Environment committee  It has been mentioned, Ms. Gélinas, that the previous government wanted to invest close to $6 billion in climate change activities. $1.6 billion was actually spent, which means that there is still $4.5 billion floating around somewhere. Actually, I am not sure I understand correctly. We really do not know whether this money has been spent.

Environment committee  My colleague was saying earlier that we will revisit the smog issue for next year's report. We have looked here and there at some air quality issues, but not as we did for climate change, with one focus and covering the broader aspects of it. But as Richard is involved in the production of the 2007 report already, he can give you a few details about how we will look at this air quality issue.

Environment committee  I appreciate that. Could we pass on, then, to the climate change issue? I just wanted a general answer. But that is coming.

Environment committee  So whatever targets and measures are put in place, if the governance and accountability aspects are not looked at seriously, I will probably be here again five years from now and have an almost cut-and-paste copy of this section. I also would like to remind you that in 1998 we looked at climate change and almost said the same thing. So things have not evolved that much in terms of good governance and accountability. Mr. Cullen was asking who was responsible for what, and I can still not tell who is responsible for what.

Environment committee  The last thing you need to know is that even though Treasury Board now is working on this framework--and you will remember that Treasury Board came here and talked about the RMAF, the framework for the pilot on climate change, to develop this framework on horizontal issues. The reality is still that even though the Treasury Board has committed to develop the framework, it's unclear who will take over when the framework is finalized.

Environment committee  There was some economic analysis, but it was not detailed. We couldn't find any social, environmental, and risk analysis linked to this. Climate change is not only about the environment, it's also about sustainable development; it's about our way of living, because it's linked to energy. So we would expect that kind of analysis to be done.

Environment committee  They saw there was a situation that needed to be better controlled, and they decided to pilot this. With respect to climate change and horizontal issues involving a number of departments, they wanted to put a system in place so that we could capture this kind of information, so they piloted--

Environment committee  I'm trying to understand this--and I asked you this question during the last committee hearing. Who is in charge? What minister was in charge of climate change in Canada?

Environment committee  It's complicated, because, again, departments do not capture the information in a way that is user friendly. Things are not coded the right way, and what is climate change and what is something else--sometimes it's not obvious. They call things different things. But we were still able to get to the amount of money spent on those programs.

Environment committee  Do you think this tool would still be advantageous for Canada and that it should be taken into consideration in the future climate change mitigation plan?

Environment committee  Yes. The National Climate Change Secretariat produced a report in 2003, if I'm not mistaken, the latest one. Their function was one of coordination amongst the departments.

Environment committee  From what I understand, you do not consider this system a panacea, but instead an interesting climate change mitigation policy tool. Moreover, I am very happy that you are urging the government to establish this type of mechanism. As you said, the previous government generated considerable delays.

Environment committee  The only thing I can say at this stage is that it will be interesting to get answers from the departments. On the basis of what we have seen on the climate change file, many times decisions were made without sound analyses and good analyses. So in this case, if this is the way to go, as an auditor I will tell the departments to make sure this is based on a good analysis.

Environment committee  Would it be useful if every year the Minister of the Environment had to come up with a climate change plan that would report, as you have asked, on such things as what measures have been taken to meet our obligations under Kyoto concerning emission limits--market-based mechanisms, spending and fiscal measures--and the date those are supposed to come into force; the amount of greenhouse gas emissions that would be expected to come from each of those; and what we did last year and and how we're meeting that standard?

Environment committee  That's great to hear, because tomorrow night we're going to be voting on such an idea, Bill C-288, proposed by my friend, Pablo Rodriguez, to ensure we meet our global climate change obligations under Kyoto. If the bill passes, we'll be debating it here, but it's good to hear the principles will be extremely useful. I'd like to move on to the issue you alluded to in your remarks in the press conference and during your report, the whole question of short-term and long-term goals.