Procedure and House Affairs Committee on Dec. 11th, 2023

[The Chair, Liberal, Bardish Chagger]

Excellent.

I will just say that, per my list when it comes to the Speaker, we want the records regarding the video for whoever you communicated with. All exchanges would be appreciated in both official languages, and the date of the interview that you had with Laura Stone has also been requested.

Do all members agree that this is the information we are asking for?

Mr. Cooper, do you have a point of order?

[Michael Cooper, Conservative, St. Albert—Edmonton, AB]

Just on that point, Madam Chair, as far as what we understand Mr. Fergus is agreeing upon—and, again, I'll put it to him—it is all emails, memoranda and records of communications in his control in relation to the video tribute, as well as any emails, memoranda and records of communications, including text messages, instant messages, etc., under his control concerning his interview with Laura Stone. It is also any recording or transcript under his control of his interview with Laura Stone, as well as any communications that he has had with John Fraser.

[Greg Fergus, Liberal, Hull—Aylmer, QC]

Madam Chair, with regard to the interview with Ms. Stone, we will certainly provide it to you. The only concern that I have is making sure that we can provide it in French, but we are going to get on this right away.

I understand that the committee has precedence over every aspect of resources of the House, to make sure that the information can be given to the members and supplied to them quickly, so I will provide all of that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bardish Chagger]

Okay. That was a little bit more than what I had heard. I'm not sure, but obviously that's what members want. The more we ask, the harder it is to obtain information because, when it comes to our two official languages and the people who do it, that is a very limited resource, even when things are not under pressure like this item is.

Mrs. Romanado.

[Sherry Romanado, Liberal, Longueuil—Charles-LeMoyne, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I'm sorry, but that was not what I heard coming out of that. This is adding additional stuff. I understand that, if it is the will of the committee, it is the will of the committee, but my concern, again, is to be able to receive all of these documents in both official languages in advance of a deadline. I think we're making it harder and harder for this committee to meet that deadline, to be honest.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bardish Chagger]

I will just put on the record that, as chair, I am reporting back to the House on Thursday, based on what the committee has. If it is not in both official languages, I, as chair, will not be reporting back. That's what I will state in the House.

Mr. Speaker is well aware of the resources, and I think that we do have agreement from him to provide, as quickly as possible and in both official languages, as much information as he can.

With that, I can do a quick minute. I have to end by half past.

[Eric Duncan, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

If we go a couple more minutes, we can each have a five-minute round.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bardish Chagger]

No, we can't because we need a health break. Then I have other people coming, and my resources are limited.

Would you like a minute or not for a quick question?

[Eric Duncan, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

Yes. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Mr. Speaker, do you agree that it was poor judgment on your part, while in Washington, D.C., to make comments at a retirement party for a Liberal friend of yours, Claus Gramckow, about your partisan history with the Young Liberals of Canada? You were part of an official Speaker delegation that originated before you became Speaker.

Do you believe that your comments, again, that night were a breach of the code that we've been talking about with regard to partisan politics for a Speaker delegation?

[Greg Fergus, Liberal, Hull—Aylmer, QC]

I'd just like to provide some context, and I would also like to be able to provide context on those comments. I used that reference only to place it within time. The error that I made is that I should have talked about the year that I met...and not have provided any other context around it.

Given where we are and given what the situation is, it is an error and it is one that won't be repeated. I will not be talking about my past.

[Eric Duncan, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

Again, on Monday morning, you apologized in the House and said that you would do better. Then you changed course. Twenty-four hours later, you committed the same issue again.

[Greg Fergus, Liberal, Hull—Aylmer, QC]

The point is that it was just a biographical reference. The aha moment came a little later that week in speaking with a member of the opposition as to why just talking about my biography was a problem.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bardish Chagger]

Thank you.

That was one minute and 27 seconds.

Mr. Lauzon, the floor is yours for one minute.

[Stéphane Lauzon, Liberal, Argenteuil—La Petite-Nation, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Mr. Fergus, thank you for all the time you have allowed us this morning.

I want to talk to you about consent. When a person decides to make a video, there is always the question of consent. Today, we have clearly understood that you did not give your consent for this video to be shared. I think that this consent is the key point of the meeting today. Although you were wearing your robes and you were in your place of work, I have never felt today that you had given your consent for the video to be made public and for you to find yourself in this situation this morning.

I am going to give you the opportunity now to wrap up, Mr. Fergus. If you had not been wearing your robes and had not been in your office, would you still have made the video? Would you have made it in a private context, at your home?

[Greg Fergus, Liberal, Hull—Aylmer, QC]

No. I would not have given my consent. My consent was not given in that context either.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bardish Chagger]

Thank you so much.

With that, Mr. Speaker, we appreciate your time with us today. We ask that you provide the documents as quickly as possible. You know the parameters within which we're working.

I am suspending the meeting for a health break. We will be starting promptly at 20 minutes to. See you back in less than 10 minutes.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bardish Chagger]

I'm calling the meeting back to order.

We have with us, John Fraser, member of provincial parliament, Legislative Assembly of Ontario.

Mr. Fraser, we thank you for coming, especially on such short notice. You will have up to 10 minutes for your opening comments.

The floor is yours. Welcome to procedure and House affairs.

[John Fraser, Member of Provincial Parliament, Legislative Assembly of Ontario, As an Individual]

Thank you.

Good morning, Chair and members of the committee. Thank you for the opportunity to speak to you today.

I speak French a little, but for this discussion, I will speak in English so I can make sure I am being precise and using the right words.

Please feel free to ask questions in any official language. I won't make you endure my trying to respond in French, because I don't want to take up too much time. Thank you for your acceptance of that.

My name is John Fraser. I am the member of provincial parliament for the riding of Ottawa South and the former interim leader of the Ontario Liberal Party. I was elected in a by-election in 2013 and was subsequently re-elected in 2014 and again in 2018. After the 2018 election until March of 2020, I served as the interim leader of the Ontario Liberal Party. Subsequent to that, after winning another election, in the summer of 2022, I was asked again to serve as interim leader—a position I served in until December 2 of this year.

I am also a friend of Greg Fergus, whom I have known for over 30 years. Although I am 10 years older, our friendship grew through our political community work and our faith. I am here today at the committee's request to discuss his participation in a tribute video to me, which was played at the Ontario leadership event on December 2.

I will begin with a bit of context.

As most members in this room will know, political parties will usually compile a tribute for an outgoing leader. Typically, these tributes will involve family members. In mid-November, through a volunteer, the party asked my family to coordinate a personal video about me, to compile photos and video and audio clips that would speak about my life and about me as a person. You will note that it includes photographs of me as a child, with my parents, my grandparents and my siblings, and with my extended family. These are pictures and words about my life— very personal ones.

The tribute was a surprise. I was not part of these discussions, nor was I made aware of the tribute or its content. As part of this tribute, my wife Linda Hooper called Greg's office and spoke to Mr. Desfossés about providing a brief video clip speaking about me as a person. A video was then returned to the family. As the timeline was short, it was immediately provided to a volunteer at the party who assembled the presentation, which I assume most of you have all now seen.

The request was made to Greg, as a family friend and someone who has known me personally for over 30 years. As the content was to be personal, apart from Greg, the only other non-family member who was asked to participate in the tribute was Dalton McGuinty. Again, that request was made as someone who had known me for more than 30 years and with whom I worked for almost 15.

As anyone who has viewed the series of videos that were used in the tribute can attest, they are deeply personal. Though some identify me as a politician, they are all in reference to me as a person.

The video provided by Greg, though it referenced the political activities that brought us together, was deeply personal and a kind, heartfelt gesture from one friend to another. Both my family and I were moved by its content, and we're deeply sorry that an innocent request has negatively affected Greg and caused undue attention.

I have known Greg for 30 years. For a period of time, we and our families were very close. I know that Greg is a person of integrity, generosity and kindness. He was asked to give a personal tribute to me by my family and that is what he did.

What Greg did was done with kindness, because that is his nature. I deeply regret, again, that this has caused any harm, hurt or undue attention.

I'm happy to take your questions.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bardish Chagger]

Thank you very much.

We will now enter a six-minute round starting with Mr. Cooper.

Mr. Fraser, at this committee, we respect the two official languages, so feel entirely comfortable to speak in the language of your choice.

If you're using the earpiece, please just keep it away from the microphone so that it does not cause a feedback loop. Keep it either in your ear or outside your ear, just not near the mic.

[John Fraser]

I'll keep it away.

I was just going to make a joke. I'm having a hard time fitting it over my ears, but that's another issue altogether. Some of you may have that problem, as well.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bardish Chagger]

People are listening, so it's good to have—

[John Fraser]

If I have my hand here, it's just that I'm trying to keep it in place.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bardish Chagger]

Thank you so much.

Mr. Cooper, you have six minutes.

[Michael Cooper, Conservative, St. Albert—Edmonton, AB]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Mr. Fraser.

As I understand it, your wife, Linda Hooper, had reached out to Mr. Fergus's chief of staff regarding the video. He shot the video. It was sent back to your wife, and then it was turned over to a volunteer connected to the Ontario Liberal Party.

Is that correct?

[John Fraser]

That's correct, yes. It came back.