Evidence of meeting #50 for Canadian Heritage in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was facebook.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry
That's a judgment call on my part, Mrs. Thomas. Mr. Bittle is being very aggressive in his questioning, but I don't think he is being very disrespectful to the witness.
Thank you.
Liberal
Chris Bittle Liberal St. Catharines, ON
Madam Chair, I trust my time was paused. I haven't even asked a question.
Liberal
Chris Bittle Liberal St. Catharines, ON
Thank you.
We heard about the generosity of Facebook in providing 230 million dollars' worth of links but, on the other side, “We're going to take away all of your ad revenue from news agencies, as well”, which is an interesting generosity. There's a suggestion from Facebook that this will break the Internet, but we've heard from Microsoft—which may know a thing or two more about the Internet than I do—that such legislation won't. It didn't in Australia. It won't happen again. The fearmongering just continues.
Let's go to Australia, if we can. On February 17, 2001, the House of Representatives passed the initial bill. The day after that, there was an overreach takedown, including all the sites Mr. Housefather mentioned. Facebook's official response on day 2, February 18, was that the takedown was going according to plan.
Mr. Dinsdale, was that a mistake, as you claimed earlier?
Head, Media Partnerships, Canada, Meta Platforms Inc.
Mr. Bittle, I'm obviously not able to speak to the communications happening at that time in—
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry
Excuse me.
There was a bit of difficulty in hearing Mr. Dinsdale's answer. I will stop the clock and let him answer again, because I couldn't hear it. There was echoing.
Head, Media Partnerships, Canada, Meta Platforms Inc.
Thank you, Dr. Fry.
I would express, as well, that our intent with last week's communication was to signal the degree to...how unworkable it is for our business, and that we may not have the opportunity to share those concerns. We're grateful to have the opportunity to share those concerns with the committee. We hope we can create a more evidence-based piece of legislation that takes into consideration how platforms and the Internet work.
Liberal
Chris Bittle Liberal St. Catharines, ON
That was another question, and another non-answer from Facebook, a company that demanded to be here. Should I just ask softballs, Mr. Dinsdale? Is that what you're looking for? I've dealt with Facebook in committees before—with Mr. Chan—and the contempt Meta has for the parliamentary process.... Mr. Housefather went through it earlier. I noticed, today, that a judge in the United States fined Meta $25 million for repeatedly and intentionally violating U.S. campaign finance laws. I guess we know what Facebook and Meta think about the democratic process.
At the end of the day, we saw Mr. Zuckerberg, in whistle-blower communications, celebrating the outcome, that outcome of putting the lives of Australians in jeopardy. Was that a mistake on Mr. Zuckerberg's part?
Head, Media Partnerships, Canada, Meta Platforms Inc.
Sir, again, I believe we've expressed the point that there were mistakes made, which we have been public about. Again, our engagement here today is to talk about our concerns with the legislation in front of us, and concerns about the—
Head, Media Partnerships, Canada, Meta Platforms Inc.
—representation of the relationship between publishers and—
Liberal
Chris Bittle Liberal St. Catharines, ON
Excuse me, Mr. Dinsdale, but this is my time.
This legislation is based on the Australian model. I think most people know this. You threatened the same thing: to put the lives of Canadians at risk. I guess the question is this: You've put thousands, perhaps millions, of Australians' lives at risk; are you willing to do the same thing to Canadians?
Global Policy Director, Meta Platforms Inc.
Oh, I didn't realize that. I thought it was open to Meta.
Liberal
Head, Media Partnerships, Canada, Meta Platforms Inc.
Again, sir—as Mr. Chan expressed—the outcome of the legislation in Australia is that we do not, in fact, pay for links. A model based on the Australian model is, in some ways, inapplicable, because we are not designated in Australia.
Head, Media Partnerships, Canada, Meta Platforms Inc.
The deals we have done in Australia [Inaudible—Editor] outside of the sharing of links, etc.