Evidence of meeting #18 for Agriculture and Agri-Food in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was saindon.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Conservative
Ted Falk Conservative Provencher, MB
We know from science that our oceans are our biggest sequestrants of carbon. They inhale carbon and they also exhale carbon. Is that something that agricultural land would do as well?
Research Scientist, Agrienvironment Division, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food
Yes, there's a natural intake and outtake of carbon. The plant material goes into the soil and it's used by the micro-organisms. Their process of using it exhales the carbon.
We can put a chamber on the soil and measure CO2 coming out, but it's the net balance of that input and output that we're talking about. That net input, when it's greater than the output, is a sign that carbon is being stored in the soil.
Conservative
Research Scientist, Agrienvironment Division, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food
It depends on where you are in the country and what the management practices are.
Across the country, our department has indicators that have shown that the organic matter levels have been going up since 1980 in terms of storing more carbon. They're plateauing out. The increase isn't as high, but that is the good news across Canada. As a country as a whole, that's what's happening.
Conservative
Ted Falk Conservative Provencher, MB
Would your studies indicate that we actually want more carbon for a healthier soil?
Research Scientist, Agrienvironment Division, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food
We would want more carbon, of course. The goal is to get more carbon into the soil—as much as we can—and maintain those high crop yields. Growing a large crop will get more carbon into the soil.
Conservative
Ted Falk Conservative Provencher, MB
Our goal is to increase the carbon in the soil. Is that correct?
Research Scientist, Agrienvironment Division, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food
That's right, because that affects everything. Once you get carbon in, it affects this carbon sequestration. It's also important in terms of overall soil health as well.
Conservative
Research Scientist, Agrienvironment Division, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food
Yes. Again, it depends on where you are and what the system is. Optimizing that total amount is possible, and it is being done.
Conservative
Ted Falk Conservative Provencher, MB
Okay.
Do we know of any specific crops—I'm sure we do—that are better for soil sequestration than others when it comes to cereals or oils?
Research Scientist, Agrienvironment Division, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food
Well, there's a fine line. It's really the quantity, but also the type of crop. Alfalfa and deep-rooted crops are being promoted because that gets it deeper into the soil. Crops that have large root systems going into the soil are important as well.
Conservative
Ted Falk Conservative Provencher, MB
That's very good.
As my question, then, if we need this carbon for our soils to be healthy and the soil does actually emit some of that carbon back into the atmosphere, what would we specifically like to achieve for optimal success?
Research Scientist, Agrienvironment Division, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food
I guess the optimal success is at least maintaining our soil organic carbon levels. The goal should be to increase it, but, as I said before, there are a lot of vagaries in what happens on a year-to-year basis and in the regions as well. Applying your question across Canada is really difficult. Even breaking it down within a region is difficult because of the variability and what happens on a year-to-year basis.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Kody Blois
Thank you, Mr. Falk. We appreciate the line of questioning.
Thank you, Mr. Gregorich.
Ms. Taylor Roy, you have six minutes.
Leah Taylor Roy Aurora—Oak Ridges—Richmond Hill, Lib.
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
Thank you to all the witnesses here. I too am very impressed with the amount of knowledge and research that's being done in the department.
Dr. Saindon, I was very encouraged to hear you say that all our programs are based on scientific research in collaboration with the farmers, which is really what we all want.
I actually want to continue on with Mr. Falk's line of questioning. I find it very interesting that right now you said we had been increasing since 1980, but currently we are plateauing. I'm wondering why we're plateauing. What do you think can be done to continue to increase carbon capture and sequestration in the agricultural sector?
Research Scientist, Agrienvironment Division, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food
Across the country—we're talking about a country-scale level here—a lot of what drives what we're talking about is large-scale change in land management. What built up the carbon in the 1980s, 1990s and early 2000s was that there was more no tillage in western Canada. No till or reduced tillage and less summer fallow, which keeps the bare ground, really drove that process more. In eastern Canada, there was a large conversion of the pasture lands into crops. That was driven by an economic situation.
Across the country, the big driver was in western Canada, because there's more land and because of the trends in the land management system out there. That drove that increase, and now it's plateauing out. In eastern Canada, again, the land management has been changing over the last 20 years or so, and that drives not as much storage in the soil.
Aurora—Oak Ridges—Richmond Hill, Lib.
Just to be sure I understand, the issue is that we've been taking grasslands and grazing lands and they've become croplands now.
Research Scientist, Agrienvironment Division, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food
That's in eastern Canada, yes.
Research Scientist, Agrienvironment Division, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food
No, it's not as much there, but that's what drove the process in eastern Canada.
Aurora—Oak Ridges—Richmond Hill, Lib.
What was it in western Canada?
Research Scientist, Agrienvironment Division, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food
It's fine. It has been stable and—
Research Scientist, Agrienvironment Division, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food
Yes.