Greenhouse Gas Pollution Pricing Act  Before going on to the significance of the bill to my constituents, I want to take note of a few observations made by the independent PBO, and that is a gagged PBO, by the way. The PBO reports that Canadians will pay, in addition to the carbon tax, another $486 million, so another half a billion dollars, in GST on top of the carbon tax by 2030. This is a tax on a tax. In 2022, the carbon tax also cost $82.6 million just to administer.

The Economy  Their rent or mortgage, food bill, or whatever it may be, is becoming too much to bear. We are seeing a correlation revolving around the carbon tax. The more that the government increases the carbon tax, the farther it is putting people behind, and the more people are using food banks. According to the Parliamentary Budget Officer, if Bill C-234 passes, the common-sense conservative bill, it would save Canadian farmers $1 billion in carbon taxes in the coming years, with zero rebates.

Government Operations committee  In very general terms, the pricing approach would be preferred, but a pricing approach that is revenue-neutral and whereby we're taking the revenue from carbon taxes and putting it into tax reductions in things like income tax reductions is the approach that we would, in very general terms, prefer. I think the worst scenario is to have the pricing, and then layering on of regulations, where sometimes there is duplication, and we haven't considered the unintended consequences of when we have multiple different rules trying to do the same thing.

Government Operations committee  I think I have heard that in the short time I have been here today. Put that together with the carbon tax, which is already hurting small and medium-sized businesses, and with the increases that are going to be contemplated all along the way. I know, Mr. Greco, that you asked to return to this committee—that you have been here before, provided some testimony and asked if you could come back.

Industry committee  We haven't done the evaluation. However, I would consider that it may actually be the same argument given for the carbon tax, for example, where it's very difficult to really narrow down that one factor and how that one factor can impact. It will actually impact the productivity of our agri-food sector and the competitiveness of our food sector, but retail is always difficult.

Government Operations committee  In your opinion, how will the continued increase in the carbon tax impact Canada's current cost of living crisis, when 56% of small businesses are raising prices while also freezing or reducing wages?

Greenhouse Gas Pollution Pricing Act  This is false. We import most of our propane from Sarnia, Ontario. If we buy it in Ontario, where the carbon tax applies, we pay the carbon tax when it is imported. It is a fact, that is the math. Already, something is not quite right in the Bloc Québécois's discourse. We also pay the carbon tax indirectly when we pay for imported products delivered to grocery stories.

Government Operations committee  Greco, the last time the Chamber of Commerce was here, April 10, I asked you a question on the impact of the $2.5 billion promised in carbon tax revenues that has not been returned to small businesses since 2019. In budget 2024, the Minister of Finance stated that she has now created the new Canada carbon rebate for small businesses, which will return this $2.5 billion to small and medium-sized businesses.

Government Operations committee  I think, at the end of the day, we want to look at how things can be more affordable for Canadians. What we've said is that any carbon tax revenue for SMEs has to be returned back to revenue in order to help with the machinery, equipment and technology that help small businesses grow. If we don't have affordability in the minds of Canadians, it's a challenge.

Government Operations committee  Another organization that testified at this committee, the CFIB, stated that small businesses pay about 40% of the carbon tax but are eligible for only approximately 5% of the rebates. This is already a decrease from the previous 9% they could claim. In your opinion, how would this impact Canada's productivity and the ability for small businesses to grow?

Industry committee  I will now turn to Dr. Charlebois. I would like to know if the carbon tax is driving up the price of the food we buy in stores.

Taxation  They say that it will only affect 0.13% of Canadians, but this is the same government that tells us we get back more in the carbon tax rebate than we pay in carbon tax. It is laughable. At a time when Canada desperately needs investment, growth and innovators, the government is pushing them out the door. This is not the answer.

Industry committee  If you want to encourage investment, sending signals that you will increase taxes on capital gains, for example, and, of course, the carbon tax policy, are certainly not things that investors want to hear. It's discouraging investments overall, I would say.

Industry committee  You've said that manufacturing is the “forgotten child” of the food supply chain. We're certainly looking at the carbon tax being a policy that has increased compared to our neighbours to the south but also, now, at new changes that are coming to capital gains adjustments to revitalizing food manufacturing in Canada, and we're talking about food insecurity.

Finance committee  When taking into account the economic or the indirect payments...and what do we mean by that? We mean the cost the carbon tax adds to trucking the food and adds to the farmers, and that will all funnel its way down eventually to the Canadian consumer. As Mr. Giroux said, the majority of Canadians will face a net loss.