Agriculture Committee on Nov. 7th, 2017

[Alan Kruszel]

Yes.

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

A lot of farmers are still using traditional methods of tillage. Why do they continue to use them? It's a good question. it is probably because they have production requirements that could not be met otherwise.

As Chair of the Soil Conservation Council of Canada, do you consider that most negative effects on the soil come from human activity, not from climate change?

[Alan Kruszel]

It is human activity. The most important factor is the destruction of organic matter in our soil. If we are able to recover the organic matter and enrich our soil with carbon from the air, it will mitigate the effects of climate change.

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

Have you done any studies on climate change?

[Alan Kruszel]

No, not yet.

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

So it is not yet a priority for the Soil Conservation Council of Canada.

[Alan Kruszel]

Correct. We are trying to promote zero tillage as a way to face up to climate change better. If we can put in more organic matter, the yields will be more stable. If there is too much water, the water can drain away more quickly. We can have yields even during droughts. We really have to promote the health of the soil in order to help us face up to climate change.

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

So your organization has conducted no studies.

[Alan Kruszel]

Right.

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

Let me turn to you again, Ms. Lee.

You talked about the carbon tax. You are asking for an exemption in order to use natural gas and propane. In your industry specifically, any increase in costs or any form of tax can have really disastrous consequences.

[Rebecca Lee]

Correct.

I will ask my colleague to respond about the use of natural gas and propane.

[Jan VanderHout]

It's important to recognize that greenhouse production is very much a part of agriculture. To produce the greenhouse crops that we grow, we need to burn fossil fuels. We cannot do without that in this food production.

We also are impacted significantly in our competitiveness because we have the extra cost of carbon pricing—cap and trade or carbon tax—which is a significant problem. We are not asking for an exemption from all carbon tax. We are seeking an exemption only in the fuel we use to grow our crops. Much like the diesel fuel for outdoor agricultural production would be exempt, we would like, in greenhouse production, an exemption from our cost of carbon pricing on natural gas, propane, or heating oil.

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

An exemption like that would encourage greenhouse owners to use propane and natural gas rather than diesel.

[Jan VanderHout]

It would be if they were able to use the natural gas to run other equipment as well, certainly. Part of this is just to recognize the work that we've already done. That includes the installation of high-efficiency boilers, condensing boilers, and energy curtains in the greenhouse to retain the heat that we're putting into the greenhouse. We also do energy audits and these sorts of things.

Energy is a very big cost for greenhouse operators. We're looking for ways to save on that. The cost of the fuel is the incentive to do that.

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

I will let my colleague Mrs. Boucher ask the final question.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

Thank you, everyone. This is very interesting.

I have a number of questions to ask, but I am going to turn to the Canadian Horticultural Council.

Can you explain to me why it is so important for the vitality of Canada's agricultural sector to harmonize our policies on carbon pricing with those of other countries?

[Jan VanderHout]

To my knowledge, none of the countries that we compete with have anything like carbon pricing. The countries that we compete with, the United States of America, Mexico, and South American countries, have nothing like carbon pricing.

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

Thank you, Mr. VanderHout.

Thank you, Madame Boucher.

Mr. Longfield, you have six minutes.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Thank you.

I'd like to do down that road a little bit further in terms of carbon pricing and look at the new clean fuel standard and the opportunity to use biofuels, ethanol in diesel and gas, renewable natural gas, and other fuel options. I'm wondering if anyone can comment on that, across the board, just very briefly.

Biofuels: going once....

[Geneviève Grossenbacher]

Could you just repeat that. It was biofuels and....

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

It's about looking at the use of biofuels, the new clean fuel standard that Canada is developing so that we can reduce our carbon footprint.

I'm going to switch, because of our time.

On the carbon management, one thing I saw at the conference in Guelph was comments being made around putting a price on carbon as a way of managing carbon and managing the carbon cycle.

Mr. Kruszel, at the conference there was representation from the United States and from all across Canada. They were talking about the importance of pricing carbon in terms of managing the carbon cycle. Do you have any comments on that?

[Alan Kruszel]

Certainly, pricing carbon incentivizes change on the agricultural landscape, in particular, if you can do some kind of offset system or something where farmers get paid to sequester carbon.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Right.

[Alan Kruszel]

Our concern would be, once that happens, what incentivizes them to keep it there?

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Right.