Citizenship and Immigration Committee on March 10th, 2009

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Thank you.

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Calgary Southeast, AB]

I like to make one last sentence, if I could, on the invitation to pick up on other questions. I do have the information Mr. Karygiannis was looking for. I have signed, in fact, 19 subsection 5(4) recommendations that cabinet has approved since becoming minister.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Mr. Bevilacqua has some questions, and then we're going to have a vote, so thank you.

Mr. Bevilacqua.

[Maurizio Bevilacqua, Liberal, Vaughan, ON]

Minister, I just want to follow up on Ms. Wong's question. I found interesting the whole notion of multiculturalism and immigration coming together.

Just for interest's sake, on your workload, what percentage do you spend on your immigration duties versus your multiculturalism duties?

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Calgary Southeast, AB]

It's hard to say precisely, but I would say probably 70 to 30 immigration to multiculturalism, in terms of my time.

[Maurizio Bevilacqua, Liberal, Vaughan, ON]

That doesn't make you a part-time Minister of Citizenship and Immigration and a part-time Minister of Multiculturalism.

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Calgary Southeast, AB]

It makes me very tired, is what it makes me.

[Maurizio Bevilacqua, Liberal, Vaughan, ON]

Anyway, when I asked you the question about why 50,000 fewer landed immigrants were accepted into Canada since you formed the government, the answer you gave me was an aggregate number, just for the record.

On the issue of processing time for skilled workers, you responded by giving me general numbers. And I understand it's a strategy or a tactic that you may use, but just for the record, I want to make sure people understand that the question was not answered.

I also have a follow-up question to a question that was asked of you in question period by my friend and colleague Mr. Wrzesnewskyj, from Etobicoke Centre. Basically, in Kiev in 2004, for skilled workers, the processing times were finalized within 34 months. Today in Kiev, 80% of all cases are finalized within 77 months, and this means an increase of 126% in processing times for skilled workers. That's also an issue I want to address.

But the biggest issue facing immigrants today--and I mean this sincerely, in the sense that we as a committee and we as a Parliament and we as a country need to address this--is that for far too many of them, the Canadian dream is really dying. And that's a major concern I have. I'm wondering whether we as Parliament and you as government are really taking the lives of immigrants as seriously as they should be taken. They are underemployed, it takes a longer time for them to arrive at incomes that are considered average here in Canada, and they are falling behind every single day.

If we as a country are going to go out there and advertise that this is a great land of opportunity, then we owe it to people when they come here that this dream be fulfilled. Some of the things we need, quite frankly, are better funding and better management of programs to make sure the Canadian dream is in fact fulfilled.

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Calgary Southeast, AB]

I certainly agree, Mr. Bevilacqua, that we all are concerned when we see some of the data that suggest that new Canadians are doing less well economically than in the past. That's why I think it's critically important that we more closely align our immigration intake with economic opportunities here. That's what we've sought to do with our action plan for faster immigration, which will bring people here more quickly and into professions that are in greater demand. It's what we've also done by creating a pathway to permanent residency for qualified temporary foreign workers and students. These things I think will help to improve the economic performance of newcomers. It's also why we've increased by threefold our investment in settlement programs. We're not just talking about the importance of success in integration for newcomers, we're actually investing in it as well. We're taking real action and investing real money in foreign credential recognition so we don't have the tragedy of highly educated people who are working in survival jobs, which I think is a disgrace. I think we're making real progress on these fronts. But I agree with your general sentiment.

As it relates to Kiev, I just wanted to report that in 2005 there were just under 1,300 permanent residents processed through Kiev. Last year there were over 1,500 permanent residents, so there's been an increase. Mr. Wrzesnewskyj suggested that we're taking too long to process temporary resident visas out of Kiev. In fact 85% are processed within two days and the rejection rate for TRVs out of Kiev has gone down from 30% in 2005 to 15% last year.

[Maurizio Bevilacqua, Liberal, Vaughan, ON]

I'm talking about skilled workers.

Minister, you would have to agree with me that when you consider how government spending has escalated under your administration, when you consider the fact that your department has only seen an increase of I think approximately 1%, I would come to the conclusion that immigration is really not a priority for this government. It's very consistent. I believe your department is underfunded. I think the immigrant services are underfunded. I also believe that the fact that you essentially would not provide 50,000 individuals with an opportunity to become permanent landed immigrants in Canada speaks to the fact that around that cabinet table—and I mean this in caring way—you've got to exercise greater weight to obtain the type of funding required to bring about the type of change that is needed in Canada's new Canadian community.

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Calgary Southeast, AB]

Mr. Bevilacqua, as Mr. Coderre has noted, I am one of the heavyweights around the cabinet table.

[Voices]

Oh,oh!

[Jason Kenney, Conservative, Calgary Southeast, AB]

With respect, as it relates to immigration, though, the government of which you were a part spent $882 million as a departmental budget for this department. We are spending $1.392 billion; that represents a 57% increase, not a 1% increase. That doesn't include some of the other investments we've made, such as the recent $50 million for pathways to credential recognition.

As it relates to intake of immigrants, I think you're constantly using 2005 as a benchmark, which was an aberrant year because of the tsunami and the acceleration of applications in Southeast Asia. But the reality is that the average intake of permanent residents since we came to office is greater than the average intake under the governments of either Prime Minister Chrétien or Prime Minister Martin. Last year there were 247,000 permanent residents and 508,000 newcomers altogether, if we include students and temporary workers, many of whom, by the way, thanks to our government, now have a pathway to permanent residency, which is a major reform in our immigration system.

With respect, I share your passion for immigration, but I reject your analysis of the figures.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Thank you, Mr. Minister.

That concludes the questions.

On a point of order, Mr. Karygiannis.

[Jim Karygiannis, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

On a point of order, Mr. Chair, I would like to talk to my colleagues around the table and seek consent that after the minister leaves and we vote on the estimates we invite Mr. Chapman to come and tell us how his brother and their grandchildren were allowed to get citizenship and how his sister's children, because she is woman, were denied citizenship.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

That's not a point of order, Mr. Karygiannis.

I'd like to thank Minister Kenney, Mr. Fadden, and Mr. Ganim for coming and providing us with the information that you have. The three of you are excused. Thank you very much for coming.

I'm going to ask two questions.

Shall vote 1c carry?

CITIZENSHIP AND IMMIGRATION Department Vote 1c--Operating expenditures..........$22,302,790

Ms. Chow.

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

Other than the votes on the main estimates 2009-10—I have no problem with that—in vote 1c of the supplementary estimates (C), I'm moving the deletion of the $3 million advertising budget.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

I think the problem is that vote 1c is the dollar. It's just a switch--

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

No, no, vote 1c is for the supplementary estimates (C) of last year.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

I apologize, you're absolutely right. So your amendment is what, Ms. Chow? You want it reduced by how much?

[Olivia Chow, NDP, Trinity—Spadina, ON]

By $3 million, which is the deletion of $3 million on the advertising budget.

And I want a recorded vote on that one.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Okay. Are we ready?

[An hon. member]

No.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Sure, we'll have discussion. The meeting is going to end in a minute, but that's quite all right.

[Rick Dykstra, Conservative, St. Catharines, ON]

It won't take me a minute—I think that's a song title.

Mr. Chair, the money that is committed, which Ms. Chow is referring to, is an assistance in an advertising program to assist lost Canadians. I know it's an issue she supported in the 39th Parliament in terms of moving this issue forward to assist lost Canadians. I cannot imagine why she would be fundamentally opposed to now not helping them. It's in all of our best interests to try to assist those who, for whatever reason, have slipped through the cracks in terms of Canadian citizenship. They deserve to be Canadian citizens. They've earned the right to be Canadian citizens. Taking away this opportunity to let them know how they can do that is really unacceptable, and we will not be supporting that amendment in any way, shape, or form.