify their interests. Every young person has an interest and help is available. They do extraordinary work. They could show us how to work with these young people.

[Youth Criminal Justice Act, February 4th, 2008]

Mr. Speaker, I am particularly glad to join in the discussion of this bill because it gives me an opportunity to highlight the rather exceptional guidance and prevention work being done by many organizations in our society and in Quebec with young people. In my own riding of Chambly—Borduas and in the city of Chambly itself, the organization known as POSA has had a remarkable impact and is doing the most exemplary work with young people.

In this type of debate, we need to think about the other stakeholders in our society who are helping young people to find direction in their lives. Often, these are young people who have nothing to do.

I want to come back to the latest remarks of my New Democratic colleague. She said that what is of greatest concern about the bill is what is not in it. That astounds me because what should concern us most of all is what the bill actually says. There are two things the bill says. First, exemplary sentences are needed to deal with youth crime. That means from now on we will be using an approach that is currently reserved for adults. I will come back to that point. Second, pre-trial detention will be permitted. It is rather troubling that a young person, a teenager, would have to prove that he or she is not a danger to society even before a trial begins. That is rather troubling because it is a presumption that the teenager could be guilty.

In court, it often happens that a person is not found guilty of the crime that he or she has been charged with. This means that even before the trial takes place, if a person does not want to be imprisoned as a preventive measure, he or she must demonstrate to some degree that they did not commit that crime. People will say that is not how it is going to happen. The person need only demonstrate that he or she is not a danger to society. However, if a serious crime has been committed and the person was not involved in the crime, he or she will have to show that they were not involved.

Already, we are focusing on evidence that should be presented during a trial. There is something perverse in that; something that implies in some way that the presumption of innocence no longer applies at the first stage when we are dealing with young people. That is sometimes understandable when we are looking at measures that apply to adults because an adult may have a criminal background suggesting that he or she could re-offend or represent a danger to society based on previous evidence or charges brought before the courts.

This is the approach as things now stand and the NDP is aligning itself with that approach. That the New Democrats would take such a position surprises me a great deal. As for the Conservatives, not much about their take on crime surprises us. They are not very interested in prevention. Repression is the focus and if they can make the penalties tougher all around they will do so.

This approach also flies in the face of the youth crime policies that have been in place in Quebec for more than 30 years. These prevention-based policies have proven themselves. As I said earlier when I asked my colleague a question, the current system in Quebec, with its focus on prevention, has led to a significant reduction in youth crime. As a result, there are four times fewer criminal cases in Quebec than in the United States and 25% fewer than in Canada.

Canada as a whole has three times fewer criminal cases than the United States. Yet the Conservatives are copying the American model. We know the result. The heaviest U.S. penalties are still banned here, such as the death penalty, which cannot even produce such results.

What is most important? To turn these young people into criminals and set them on a course that will inevitably lead to the same situation as in the United States? That will multiply the number of criminals once these young people are adults.

Quebec is not in favour of that. Not only is the Bloc Québécois opposed to that, but in 2003, the National Assembly of Quebec unanimously passed a motion to maintain the system in Quebec.

In addition, the measures proposed in clauses 1 and 2 of Bill C-25 are not insignificant. They run counter to a whole philosophy of Canadian law. The Supreme Court summarized the principles behind youth sentencing in this way in a 2006 judgment:

The YCJA introduced a new sentencing regime, and its wording can only support the conclusion that Parliament deliberately excluded general deterrence as a factor of youth sentencing. By virtue of section 50(1) of the YCJA, the provisions of the Criminal Code on sentencing, save certain listed exceptions, do not apply to youth sentencing.

They do apply to adult sentencing. I could go on since my point is proven many times in this Supreme Court ruling.

What is happening today is not routine or unimportant. This principle will be changed. The sentence imposed on a youth will from now on be imposed as a deterrent the same way it is for a hardened adult criminal. However, experience shows that if we take that route we will keep turning out more criminals, and hardened ones at that.

I again invite our colleagues in the House of Commons to vote with us on this bill, including at second reading, so that we do not sanction this principle here in the House of Commons. This is not theory. This is not a Conservative philosophy that should prevail here. This is not the Canadian tradition of justice, nor is it Quebec's tradition, far from it.

Our colleagues would be making a serious mistake by voting in favour of this bill, including at second reading.

We believe the amendment made to the legislation in 2001 was a mistake because it created an opening for excessive court handling of youth crime. This has considerably complicated the reintegration of young offenders.

The focus here should be on providing guidance for these young people, prevention measures, and funding for agencies like POSA, in my riding, as I was saying earlier. That is our position. That is why we will vote against this bill.

[Youth Criminal Justice Act, February 4th, 2008]

Mr. Speaker, the members of the Bloc Québécois are rather surprised by the NDP's position on Bill C-25.

If I understand correctly, some members want to ensure that the bill passes second reading. However, all the arguments presented would normally lead us to believe that the NDP will vote against it. Why? Because the very foundation of this bill goes against the principles defended by the NDP. Its foundation is one of repression. They are supporting the repression of young people and adolescents, while what seems to be working so far is guidance as a means of prevention.

For example, the United States still has the death penalty for the most serious crimes. We all know what kind of results that produces. The crime rate is three times lower in Canada and four times lower in Quebec. Why? Because the strategy established by both governments, the policy maintained, is one of prevention. In Quebec, that policy is even more energetically applied.

How can the NDP now justify its position, which favours repression over prevention?

[Older Workers, February 4th, 2008]

Mr. Speaker, also on November 28, the Bloc Québécois recommended to the government $1.5 billion in support measures for workers affected by the crisis, including $60 million for an income support program for older workers who cannot be retrained.

The Minister of Finance can no longer plead ignorance to justify his lack of action. Now that he is familiar with our proposed measures, will he implement them?

[Older Workers, January 29th, 2008]

There is a problem that education and retraining will never be able to handle: the case of older workers, with little education and for whom existing programs are of no use. In recent months, the tabling of a report has been delayed at least twice. These older workers have been waiting long enough.

Will the minister take responsibility and establish a real income support program for older workers, commonly known as POWA?

[Employment Insurance, January 29th, 2008]

Mr. Speaker, today Statistics Canada reported that manufacturers themselves plan to cut back their production and increase layoffs in the next three months. The crisis is worsening and thousands of workers will lose their jobs.

The government has a number of options, including modernizing the employment insurance program and creating a special $1.5 billion reserve to counter the anticipated recession.

Does the government intend to follow up on these suggestions and improve the existing employment insurance scheme?

[Older Workers, December 5th, 2007]

Mr. Speaker, for people from Alberta like him, everything is great and the oil companies provide lots of jobs. But in Quebec, the manufacturing sector is tumbling down like a house of cards.

What is the government's plan for older workers who cannot find work? Will it tell them to move to Alberta to help the oil companies, as suggested by the member's colleague in the regional development agency? Or will it fund a POWA at a cost of $60 million out of the $1.7 billion employment insurance fund surplus?

[Older Workers, December 5th, 2007]

Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Human Resources and Social Development claims that we lack faith in the people of Quebec. He, however, lacks compassion. Older workers have been losing their jobs because of numerous closures in the manufacturing and forestry sectors. Those aged 55 and over who, for the most part, have neither training nor experience in other areas cannot find new jobs.

I will therefore repeat my question: What is the government doing for these people? When will it come up with a real income support program to help them?