Bill C-12

An Act to amend the Old Age Security Act (Guaranteed Income Supplement)

This enactment amends the Old Age Security Act to exclude from a person’s income any payment under the Canada Emergency Response Benefit Act , Part VIII.4 of the Employment Insurance Act , the Canada Recovery Benefits Act or the Canada Worker Lockdown Benefit Act for the purposes of calculating the amount of the guaranteed income supplement and allowances payable in respect of any month after June 2022.

Old Age Security Act

[The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Alexandra Mendès), Alexandra Mendes]

I would remind the member that this is questions and comments. We have to leave time for other members.

The hon. member for Saanich—Gulf Islands.

[Elizabeth May, Green, Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC]

Madam Speaker, I am going to let a big secret out of the bag and just say that I am deeply fond of the member for Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan. We share a lot.

I will say that bean counters would love a guaranteed livable income. Can members guess where we would save money? Snooping around on single moms, to cut their benefits if they find out they have moved in with their boyfriends, takes money. We have a shame-based system of band-aid solutions to poverty. They are expensive. They cost a lot of money. It does not cost money at the federal level the way it costs money at the provincial or municipal levels, but if it is all counted up, and people have done a lot of research on this, a guaranteed livable income could replace a lot of very inefficient programs that are expensive.

Those people who lose their jobs snooping around and checking up on single moms would be all right. They would not fall below the poverty line, because there would be a guaranteed livable income for all.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Madam Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague for her speech and for the words she spoke in excellent French. Her speech once again attests to her big heart, her generosity and her ability to analyze an issue.

At the beginning of her speech, my colleague spoke about fixing a mistake and discrimination against seniors. We agree that what happened with the GIS was pure discrimination.

I would like her to comment on another type of discrimination resulting from the creation of two classes of seniors and on how we could fix that mistake.

[Elizabeth May, Green, Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC]

Madam Speaker, I thank my Bloc Québécois colleague from Beauport—Limoilou for her very kind and generous comments.

I do think the government needs to fix the mistake it made when it created two classes of seniors. I think the best way to address inequality is to create a system that will eliminate poverty. That is the point of the guaranteed income supplement.

There are other things we must do to protect seniors' health, such as fix problems with long-term health care, which should not be in the hands of for-profit enterprise.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Madam Speaker, I think my colleague from Saanich—Gulf Islands will agree that in addition to fixing this glaring problem facing seniors and the clawback of their GIS benefits, one of the real benefits of this debate has been the opportunity to shed light on the need for a guaranteed basic income for seniors and all people struggling in poverty. However, it seems there are still barriers to our coming together and delivering this basic dignity for people.

Can my colleague speak to what some of those barriers seem to be? The beliefs that we hold, either subconsciously or otherwise, are holding us back as a society from making the bold move like the one in the 1960s that she referred to. What is holding us back now from making that kind of move and delivering the basic dignity that people deserve?

[Elizabeth May, Green, Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC]

Madam Speaker, I am older than some members, and that is not to say that I am smarter; I just remember stuff. I remember Reagan and Thatcher and the rise of neoliberalism, and it shifted consciousness. It made a lot of citizens look at government as something alien from them, with a hand out to pick their pockets, whereas the postwar narrative that was in our heads, which lasted through the 1950s, the 1960s and into the 1970s, was that collectively we could look after each other. We had that collective sense. As I mentioned in referring to the importance of democracy at the end of my speech, we had the sense that the way the government operates was at the very tips of our fingers. We controlled what our government did because it was not alien from us: It was us. It was us taking care of each other.

The fabric of that has been significantly damaged, but I hope that post-COVID, people will realize that neoliberalism is dead, because when we were banging our pots and pans on our balconies, it was not for billionaires. We were banging our pots and pans on our balconies for people we knew were underpaid and working hard in health care.

I hope that we can change the way we think about our job as parliamentarians to include leaps of faith to do what is right.

[Arielle Kayabaga, Liberal, London West, ON]

Madam Speaker, I want to thank the member for her comments and her really great speech. I agree with her that it is time for this bill to pass and to pass quickly. We have talked about how much all of us really want to support seniors and how many of us were sent to this House by seniors to be strong advocates for them.

Would the member continue her call on how we can continue to support people? I thank her for making her comments in her great speech, and I think this is a step toward getting to that place of continuing to support people. We know how much COVID has impacted seniors, so I want to thank her and encourage her to continue to make that call to support passing this bill and to pass it quickly.

[Elizabeth May, Green, Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC]

Madam Speaker, to the hon. member for London West and to all in this House, although I described how beautiful things were in the 1960s and 1970s when those changes were made, there was only one woman in the House of Commons and there were not any really young women and there were no young racialized women. I just want to say what a joy it is to see the number of wonderful young women who have taken their places as MPs here, and I thank the hon. member for London West and promise to keep being as difficult as I possibly can be from my older vantage point.

[Laurel Collins, NDP, Victoria, BC]

Madam Speaker, I want to thank the member for her speech. The member spoke powerfully about the profound injustice that low-income seniors face.

It made me think about some of the incredible organizations in our region. She may be familiar with some of them, including Senior Entitlement Service, Silver Threads service for seniors and James Bay New Horizons. I sat down with the James Bay community project in January; it is supporting seniors who are facing immense challenges with isolation and food insecurity. Staff there spoke about how these challenges are increasing and the inequality is increasing.

These organizations are doing such powerful, incredible work and are working tirelessly to support seniors. Our government could be tackling this and taking the burden off volunteers and service providers. Scarcity, inequality and poverty are all policy choices. They are not elements of the human condition.

Can the member speak more about how pharmacare and a guaranteed livable income would ensure seniors and all community members could live in dignity?

[Elizabeth May, Green, Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC]

Madam Speaker, my hon. colleague is from the neighbouring riding of Victoria where she is doing great work.

I would just say that we have to finish the work that started under Lester B. Pearson, Tommy Douglas and David Lewis, and that includes pharmacare. It will save Canada money and it will be better for our economy.

People think that our ridings, Victoria and Saanich—Gulf Islands, are fairly wealthy, but I have seniors living in their cars. I have people for whom I pay their electricity bills so that they do not fall out of their apartment and end up living in a car. We have desperate needs, and Bill C-12 will help, but pharmacare is essential.

[The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Alexandra Mendès), Alexandra Mendes]

The question is on the motion.

If a member of a recognized party present in the House wishes to request a recorded division or that the motion be adopted on division, I would invite them to rise and indicate it to the Chair.

The hon. Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons.

[Mark Gerretsen, Liberal, Kingston and the Islands, ON]

Madam Speaker, I request a recorded division.

[The Assistant Deputy Speaker (Mrs. Alexandra Mendès), Alexandra Mendes]

Pursuant to an order made earlier today, the division stands deferred until Wednesday, February 16, at the expiry of the time provided for Oral Questions.

Accordingly, pursuant to order made earlier today, the House stands adjourned until tomorrow at 2 p.m., pursuant to Standing Order 24(1).

(The House adjourned at 11:55 p.m.)

The House resumed from February 15 consideration of the motion that Bill C-12, An Act to amend the Old Age Security Act (Guaranteed Income Supplement), be read the second time and referred to a committee.

[The Speaker, Anthony Rota]

It being 3:25 p.m., pursuant to order made on Tuesday, February 15, the House will now proceed to the taking of the deferred recorded division on the motion at the second reading stage of Bill C-12.

Call in the members.