Canada-China Relations Committee on June 7th, 2021

[Lenore Zann, Liberal, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

The minister stated earlier that our bilateral relationship with China is complex and multi-dimensional. In recent years, this relationship obviously has presented [Technical difficulty—Editor] and has continued to evolve. We also know that many of our international partners are facing similar challenges. It has been stated many times that Canada believes it's essential to work with our closest allies to have a united approach when it comes to China.

Could the officials please explain to this committee how we are actually collaborating with like-minded partners on this crucial issue?

[Marta Morgan]

Our approach to China is evolving to meet the challenges of threats to our national security, to democratic values and to human rights. We have recognized that we need to challenge China on many of those issues.

I think a good example of that, when it comes to working with allies, is the work that we've done on arbitrary detention. As Minister Garneau mentioned, 63 countries have now signed on to our statement on arbitrary detention, which is practised by a number of states globally and goes against the rules that govern the international system.

We work very closely with international allies through the G7, for example. You saw an extensive statement coming out of the G7 foreign ministers meeting at the beginning of May condemning the human rights violations against the Uighurs. We work at the United Nations with allies at the United Nations Human Rights Committee, for example, to decry the human rights abuses being committed against the Uighurs and to seek unfettered access for the UN special rapporteur on human rights. There are many examples, whether it's with our G7 partners or with our Five Eyes partners. Sometimes we will work bilaterally, for example, with the United Kingdom on an issue.

I think one of the main messages I would pass is just the importance of building those alliances and working with allies. We are so much stronger when we work together. That's a critical part of our strategy and our approach going forward.

[Lenore Zann, Liberal, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Thank you so much for that really detailed answer.

I'd like to continue along this line of questioning.

As you know, it's been about a year now since the Standing Committee of the National People's Congress of China passed the national security law for Hong Kong. Since the passage of this law, many legislators and peaceful protesters have been arrested.

Can you please reiterate Canada's commitment to the promotion and protection of freedom of expression around the world?

[Marta Morgan]

Yes.

The protection of freedom of expression, the promotion of democracy and the protection of human rights are critical values that guide Canada's foreign policy around the world. They are a key pillar of our foreign policy, and we work very closely with our allies on these issues.

Hong Kong is another good example. In March, Canada and our G7 partners issued a statement expressing grave concerns over the decision by the National People's Congress to overhaul Hong Kong's electoral system.

We worked together in early January, joining Australia, the United Kingdom and the U.S. in a joint statement around reiterating our serious concerns over mass arrests. This is not only vis-à-vis Hong Kong or only vis-à-vis China, but these are positions and views that Canada expresses in multiple fora when we see the need to stand up with our partners and promote human rights, democracy and freedom of speech.

[Lenore Zann, Liberal, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Thank you so much.

Have you seen a recent increase in the number of Hong Kong citizens who have applied to come and live in Canada through the new Hong Kong immigration program?

[Marta Morgan]

I think that question would probably be best posed to my colleagues at Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada, who follow the numbers very closely.

I would just say that the program is designed to provide a pathway for young Hong Kongers to come to Canada. We have such a vibrant people-to-people relationship. I think it's one element of our approach going forward.

[Lenore Zann, Liberal, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Thank you.

As the situation in Hong Kong continues to deteriorate, many Canadians are concerned for the safety of their friends and family. Given the long reach of the national security law, could and should Canadians, including those of Hong Kong descent, feel unsafe?

[Marta Morgan]

We remain deeply concerned over the rapid deterioration of rights and freedoms in Hong Kong. We believe that a stable and prosperous Hong Kong, where the rule of law and fundamental rights and freedoms are guaranteed, is in everyone's interests. That includes dual Canadian-Chinese citizens in Hong Kong.

[The Chair, Liberal, Geoff Regan]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Bergeron, go ahead for six minutes.

[Stéphane Bergeron, Bloc, Montarville, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I thank the witnesses for still being with us at such a late hour this evening.

Deputy Minister, you are probably expecting me to get back to my question, which you could not answer because I ran out of time.

According to The Globe and Mail, the opinion was published by Global Affairs Canada against the decision of the Canadian Armed Forces to cancel the joint exercise planned between the troops of China's People's Liberation Army and the Canadian Armed Forces on a military base in Ontario.

What is the justification for that contrary opinion from Global Affairs Canada when, logically, everything was pointing toward that exercise being cancelled?

[Marta Morgan]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

As Minister Garneau said, we have not had bilateral military training commitments with China since 2018. It is normal for departments to have discussions on these kinds of issues, but no bilateral military training has taken place with China since then.

[Stéphane Bergeron, Bloc, Montarville, QC]

I completely agree with you. However, the fact is that, according to The Globe and Mail—unless the newspaper was misinformed or lied—it seems that Global Affairs Canada published an opinion against cancelling that exercise.

From the Global Affairs Canada's viewpoint, according to what requirement should that exercise have been held?

[Marta Morgan]

As the minister said, we have not had any military training exercises.

[Stéphane Bergeron, Bloc, Montarville, QC]

I do understand that.

[Marta Morgan]

We were reviewing our relationship with China at that time. That relationship has evolved a great deal since then.

[Stéphane Bergeron, Bloc, Montarville, QC]

I understand and thank you, but, once again, from the Global Affairs Canada's point of view, what would justify the exercise taking place despite everything?

[Marta Morgan]

The approach that we had in 2018 was very different. Our approach to our bilateral relationships with China is evolving and has evolved since then. It was a moment at which we were beginning to consider, in the early days post Madam Meng, what the correct path forward should be. We're assessing the situation.

That's probably the best answer I can give you in terms of what the thinking was at that time.

[Stéphane Bergeron, Bloc, Montarville, QC]

Would you now say, in retrospect, that the decision was the right one?

[Marta Morgan]

What I would say is that we must evolve.

We have to assess the situation. We have to evolve our policies. At that moment, we were refraining from cancelling existing bilateral relations. We were quite carefully assessing the situation.

This must evolve over time and according to the events taking place.

[Stéphane Bergeron, Bloc, Montarville, QC]

My understanding is that, what worried you at the time was potentially contravening the bilateral agreement between the People's Republic of China and Canada.

I am putting the question to you again. Do you think that was the right decision, in retrospect?

[Marta Morgan]

Look, I would say that at the time, in the situation we were in, we were assessing and refraining from cancelling existing commitments until we better understood the situation. Clearly, in 2021, the situation would be different. As you've seen, we have not had any military exercises with China since 2018.

[Stéphane Bergeron, Bloc, Montarville, QC]

Thank you.

My colleague Mr. Paul‑Hus was saying he really appreciated what the minister said in his opening remarks. I will tell you that I also greatly appreciated some parts of his opening remarks, especially concerning the Uighur situation. I thought I detected in the minister's remarks a recognition of certain facts concerning, for instance, the forced sterilization of Uighur women.

When I listened to the minister, I thought I heard the various parameters defined in the declaration on genocide. In light of the minister's statement today, what is still preventing Canada from recognizing that a genocide is indeed taking place in Xinjiang?

[Marta Morgan]

In the declaration of the G7 foreign ministers at the beginning of May, we, along with other G7 foreign ministers, recognized the human rights abuses that are happening in China.

[The Chair, Liberal, Geoff Regan]

Thank you very much.

I'm sorry, but Mr. Bergeron's time is up.

Now we'll go to Mr. Harris for six minutes.

Go ahead, please, Mr. Harris.

[Jack Harris, NDP, St. John's East, NL]

Thank you, Chair.

Madam Morgan, perhaps you could now answer the question I asked Mr. Garneau. I'll repeat it for those who didn't hear it. It related to this committee recommending that the government convey to the Chinese ambassador to Canada that any interference with rights and freedoms of people in Canada is unacceptable, won't be tolerated and will result in serious consequences for those responsible.

In what manner was this conveyed to the Chinese ambassador? Can the deputy minister tell us whether there were serious consequences from the government for any persons who acted contrary to this requirement by interfering with the rights and freedoms of people in Canada?