Evidence of meeting #12 for Canadian Heritage in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was council.
A recording is available from Parliament.
4:35 p.m.
Bloc
Carole Lavallée Bloc Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC
Mr. Del Mastro, I really want the representatives of the Canada Council for the Arts to come and testify. I would like to meet them and get the information they have to give us. If that could enable our artists to do the tours for which funding has been cut, I wouldn't want to miss that information. I really want them to come and testify. It's not that I don't want that to be part of the report, but I think we're putting the cart before the horse. We're operating in a sequence that isn't logical.
Mr. Del Mastro, I'm asking you, in a friendly way, to change two things in your motion. The motion begins as follows: “That the Standing Committee of Canadian Heritage calls to appear, at its earliest convenience, [...]” I'm asking that we delete the words “at its earliest convenience” because we're currently conducting another study. It's not that I don't want to hear from them; I'm prepared to hold a special meeting. I'm even prepared to go and meet them with you tomorrow morning, Mr. Del Mastro. However, we have to respect the business of our committee.
Second, I've never understood the last sentence, which ends as follows: “[...] and the vote be a public one.” I'd like you to explain that to me. I entirely agree that the findings should be reported back to the House, but I don't understand why you're requesting a public vote.
4:35 p.m.
Conservative
Dean Del Mastro Conservative Peterborough, ON
What I'm saying, Madame Lavallée, is that this is not the first time I've brought this motion. But I can't talk publicly about the fact that the motion was defeated when it was brought forward previously. If this motion fails, I would like to be able to come forward and talk about it publicly.
4:35 p.m.
Conservative
4:35 p.m.
Liberal
Ruby Dhalla Liberal Brampton—Springdale, ON
I have two points.
To my recollection, this motion has not been brought forward before. In terms of this particular wording, this is the first time we're seeing it.
Second, with all due respect to Mr. Del Mastro, I don't think anyone wants to be threatened that if we don't support this, there's going to be a press release issued and so forth. I think we're all interested in hearing from the Canada Council. I think there was a due process in place. Having a dissenting report, which you want issued, included in the report I don't think does justice to the whole process of the committee. But if we want to hear from the Canada Council, that is something I am in agreement with.
4:35 p.m.
Conservative
4:35 p.m.
Conservative
Shelly Glover Conservative Saint Boniface, MB
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I've listened intently to what the committee members have said, and I appreciate what our colleagues are saying: it's important to hear from the Canada Council. Ms. Dhalla has said it. Ms. Lavallée and Mr. Angus have said it. It would be irresponsible of us not to include what it is they have to say in a report. The report would be incomplete. It would not have a basis for completion for the general public or for the artists we are trying to help. I believe it's important that we include whatever it is they have to say in that report. I think we all agree that it's important. Get it into the report. Let's finish this business and move on to the next order of business.
4:35 p.m.
NDP
Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON
Thank you.
This is becoming bizarre. We have a press release that's all ready to go if we don't jump to Mr. Del Mastro's tune, and we'll be slammed.
I'm looking at this notice of motion, and I don't see anywhere in it that this has anything to do with the study. We are finished our study. If he wants to bring it forward so that what we find in that meeting can be reported back to the House, so be it. But it is a kangaroo court. After the witness lists have been drawn up, after everybody has gone through it, after the recommendations have been given to our clerks so they can finalize the study, the study has been finalized. We will vote on that on Wednesday at the meeting.
If we strike “at its earliest convenience”, and we call to appear the Canada Council for the Arts, I support that motion. I think it's an excellent motion. But it has nothing to do with the previous study, because it was not brought forward at that time. So we will hear that testimony, and we will report it to the House. In fact, we might hear such wonderful news on touring that we report that to the House, but that's a separate study.
I would make a friendly amendment and say that we strike “at its earliest convenience”. Then we vote on bringing them forward, and we fit them into the schedule whenever. We'll continue with the business at hand.
If he accepts a friendly amendment, I'm more than willing to move it at this point, and we can vote on it and be done.
4:40 p.m.
Conservative
Dean Del Mastro Conservative Peterborough, ON
We're voting on an amendment that states that they be called prior to the finalization of this report.
4:40 p.m.
Conservative
Dean Del Mastro Conservative Peterborough, ON
That's the amendment we're talking about right now. I added an amendment to the motion.
4:40 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Gary Schellenberger
I'm going to call a vote on the amendment.
The amendment says, at the end, “prior to the finalization of the report”.
(Amendment negatived)
4:40 p.m.
Bloc
Carole Lavallée Bloc Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC
I voted against, but I'll do another motion.
I really want to hear from the Canada Council representatives.
4:40 p.m.
NDP
Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON
My motion is that we call them to appear--whenever. They're going to come, and that's a separate piece of business. We'll just strike “at its earliest convenience”. We call them to appear.
4:40 p.m.
Conservative
4:40 p.m.
Conservative
Dean Del Mastro Conservative Peterborough, ON
Striking “at its earliest convenience” means that we may not hear from them until sometime after June.
Listen, if people want to hear from the Canada Council--and that's what they're saying--then people know that this is something I've been working on for weeks. This is not something new. I would propose we schedule an additional meeting at the earliest possible convenience. If they can be here Wednesday, Thursday, tomorrow, fine. Let's call them and find out when they can be here. Let's schedule a meeting at the earliest possible convenience and let's get them in here.
What have we to fear with the Canada Council's appearing? Let's have them here and let's hear what they have to say. I'd like to hear from them on their support for international promotion and touring. I'd like to talk to them a little bit about what they're doing everywhere else and what they're doing with the additional money they've been provided.
4:40 p.m.
NDP
Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON
I'd like to vote on my amendment. I think we've talked this out. My amendment is just to strike “at its earliest convenience”, which means we will hear from them. I don't think we need to get our knickers in a knot. We will hear from them. Let's vote on my amendment.
4:40 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Gary Schellenberger
We'll vote on the amendment put forward by Mr. Angus. The motion would read:
That the Standing Committee of Canadian Heritage calls to appear the following representatives from the Canada Council for the Arts: director, Robert Sirman; chairperson, Joseph L. Rotman; and vice-chair, Simon Brault; to provide information regarding the $13 million the Canada Council for the Arts has allocated to provide funds and resources to the arts community for international promotion and touring, and that the findings be reported back to the House and the vote be a public vote.