I want to jump in there, because one of the things we hear as we cross the country is that there's no official measurement of poverty, whether it's market basket or LICO. You raise a great point, because none of those are kept in the Yukon.

My question to you is this. Based on the cost of living here, etc., is there one measurement that you would favour? If we had to come up with a definition of poverty, would it be looking at a market basket? Obviously, the cost here in the north is considerably more for the same types of wages. In Vancouver yesterday people said, “I wouldn't say a living wage, but certainly a wage that was comparable, that would be helpful, would be $11 per hour.” Quite clearly, that would not be the case here because of the cost of housing, etc.

Have you given any thought to the thought process? We'd like to even maybe make a recommendation that we should be looking at one. I realize neither one may be perfect, but it would be nice to at least have a measurement so that we can then determine if we're making progress or not. We have to measure it somehow.

Have there been any thoughts around market basket measures versus LICOs?

9:15 a.m.

Representative, Yukon Anti-Poverty Coalition

Laurie MacFeeters

There's been lots of talk.

Are the territorial government people going to talk to you at all? I haven't seen your agenda and I don't know.

They've done a lot of work. It partly speaks to Julie's point that we're so thin on the ground. She's the staff person at the food bank. That's singular. For some of this research and background work we don't have the time and we don't get it done. We piggyback on national organizations and look to them for that, and unfortunately try to Yukonize it, and that's very difficult.

Although things like guaranteed annual income and such are great models, and for a whole lot of reasons we support those kinds of models for income, the market basket has a lot more appeal of being adaptable to the situation of the north. We have communities like Old Crow that are fly-in only, and they are very different from Whitehorse. The opportunity to adapt a market basket may make it a better model.

At the Anti-Poverty Coalition I can't remember when we've had specific discussions on that. The last discussion I had was with a guy who worked in the territorial government, but they worry about it in terms of social assistance.

9:15 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Dean Allison

Go ahead, Julie.

9:15 a.m.

Executive Director, Food Bank Society of Whitehorse

Julie Ménard

When I said that the food bank didn't exist, we did have discussions for 10 years in the Yukon, and in fact we've been working on this. The Yukon society is the funder or helper that puts the food bank on. One of the reasons is because the territorial government didn't recognize the poverty in the Yukon, because we have some of the highest salaries. If you take a brief look at the situation, you'll think that everyone here is rich. They all work for the federal or territorial government. That may be, but there's a big part of the population who are non-profit and lower, and that is not in the picture most of the time.

I think we're now trying to put this in front. I think the territorial government noticed it and realized that the food bank is needed there, that there's another part of the population we have to think about.

9:15 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Dean Allison

Thank you.

Did you have another comment, Amy?

9:15 a.m.

Employer Liaison and Job Coach, Yukon Council on disABILITY

Amy Martey

I don't have any statistics to represent this, but again, if somebody were coming into Whitehorse for a day, it would appear that it's a fairly well-off community. But I feel that the middle class here is very small. We have people who are making well over $50,000 a year and then we have the bulk of the population who are one or two paycheques away from being homeless. And that also includes the people who are working within non-profits themselves. You have support workers with an incredibly high burnout rate earning $16 or $17 an hour with a clientele of 50-plus as well. That's another thing to factor into that.

9:20 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Dean Allison

Before I turn it over to Ms. Cadman, I have one last question.

On the minimum wage in the Yukon versus what people would make in service industries...I know that in places like Fort McMurray and Edmonton the minimum wage may be $8 or $10, but they're paying people $15 or such to work in restaurants. Is that similar here?

9:20 a.m.

Executive Director, Food Bank Society of Whitehorse

Julie Ménard

I think the minimum wage is $8 or $10.

9:20 a.m.

Representative, Yukon Anti-Poverty Coalition

Laurie MacFeeters

I think $10 would be what a clerk in a grocery store is getting.

9:20 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Dean Allison

It's maybe not as bad as places like Fort McMurray, where there's all kinds of work. That speaks to what you just talked about, where there's not a lot of middle class, and the working poor are the people working for the not-for-profits and maybe the service industry.

9:20 a.m.

Executive Director, Food Bank Society of Whitehorse

Julie Ménard

I think all businesses are different, but most of the people I know receive at least $10 to $12.

9:20 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Dean Allison

Thanks. I was just curious.

Ms. Cadman, we'll turn it over to you for the last round.

9:20 a.m.

Conservative

Dona Cadman Conservative Surrey North, BC

Thank you very much, ladies, for coming.

I have a few questions.

During your conversation I heard that the main industry here would be the government. Is that right? It's the federal and territorial governments.

9:20 a.m.

Executive Director, Food Bank Society of Whitehorse

Julie Ménard

And there's tourism.

9:20 a.m.

Representative, Yukon Anti-Poverty Coalition

Laurie MacFeeters

Federal, territorial, and first nations, because we have self-governing first nations. There was a reference before about the federal role, and most of our first nations are self-governing.

9:20 a.m.

Conservative

Dona Cadman Conservative Surrey North, BC

Out of the population of 22,000 in Whitehorse, what would be the aboriginal population?

9:20 a.m.

Representative, Yukon Anti-Poverty Coalition

Laurie MacFeeters

It's 25% in the whole territory, and it's way less in Whitehorse. But Whitehorse has most of the territory.

9:20 a.m.

Conservative

Dona Cadman Conservative Surrey North, BC

It's 25%?

9:20 a.m.

Representative, Yukon Anti-Poverty Coalition

Laurie MacFeeters

But that's the territory. There are a lot of communities that are 100% aboriginal. The CYFN will have better stats for you.

9:20 a.m.

Conservative

Dona Cadman Conservative Surrey North, BC

Okay, good.

What would the addiction rate be here in the north? Is it higher, do you think?

9:20 a.m.

Executive Director, Food Bank Society of Whitehorse

Julie Ménard

It's hard to tell. I don't have any stats from across Canada, so it's hard. I can just talk about the food bank clients. A lot of my clients have addiction problems, but I cannot give any stats on that. I don't even know if there are stats on that in the Yukon.

9:20 a.m.

Employer Liaison and Job Coach, Yukon Council on disABILITY

Amy Martey

Among our clients I categorize types of disabilities, and we do include addiction. That would be our fifth-largest category of client, the first being permanent disabilities, the second being mental health, then learning disabilities, multiple disabilities, and then addiction.

9:20 a.m.

Conservative

Dona Cadman Conservative Surrey North, BC

How many disabled live in substandard accommodations up here?

9:20 a.m.

Employer Liaison and Job Coach, Yukon Council on disABILITY

Amy Martey

Our organization doesn't look specifically at a housing questionnaire, because employment and education are our primary focus. The reason we actually applied for an advocate, or one of the largest reasons, was because people kept coming to us and saying, “I can't work. I don't have a place to live. I'm getting evicted.” They would be trying to get up for work in the morning and they would have an all-night party happening in their substandard housing unit. It's very difficult for people to be employed when they don't have facilities to shower. There are a lot of issues around that.

In terms of exact statistics, again, I don't have a number, but YTG may be better in that aspect.

9:20 a.m.

Conservative

Dona Cadman Conservative Surrey North, BC

Thanks.

I think we all agree that there should be a national housing strategy. Do you think there should be a separate housing strategy for first nations people living off reserve?