Agriculture Committee on Nov. 30th, 2022

[Richard Lehoux, Conservative, Beauce, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thanks to the witnesses for being here.

Mr. Lambert, you just mentioned that one third of the Ukrainian population suffers from food insecurity. That's an important piece of information that we should always bear in mind.

Could Canada help both the population and producers of Ukraine? Please tell us more about that.

[Tim Lambert]

Yes, certainly. Obviously, everybody in this room very much cares about what's happening. This is a tragedy and a humanitarian disaster. Are there other ways besides imports by which we could all work together collaboratively supporting the rebuilding of the country in some way? We have technology. We have expertise.

Roger referenced the work he does with the International Egg Commission. I'm past chairman of that organization as well, and we do a lot of work right now in sub-Saharan Africa supporting development by helping farms become commercially viable.

I'm convinced there are many ways we could work collaboratively with Ukrainian farmers and industry as they try to rebuild their nation coming out of this war, whenever it ends. I think there are tangible things we can do.

[Richard Lehoux, Conservative, Beauce, QC]

Thank you.

I have a quick question regarding both producers and processors.

Did the government consult you before signing this order in June?

[Jean-Michel Laurin, President and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Poultry and Egg Processors Council]

As Mr. McFall mentioned, we knew a remission order had been in force since June, but we weren't contacted or consulted in advance. In October, we got wind of the fact that Ukraine had submitted a request to certify chicken processing plants in 2019. We learned at the same time that it had also submitted a request regarding eggs.

[Roger Pelissero]

From the farmers' side, we were not consulted at all. We would appreciate, moving forward, if we could be consulted. I think we could find a path that would help with the collaborative nature of some of these challenges.

[Richard Lehoux, Conservative, Beauce, QC]

My next question is for the processors.

Officials from Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada told us on Monday that they hadn't anticipated a large volume of imports. Do you know of any importers who might be expressing an interest in this right now, and do you have any idea of the volume they might be interested in?

[Jean-Michel Laurin]

First, regarding anticipated volumes, as my colleagues mentioned, we've never experienced a situation such as this, in which unlimited volumes of products could well enter Canada duty free. So this is unprecedented.

You asked me if any businesses wanted to import. I think my colleagues from the Chicken Farmers of Canada mentioned they'd heard of two import businesses that seemed to be interested. From our members, who are Canada's major and medium-size processors, I haven't heard that anything's in the works. However, I should note that there are specialized import and export businesses in our industry, so I assume any interest there might be comes from them.

There's another point that I'd like to mention. Although a significant portion of the import quotas is allocated to processors, many other players in our industry are involved in international trade. I could discuss them at greater length, if you wish.

[Richard Lehoux, Conservative, Beauce, QC]

Yes, perhaps.

I have a very simple question, for now: are the businesses that might want to import products, including any producers, Canadian- or foreign-owned? Are they headquartered in Canada?

[Jean-Michel Laurin]

Perhaps Ms. Coughlin could answer that question better than I because she seems to be an expert on the matter.

From what I understand, you need a permit issued by the Canadian Food Inspection Agency to import products to Canada. So you need to be a Canadian resident.

[Richard Lehoux, Conservative, Beauce, QC]

However, we know that certain companies, such as Canadian-owned companies, do business mainly outside Canada.

Ms. Coughlin, can you answer that question?

[Katrina Coughlin]

I can't really comment.

There certainly can be situations where a large corporation that is not Canadian-owned has a Canadian operation and holds an SFC import licence at that address.

[Richard Lehoux, Conservative, Beauce, QC]

We know that the countries adjacent to Ukraine are feeling the impact of avian influenza. If we imported products that came from a region potentially dealing with AI cases, what impact would that have here? Would it have an impact on you in the processing sector?

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

Please answer within 30 seconds.

[Jean-Michel Laurin]

As mentioned, Canada is a member of the World Organisation for Animal Health, as is Ukraine. We must therefore ensure that international standards for controlling avian influenza are met.

You have to understand that products that come from a region where avian influenza exists generally may not be exported. We assume that would also be the case of meat from a region of Ukraine where there are AI cases. We rely on the Canadian Food Inspection Agency to ensure that the countries we trade with exercise appropriate control.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

Thank you very much, Mr. Laurin and Mr. Lehoux.

[Richard Lehoux, Conservative, Beauce, QC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

I now give the floor to Mr. Longfield for six minutes.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you to the witnesses.

I'm sorry that I couldn't be there in person today. I'm subbing for one of our members. I'm live from Guelph.

Mr. Pelissero, it's great to see you again. Thank you for welcoming me to your farm. Your production area is world-class, and the eggs I brought back to Guelph were also world-class. Thank you for what you do there.

I'm also thinking of how Egg Farmers of Canada is supporting before-school programs and is a key contributor to helping children in Canada with nutrition before school.

As I'm listening to the conversation, I'm thinking of how we can support Ukrainian children and farmers in the way that Canadians are supported. I'm also thinking of the three major trade agreements that were negotiated. We've now done some compensation agreements, with up to $4.8 billion for supply-managed sectors that could be affected by trade agreements.

Mr. Pelissero, this is a temporary measure that we're looking at; it's not a long-standing trade agreement going forward in the industry. We're trying to help a country that's fighting an illegal war that's been forced on them by Russia.

Could you maybe comment on the relationship that Egg Farmers of Canada has with Canada, what the egg producers have done to support food security in Canada and how that might relate to the situation we're discussing this afternoon?

[Roger Pelissero]

Thank you. It is good to see you, Mr. Longfield. It's too bad it wouldn't be in person. It was great to have you at my farm that day. I have an open-door policy, if you want to visit an egg farm any time you're in the Niagara Peninsula. We could do eggs in the morning and go down to the wine area and maybe do some wine tasting in the afternoon.

To the question at hand, Mr. Longfield, we support nutrition. It's a top priority. We want to make sure that children have the right start to the day. We know that eggs help them stay focused. We're involved in early nutrition for infants, in egg nutrition programs and with food banks.

As Mr. Lambert referenced earlier, if there are ways to help the Ukrainian people in this time of food crisis—when one in three is going without the necessary items—we'd be more than happy to engage in those discussions. We'd be happy to talk about some of the ways we do it here in Canada and to help benefit those over there who are struggling right now.

Mr. Lambert maybe has a few comments to add.

[Tim Lambert]

I can give a very specific example. The Egg Farmers of Canada built an egg farm on an orphanage in Eswatini, Africa, and we supply about 4,300 hard-cooked eggs through a network of 30 churches and schools.

One of our challenges was that we did this without refrigeration, so we worked with a Danish company that custom-designed and built equipment to hard-cook, chill and preserve the eggs. We did trials on hard-cooked eggs where we held them for up to 30 days at 30°C, with zero spoilage.

Going back to the point I made early on in my remarks, we believe that there are other ways we can directly support a rebuild as Ukraine eventually starts to come through that. That is a specific example of something we're currently doing.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

With respect, farmers are supported by moving product, and moving products through the facilities that we would be drawing on is directly supporting farmers. It's also supporting the government, which needs revenue to fight the costly war they're facing.

There's a disconnect there somewhere. We are looking at everything we can do to support, within food safety regulations that we have in Canada, and it seems like we could be doing more.

Maybe I can flip that one over to Mr. McFall.

[Ian McFall]

JM, would you like to comment?

[Jean-Michel Laurin]

One thought came to mind. I remember that one of the things Canada did was to try to host displaced Ukrainians who were seeking shelter while their country was going through what they're going through right now. I know that we worked very closely with the immigration minister. It was essentially an all-of-government effort, but we tried to recruit or direct many of those Ukrainians who were looking for jobs to communities where we had poultry- and egg-processing establishments.

We all know that we're facing some unprecedented labour shortages in our industry, and we thought that maybe this was a way in which we could actually help. This might not have happened in as concerted a way as we would have liked to see, but I know we have several members in communities across the country that have been able to help in that way.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Yes, we're helping in an emergency situation. We're in the middle of a war situation, so consultations have always happened and will happen on an ongoing basis, but helping the farmers move their product is really what I want to see us being able to do.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

Thank you, Mr. Longfield.

We have five seconds, but you'll cede those five seconds to the committee. I want to say that you have a beautiful picture behind you there. I'll have to follow up and see who did that picture.

Mr. Savard-Trembley, you have the floor for six minutes.