Bill S-205

An Act to amend the Criminal Code and to make consequential amendments to another Act (interim release and domestic violence recognizance orders)

This enactment amends the Criminal Code in respect of interim release and other orders related to intimate partner violence offences. The enactment also provides for recognizance orders to be made when there is a reasonable fear of domestic violence.

[Michelle Ferreri, Conservative, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

Thanks, Madam Chair, and thank you, Minister, for being here today.

There are some serious issues happening in our country. You said on record in your statement today, Minister, that “policy comes from things that are measured”. Those were your words. In the past year, more than 50 cities and municipalities across Ontario have declared intimate partner violence and gender-based violence to be an epidemic, including Toronto, Sudbury, Hamilton, Kingston and my hometown of Peterborough. One woman is killed every other day in Canada inside the terrifying rates of violence and, under this Prime Minister, violence against women has increased 79%.

This is my question for you today, Minister. We are studying Bill S-205 in this committee. The intention of Bill S-205 is to better protect individuals who file domestic violence complaints. As well, it creates a peace bond in the Criminal Code that is specific to and provides for more severe conditions for individuals accused of domestic violence, and the bill would allow the judge to require the accused to wear an electronic monitoring device if the judge determines that the victim's safety and life are at risk during the interim release period.

It is pretty important legislation that was brought forth by a senator whose own daughter was murdered, but in this committee, the Liberals and NDP voted to remove the two major components of that bill, one being victim consultation and the other being the words “intimate partner”. They voted to remove “intimate partner” and replace it with “persons”.

You've said here that we have an epidemic. You say we have an issue with gender-based violence and intimate partner violence. How can you justify your party's removing this from the bill?

[The Chair, Conservative, Karen Vecchio]

Although that is the case, it needs to be legally translated. It cannot just be done by brilliant people like you. It has to be done as an official translation for legality reasons. It has to go through that.

I know we have some amazing people in here. We could translate that, but there are certain words that are very important, especially in a court of law.

Seeing no other questions or comments, I will just remind everybody that on Thursday we have the estimates with Minister Ien. We'll be rescheduling a portion for this meeting as well, so that we can get back to Bill S-205. We'll get a new schedule out to you, because we need to get back to this as well.

Seeing no other questions or comments, today's meeting is adjourned.

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

Just quickly, Madam Chair, I think this is simply technical, and I don't know about the aspect of clause 2, but essentially when we are looking at ensuring the two bills' language, I don't see that amendment G-14 takes away from Bill S-205. If I understand it correctly, it just aligns the two bills, and it doesn't take away or add. I thought this was a simple amendment.

[Sonia Sidhu, Liberal, Brampton South, ON]

This is a technical coordinating amendment to ensure that Bill S-205 is in line with another bill that Parliament is studying, Bill C-21, should both bills be passed.

[Sonia Sidhu, Liberal, Brampton South, ON]

Yes, Madam Chair.

It is that Bill S-205, in clause 2, be amended by (a) replacing lines 9 to 12 on page 2 with the following:

810.03(1) Any person who fears on reasonable grounds that another person will commit an offence that will cause personal injury to the intimate partner or a child of the other person, or to a child of the other person's intimate partner, may lay an information

(b) replacing lines 32 to 34 on page 2 with:

(5) The provincial court judge may commit the defen-

(c) replacing line 1 on page 3 with:

(6) The provincial court judge may add any reasonable

(d) replacing lines 4 and 5 on page 3 with:

or to secure the safety and security of the intimate partner or a child of the defendant, or a child of the defendant's intimate partner, including condi-

(e) replacing line 20 on page 3 with—

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Amendment G‑2 is fairly straightforward.

It is that Bill S‑205, in clause 1, be amended by replacing, in the French version, line 23 on page 1 with the following:

tenaire intime, s'il a été auparavant condamné

It simply involves changing the words “déclaré coupable” to “condamné”. The amendment is purely practical.

[Sonia Sidhu, Liberal, Brampton South, ON]

Yes, Madam Chair. It's that Bill S-205, in clause 1, be amended by replacing lines 4 to 17 on page 1 with the following:

1(1) Paragraph 515(6)(b.1) of the Criminal Code is replaced by

and by replacing line 1 on page 2 with the following:

(2) The Act is amended by adding the following

If you want me to give the explanation, it's to remove measures that would require the court to ask whether the victim has been consulted about their safety and security needs prior to making an order for bail. That's why we are moving that.

[The Chair, Conservative, Karen Vecchio]

Good evening, everybody. It's Anita's birthday, so we'll be celebrating that. There's cake at the back.

I'd like to call this meeting to order. Welcome to meeting number 89 of the House of Commons Standing Committee on the Status of Women.

Today's meeting is taking place in a hybrid format, pursuant to the Standing Orders. Everybody should understand, with the Zoom application, to just please put up your hand.

If I'm totally ignoring you—Emmanuella knows what this is like—just let me know. Say, “Karen, I need to hear from you.” For those in the room, just put up your hand and we'll make sure that we take down a list.

Interpretation, of course, is available. We've all used that before.

Today we have different people in the room, so for those who are on Zoom, it looks a bit different. We have Chelsea Moore here, and Julia Nicol. We also have some legislative clerks who are going to be helping us with this legislation.

We also have a new clerk, so he's going to be getting used to how it is to work with me.

Pursuant to the order of reference of Wednesday, November 1, 2023, the committee will commence consideration of Bill S-205, an act to amend the Criminal Code and to make consequential amendments to another act regarding interim release and domestic violence recognizance orders.

When ready to start, we're going to go clause by clause. There have been a lot of different clause-by-clauses that we have done in the past in other committees, but this one is a little different. A lot of times we don't look at the justice bills.

I'm going to remind everybody that we're going to take it slowly. I think the most important thing is that we get this right. At the end of the day, this is all about the victims and ensuring that we get this right.

I would like to provide members of the committee with some instructions and a few comments on how the committee will proceed with clause-by-clause consideration of this bill.

As members already know, this is an examination of all clauses in the order in which they appear in the bill. I will call each clause successively and each clause is subject to debate and a vote. If there are amendments to the clause in question, I will recognize the member proposing it, who may explain it. The amendment will then be open for debate. When no further members wish to intervene, the amendment will be voted on.

Amendments will be considered in the order in which they appear in the package or in the bill. Members should note that amendments must be submitted in writing to the clerk of the committee. As Stephanie noted, we need them in both official languages so that we can circulate them around to everyone.

The Chair will move slowly to allow all members to follow the proceedings properly.

Amendments have been given a number. Everybody has the amendment. At the top corner, for instance, you will see a G-1, and that stands for Government-1. In your list and in the package, on the right-hand side you will see the number that we're referring to.

The amendment will then be open for debate. During debate on the amendment, members are permitted to move subamendments. These subamendments must be submitted in writing. They do not require the approval of the mover of the amendment. Only one subamendment may be considered at a time, and that subamendment cannot be amended. When a subamendment is moved to an amendment, it is voted on first. Then another subamendment may be moved, or the committee may consider the main amendment and vote on it.

Once every clause has been voted on, the committee will vote on the title and the bill itself. Finally, the committee will have to order the chair to report the bill to the House. The report contains only the text of any adopted amendments as well as an indication of any deleted clauses.

Everybody has all of their information. You should have the bill, plus everybody should have the bill in PDF format. You'll see the line numbers on that.

I just want to make sure that everybody has a PDF format of the bill.

[Anna Roberts, Conservative, King—Vaughan, ON]

I'm not sure if you know Bill S-205 that we're working on right now, sponsored by one of the senators who lost a daughter to the same situation. Hopefully we can make a difference in this Parliament to ensure that this never happens again with the electronic monitoring system, because it's a tragedy that we have no opportunity to protect the women we should be protecting.

Official Report

[Lisa Marie Barron, NDP, Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order.

On September 21, during the debate at second reading on Bill S-205, an act to amend the Criminal Code and to make consequential amendments to another act on interim release and domestic violence recognizance orders, I read a quote on the record from Martine Jeanson, founder of the Maison des guerrières. Unfortunately, I mistakenly attributed the quote to Sarah Niman, legal counsel and assistant manager of legal services for the Native Women's Association of Canada.

The quote from Sarah Niman should have read:

Bill S-205 seeks to provide violence victims something of a voice. This bill places the onus on the criminal justice system to check in with victims, consider their safety through the proceedings, and produce outcomes that consider their safety. Bill S-205 does not create a response specifically tailored to Indigenous women, but it does create a framework for them to be seen and heard in a system that otherwise does not.

I deeply apologize for this error. I want the record to reflect accurately what was said and by whom. Therefore, I believe if you seek it, you will find unanimous consent for the following motion:

That the Debates and any House multimedia recording of Thursday, September 21, 2023, be amended by deleting the words “Sarah Niman, from the Native Women's Association of Canada” and substituting the following: “Martine Jeanson, founder of the Maison des guerrières”.

[Michelle Ferreri, Conservative, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

For the record, I know we were supposed to have the Liberal minister update that Victims Bill of Rights, but that hasn't been done.

Regarding bail reform, the Liberals passed Bill C-5, which allows dangerous sexual offenders to serve their sentences out on bail. You can imagine how this makes victims feel.

Given this legislative change, do you think that victims deserve initiatives and policy and legislation, such as Bill S-205, to give them more rights? Obviously, they are going to be consulted regarding electronic bracelets, which gives them a lot more power.

I will go to Ms. Mattoo to answer that.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Ms. Latimer and Ms. Mattoo, thank you for being with us today to speak about Bill S-205.

Ms. Mattoo, regarding new subsection 515(3.1) that it is proposed to add to the Criminal Code, the justice hearing the application for interim release must first "ask the prosecutor whether the intimate partner of the accused has been consulted about their safety and security needs", where the intimate partner is the victim of the offence alleged.

The present subsection 515(3) states that the justice making an order shall consider "whether the accused is charged with an offence in the commission of which violence was used, threatened or attempted against their intimate partner". In a case in which the presumed victim is not the intimate partner of the accused, are there other things that should be done to protect the intimate partner or the victim?

[Emmanuella Lambropoulos, Liberal, Saint-Laurent, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I'd like to begin by thanking our witnesses for being here, the ones who are on the current panel and also the ones on the previous panel, who have come here to express the views they have and all of their experiences working with these communities who are under-represented and who are overly incarcerated. I appreciate the views that are being brought forward, because it's important to take into account all perspectives when putting forward legislation. I just want to make sure that it's known that I very much appreciate your presence here today.

To both of the witnesses on this panel, you've spoken to some of the shortcomings in Bill S-205. You specifically mentioned shortcomings with regard to prevention and how the bill does little to prevent intimate partner violence. Also, you mentioned the fact that it could put certain communities more in danger than they already are. It could make certain victims get the negative parts of this bill applied to them as well, so it will just increase the amount of inequality that exists in our society.

I am hoping that you heard the previous testimony as well, because there were certain recommendations that were brought forward by previous witnesses, including amendments that could be made to the bill in its current form.

Is there anything that you would like to add in terms of specific amendments that haven't been mentioned already that you think can help bring that prevention piece in or that you think can help those who don't feel protected by the justice system, by police, etc.? What are some of the things that you think we should be including in here if we weren't to completely reject the bill and we were to pass it eventually? What is missing from it, and could you be a little bit more specific?

I'll start with Ms. Mattoo because I see her on the screen, and then we'll go to Ms. Latimer.

[Dominique Vien, Conservative, Bellechasse—Les Etchemins—Lévis, QC]

Do the excerpts that I read just now, from the testimony of women who came here to the committee, not reflect the reality and very concrete lived experience that urge us to adopt Bill S-205? Does that testimony not say something like: "We are the ones who experience it, we have experienced this situation and we help women, hundreds of women, to try to get out of it"? Should that not be enough to persuade us to take action today?

[Dominique Vien, Conservative, Bellechasse—Les Etchemins—Lévis, QC]

Hello, Ms. Mattoo.

If I understand correctly, you support the bill. You may want there to be improvements, but you support Bill S-205, is that right?