Evidence of meeting #2 for Canadian Heritage in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was money.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Judith LaRocque  Deputy Minister, Department of Canadian Heritage

3:30 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Gary Schellenberger

I'd like to welcome everyone here today to meeting number two of the Standing Committee on Canadian Heritage. We're very pleased to have Minister James Moore with us today.

Thank you, Minister, for coming. We're really pleased that you feel you should come at the beginning of the session rather than the end. Sometimes we've had trouble getting ministers here, so I'm very pleased about this.

Pursuant to Standing Order 108(2), this is a briefing on departmental activities and plans. I would ask you, please, if you'd like to make your presentation.

The Honourable James Moore, Minister of Canadian Heritage and Official Languages.

3:30 p.m.

Conservative

Dean Del Mastro Conservative Peterborough, ON

On a point of order, Mr. Chair, we have a notice of motion before the committee. Can you just instruct the committee as to when we'll deal with that motion, please?

3:30 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Gary Schellenberger

At five o'clock we will recess. We'll deal with the committee business after five o'clock.

Minister, there will be your presentation and then questions and answers until five o'clock.

3:30 p.m.

Port Moody—Westwood—Port Coquitlam B.C.

Conservative

James Moore ConservativeMinister of Canadian Heritage and Official Languages

Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you for the opportunity to be here today. I appreciate the opportunity to meet with all of you. Many of you are new members of the House, while some of you I have known for quite some time. I'm looking forward to working with all of you in this session of Parliament.

I've had the opportunity over my four terms in Parliament to be a member of many standing committees, some good, some less than good. The heritage committee has a reputation of being one where folks can come together and have good, frank, and honest discussions and work productively for the betterment of all Canadians.

I want to start by saying that this is my first visit to the committee. It certainly won't be my last. I look forward to this session and working together in the future.

I'd like to begin by sharing with committee members the work that has been ongoing since I was appointed Minister of Canadian Heritage and Official Languages in the fall. I'd like to talk about my meetings with stakeholders and what I've learned since becoming minister. I welcome the opportunity to discuss how we can work together to be proactive in shaping the arts and cultural scene in Canada. I will also be very happy to answer questions that you may have. I hope that today's session will be the first of many productive meetings.

Building stronger communities has been a priority for our Conservative government since day one. It is stable, vibrant communities that will provide opportunities for individuals and contribute to our great country's health and identity. That's why we've committed to our Roadmap for Canada's Linguistic Duality.

This investment of $1.1 billion over five years will be spread across 13 government departments and agencies. This amount is unprecedented and includes $14 million to preserve and promote linguistic duality in the arts and culture sector.

This year is the 40th anniversary of the Official Languages Act. This is something to celebrate and which all Canadians can be proud of.

We are also investing in festivals and historic commemorations. Our programs provide opportunities for Canadians to become involved in their communities and to have access to arts and heritage. For example, in our first three years, we increased funding through Arts Presentation Canada by 37%. With Budget 2009, we're continuing that strong track record by investing another $100 million over two years in marquee festivals and events.

We are investing in communities right across our country. We invested in Quebec City last year to commemorate its 400th anniversary. We are investing $2 million through our Cultural Capitals of Canada program to help Trois-Rivières celebrate its 375th anniversary. These milestones are of national significance, and we know the local economic and societal benefits achieved from these events.

Just two weeks ago, I had the opportunity to visit Halifax to announce that our government is investing more than $160,000 in the Atlantic Jazz Festival and the 2009 Scotia Festival of Music. We're also investing in the Lockport Children's Festival in Manitoba, and in the Festival du Bois in British Columbia. Festivals and commemorations bring communities together, make them stronger and richer, and in turn contribute to the well-being of our entire country.

Another priority for our government is doing our part to support museums. That's why we've invested $100 million in our national institutions since 2006. We're ensuring that our national museums have the resources to maintain and operate the buildings--and the collections they hold--on behalf of Canada.

In December I had the privilege of joining the Prime Minister and Premier Gary Doer in Winnipeg for the groundbreaking of the Canadian Museum for Human Rights. This was done through an act of Parliament, and is the first investment in Canadian history for a national museum outside the national capital. This is record funding, and it is an example of a project where we're working with various partners, including the private sector, the Government of Manitoba, and the City of Winnipeg.

Let me also mention the work we have done with aboriginal people to celebrate and strengthen their culture. We support the National Aboriginal Achievement Awards, which recognize the outstanding achievements of members of the community in various fields.

Arts and culture is another area of this diverse portfolio. I would like to reiterate our firm commitment in this area and our recognition that cultural creativity and innovation are vital, not only to a robust Canadian culture but also to our economy. I also know, through my travels and consultations across the country, the importance of arts and culture and how closely associated they are to our heritage, identity, and quality of life.

Since coming into office in 2006, we have increased spending by 8% for the arts and culture sector. Our government has made significant increases to programs across the department. We've doubled the funding for Cultural Spaces Canada for the coming year, and extended the program by an additional year. We've increased funding for arts training by 42%, and for museums by 28%.

Our government is continuing our record of increased spending in budget 2009. We're continually working to meet the concerns of the creative community. We're doing this by sustaining cultural funding with $540 million in this budget. This includes investments in training programs for young artists and creators.

Many of you will have personal memories of, or have heard of, the remarkable impact of the celebration of the country's centenary in 1967 and the impact it had on our pride and sense of identity. Canada's 150th birthday is now approaching. I believe it can and should be a landmark event where we shine as a country and invoke in each and every Canadian a sense of belonging to our country.

This committee may wish to play a role as we look forward to 2017. Canada fifty years after 1967 is in many ways a very different country. I would ask this committee if it would consider how we could build momentum toward 2017, and finally how to mark 2017 itself. I would welcome such work from this committee, because I think it would be of interest to all Canadians.

Our government is promoting Canada on the international cultural scene. We invest $21 million annually on international promotion and export through organizations such as the Canada Council for the Arts, whose budget we have increased by 21% since 2006. The Canada Council for the Arts now receives over $180 million a year; this means more money is going directly to artists.

Add to this our new investment of $25 million for arts prizes, which will showcase Canadian artists to an international audience. This will cement Canada permanently as a cultural hub in the world. We believe that Canadian artists are the best in the world, and that's why we have made these investments.

Our government recognizes that when we invest in culture, we get a lot back. The Conference Board of Canada estimates the cultural sector generated $46 billion to Canada’s GDP in 2007, and it supports more than 650,000 jobs in our economy. However, as we all know well, while culture generates compelling economic data, it is about much more than that. It is an intangible yet powerful part of what holds us together as a country. Based on values we hold dear, our culture is fundamental to our way of life.

Creativity and innovation are vital, not only to an enriched Canadian cultural life, but also to Canada's economic future. Our government recognizes the importance of arts, culture, and heritage, and has devoted more than half a billion dollars to it in this year’s budget. This includes $100 million for festivals and events, $60 million for local theatres and small museums, new money for national arts training.

Sport is part of our Canadian identity and is an important work in my department as well. Physical activity is part of a healthy lifestyle, and sport is part of a healthy society. This is one of the reasons why we are the largest contributor to sport in this country. Our investments are supporting participation in excellence from the playground to the podium.

We know an investment in culture is an investment in our future, and that's why we have committed more money to arts and culture than any government in Canada's history.

In 2008-2009 our government's investment in the Canadian sports system will have grown to an all-time high of $166 million annually. This is a record level. Canada has a sport heritage we can all be proud of. As someone who calls British Columbia home, I'm obviously particularly proud and enthused that we will be hosting the 2010 Olympic and Paralympic Winter Games.

Right from the outset, when it was announced that Canada would host the 2010 games, I began to attend as many games-related events as possible. And I am pleased to say that our government's $55-million “Own the Podium” initiative is helping to ensure that our athletes have the financial support they need while they prepare for the games.

With one year to go, I am sure members of this committee, and indeed all Canadians, share our enthusiasm. Our communities gain tremendously from these and other high-stature sport events, from improved sport facilities to increased volunteer capacity and sport participation. The social and economic legacies of the 2010 games will benefit the country for many years to come.

This opportunity of a lifetime extends beyond athletes and spectators and into the arts and culture community as well. We will have a wonderful occasion to showcase our Canadian heritage to an international audience. It is estimated that 3.2 billion people around the world will be watching the opening ceremonies of the 2010 games.

Recently, not far from my home in Port Moody, the Cultural Olympiad 2009 opened in metro Vancouver. It's a six-week-long festival that will feature 400 performances and exhibits featuring 120 artistic projects taking place in close to 70 different venues. Our investment in the Cultural Olympiad is just one of many events we have been able to fund through our government's 37% increase in the arts presentation Canada program.

We are also investing $24.5 million in the Olympic torch relay, as approved in last year's budget. This incredible event will see the Olympic torch travel more than 45,000 kilometres over 100 days across this country. It will go to over 1,000 communities in this country and is the longest torch relay in Olympic history.

We've set aside $12.5 million in funding for community celebrations at stops all along the way and we'll be engaging francophone and minority language communities as we do this. This will showcase real local artists on the ground as part of these torch events and is an example of how sport and culture can work together to improve the quality of life of Canadians.

Since I was appointed Minister of Heritage and Official Languages last fall, I have been working hard to meet the needs of artists from across the country. I have enjoyed visiting small towns and cities alike and touring institutions such as the Musée d'art contemporain, Wychwood Barns, the Art Gallery of Nova Scotia, and many more. I've spoken to all my provincial and territorial counterparts and I've met with the heads of organizations like the Canada Council for the Arts, l'Union des Artistes, Orchestras Canada, and the Vancouver Art Gallery, to name a few. My goal was, and it continues to be, to connect with the arts community and establish a relationship that will be beneficial to all Canadians.

While I've been able to see first-hand that the cultural sector is innovative and dynamic, I also recognize there are tremendous challenges ahead. First and foremost is the global economic situation. Cultural business and not-for-profit organizations alike are feeling the effects of the credit crunch. Rapidly changing technologies are having a huge impact on the sector; they are bringing challenges, but also, of course, opportunities.

There are now more ways to reach more audiences. For instance, there are social networking websites like Facebook and MySpace. In fact, 34% of Canadians under the age of 20 use such sites to discover new art and new music. The cultural industry is reaching them there and is building artists' profiles online instead of advertising through traditional means like flyers, radio, and television.

Fewer people are buying CDs because they want more flexibility and choice. Instead of buying a whole album, they want to pick and choose their songs. This is something the industry is starting to deal with. They need to do more, of course, and I will continue to work with them to ensure that we have a sustainable policy framework to adjust.

In this rapidly changing environment, we need to take a careful look at how we invest in culture. We need to re-examine our cultural policies because many of them are rooted in traditional approaches that may not fit anymore.

I believe we need cultural policies that respond to our unique heritage and put Canadians' interests first, as citizens, creators and consumers. Canadians want and should have information about the world through books, magazines, films and exhibitions. We want to see films telling our stories, like Passchendaele, and Ce qu'il faut pour vivre. We want to read books like Guy Vanderhaeghe's best selling The Englishman's Boy, or Marie Laberge's trilogy Le Goût du bonheur.

As well, we need policies that focus on innovation so that the cultural sector can continue to be a strong driver of economic growth.

I believe the National Film Board is on the right track here. In honour of its 70th anniversary, the Board has put the better part of 900 films on line free of charge. Day or night, anywhere in the country, Canadians now have access to this important part of their cultural heritage.

We want Canada to continue to be a global leader in developing video games. Among the top-selling video games in North America, 20% were developed in Canadian studios. In fact, this innovative sector had estimated revenues of $2 billion in 2007.

Last but not least, we need policies that help our creators to showcase their ingenuity, build their brand, and contribute to Canada's image outside of our country. We have a small domestic market and many of our artists owe their success to strong international sales. For example, the rock band Nickelback has sold more than three hundred million dollars' worth of CDs internationally over the past ten years.

When we see Cirque du Soleil or Céline Dion appearing around the world, not only do Canadians feel a sense of pride, but it also helps build our reputation abroad as a strong, competitive country. This image is central to attracting tourism and investment to Canada and stimulating economic success across all sectors.

I want to review our existing cultural policies with a view to modernizing them. I hope that this committee, in establishing its agenda for the coming months, will consider some of these issues as well. In the coming months we have much to do, and we will prioritize, starting with the implementation of budget 2009.

I also want to reiterate our commitment to the television and interactive digital industries, with investments of $134 million over the next two years. It is through these investments that we are helping to strengthen the economy and create jobs for Canadians. We believe that sectors of broadcasting and new media will continue to contribute to the economic welfare of Canada. We are aware of the hardships the industry has experienced and, rest assured, I am closely following its evolution.

In closing, let me say that our government understands that support for arts and culture is not a want, but a need. I have been very clear on this since my appointment as Minister of Canadian Heritage last fall. The mandate of the Canadian Heritage portfolio and specifically arts and culture is important for our government.

I see great opportunity for all members of this committee to work together to make change possible in this time of fast-paced innovation in the cultural sector. The needs should be considered not only in a productive way, but in one that is respectful to the economy and to the challenges that we face ahead.

Thank you very much for the opportunity to be here. I look forward to hearing your questions.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Gary Schellenberger

Thank you, Minister, for that presentation.

May I remind all the committee members that our questioning is for five minutes? I will try to be fair. Please keep a little bit of an eye on the chair every now and again. Over the years, I've noticed how people getting close to the five minutes cannot look at the chair. I might have to use the gavel.

We'll start off with Mr. Rodriguez, please.

3:45 p.m.

Liberal

Pablo Rodriguez Liberal Honoré-Mercier, QC

Thank you.

Minister, welcome. Thank you for sharing with us your action plan. As we all know, you will also do things that are not in the action plan. For example, your predecessor, when she tabled her action plan, never said, for example, that she would use government powers to censor culture, which she did. We don't need another surprise, certainly not like that one. Can you confirm today to the members of this committee, to our artists and creators, and to our fellow Canadians, that you will never use government powers to censor culture?

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

James Moore Conservative Port Moody—Westwood—Port Coquitlam, BC

I think you're referring specifically to Bill C-10 in the previous Parliament. I will not be reintroducing Bill C-10 or a copy thereof.

3:45 p.m.

Liberal

Pablo Rodriguez Liberal Honoré-Mercier, QC

In terms of the latest budget, how much new funding is allocated to the cultural sector?

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

James Moore Conservative Port Moody—Westwood—Port Coquitlam, BC

New investments amount to $276 million.

3:45 p.m.

Liberal

Pablo Rodriguez Liberal Honoré-Mercier, QC

On page 217 of the Budget, there is a chart that indicates that you decided to invest massively in your priorities in order to stimulate the economy. Some $18 billion and $15.5 billion are projected to the spent in 2009-2010 and 2010-2011 respectively. That is the government's action plan to stimulate the economy, which can be found on page 217. That amounts to approximately $34 billion over two years.

You have confirmed that there will be $276 million in new cultural funding, out of a total investment of $34 billion. I calculated the ratio, and it comes out to approximately one eighth of 1%. How can you say that, on the one hand, culture is important when, on the other, the government's total investment to stimulate the sector amounts to less than 1%? Given that culture represents approximately 7% of GDP, the government should have invested 7 times more.

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

James Moore Conservative Port Moody—Westwood—Port Coquitlam, BC

First of all, you are only referring to new spending over the next two years. However, you must keep in mind that our government is investing $2.3 billion this year in arts and culture. That is the largest amount ever in the history of our country.

Between 2006 and 2009, our government has spent more for the arts and culture than any other government in Canadian history. There will be an additional $276 million in new funding. These are good investments that will greatly benefit Canada's cultural sector.

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

Pablo Rodriguez Liberal Honoré-Mercier, QC

I agree that cultural investments are important. This is something we could discuss at length. I do not want to debate the issue or create any confusion. However, my impression is that the government is so used to cutting cultural spending that, when it maintains funding levels, it is as if it is making new investments. In a sense, that is the impression that one has.

Obviously, I am interested in new investments. The amounts are there for all to see, but we hope there will be no budget cutbacks. You have confirmed that for the next two years.

Judging by all the new measures, this is indeed a spending budget. The government has decided—and rightly so—to invest in economic stimulus. There have been job losses and business closures. Our priorities must receive funding. Your government has tabled a $34 billion action plan for the next two years—I have even heard of as much as $40 billion. But there is something that doesn't seem quite right. A decision was made to invest massively; it is said that this is a spending budget and that culture is a priority. However, less than 1% is invested in culture, which accounts for 7% of the GDP. This to me is contradictory. You cannot claim that culture is important and then invest less than 1%.

Do you follow me?

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

James Moore Conservative Port Moody—Westwood—Port Coquitlam, BC

Somewhat, but allow me to comment on what you have just said. Investments in the arts and culture largely exceed those made last year or at any other time in the past. This budget includes new investments: $100 million for markee festivals and events; $60 million for theatres, libraries and small museums; $20 million for the National Arts Training Contribution Program; $25 million for the Canada prizes for dance, music and drama; $30 million to support access to Canadian magazines and community newspapers; $28.6 million for the Canada New Media Fund; and $200 million for the Canadian Television Fund.

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

Pablo Rodriguez Liberal Honoré-Mercier, QC

The Canadian Television Fund is not a new fund. Funding is being extended. Please continue.

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

James Moore Conservative Port Moody—Westwood—Port Coquitlam, BC

The total amount is $530 million. I am simply pointing out that each of those investments was announced in Budget 2009. If the budget is not adopted by the House of Commons, those funds will not be allocated, and those who depend on them will suffer. These are key investments for the cultural sector.

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

Pablo Rodriguez Liberal Honoré-Mercier, QC

And we want them to reach their recipients. I was only hoping for a greater amount, Mr. Minister.

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

James Moore Conservative Port Moody—Westwood—Port Coquitlam, BC

We are investing more than ever before in the history of our country, and that is something we are proud of.

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Gary Schellenberger

Ms. Lavallée, please.

3:50 p.m.

Bloc

Carole Lavallée Bloc Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC

Mr. Minister, I have a question that has been nagging at me since you were appointed and made your first statements: do you appreciate artists and the arts?

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

James Moore Conservative Port Moody—Westwood—Port Coquitlam, BC

Absolutely.

3:50 p.m.

Bloc

Carole Lavallée Bloc Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC

You appreciate them, but you do not understand them. Since your appointment, nothing you have done for Quebec artists meets their needs or addresses their concerns. As you know, seven programs were cut, which stirred up a major controversy during the last election campaign in September. Artists demanded that the funding to those seven programs be reinstated. These are not exorbitant amounts.

Among the questions I put to you in the House, I asked you what you had done with artists' money. That was on Thursday, November 20th. You answered, almost word for word, that the money had been transferred to the Olympic Torch Relay.

Last week, a study sponsored by the Department of Canadian Heritage was released showing that artists were living below the poverty line. They have no money and are generating no income. Besides, they have not chosen to become artists in order to make money, contrary to what you have said in your document. You want to invest in culture. Indeed, some areas are profitable. CINARS has recently demonstrated that in its special report entitled “Performing Arts in Peril”: some programs are profitable, particularly the Trade Routes program. However, profits do not drive artists to engage in their art, give performances, create and tour the world. They are passionate about what they do. Simply put, culture does not exist for the future, but in and of itself.

You say that your government has made unprecedented investments in the arts and culture. I would also remind you that no other Canadian government has spent as much as yours for national defence and military missions abroad. In my view, that is not a criteria. Of course, you are increasing spending, and that is all fine and well.

Furthermore, you are investing $25 million for the Canada prizes for the arts and creativity, which are intended to reward foreign artists.

I want to come back to the program. I have gotten carried away, and I want to give you some time to respond. I want to know where to find the analyses. I am asking you to provide us with the analyses that justified those program cuts. Because, once again, you have made drastic and unjustified cuts.

3:55 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Gary Schellenberger

Mr. Minister, you have roughly two minutes to answer.

3:55 p.m.

Conservative

James Moore Conservative Port Moody—Westwood—Port Coquitlam, BC

Fantastic.

That was like when you see U.S. presidential debates and they say “The world is falling apart at the seams, can you please take your 30 seconds to respond?” But here we are.

Kevin Garland, Director General of the National Ballet of Canada, said that he was very glad to see that we had a strong minister and that the budget has dedicated two of its pages to art. As far as he is concerned, this is a first time occurrence.

I am very much in favour of the arts and I understand the needs of artists. Clearly, our investments are unprecedented in the history of our country, and we are more efficient than we were in the past.

My colleague said something about drastic arbitrary cuts. However, the Canadian Memory Fund contained $12.7 million.

3:55 p.m.

Bloc

Carole Lavallée Bloc Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC

Please tell us about the Trade Routes program.

3:55 p.m.

Conservative

James Moore Conservative Port Moody—Westwood—Port Coquitlam, BC

All right, let us talk about the Trade Routes program. This $7 million program took $5 million in order to generate $2 million in benefits. Clearly, those who received the $2 million were not happy. Nevertheless, if it costs $5 million to generate $2 million in benefits, I think that my electors as well as yours could well believe that this degree of inefficiency is unacceptable in a federal government. We must spend and invest our money more efficiently to meet the needs of the cultural communities.

You said that there had been arbitrary and drastic cuts amounting to $45 million. From that amount, $12.760 million were intended for the Canadian Memory Fund. This program accomplished its objective; it was successful. Do we need to repeat this? We invested $4 million in the Internet Culture.ca website on a yearly basis, but no one ever used it. Do you want us to put the site up again under the pretext that it was arbitrarily removed? If we take these funds and reinvest them in the Canada Council for the Arts or in festivals, it is not an arbitrary cut. That is where the money is going. In fact, the funds are also meant for the Olympic Flame Relay. This is supposed to be the biggest relay in the history of the Olympic Games. I am sure that this event will also take place in every one of the ridings held by members of the Bloc Québécois, and that the same members will be proud to be present at these celebrations, even though while you are here, in the House of Commons, you are condemning these investments.