Canadian Heritage Committee on Feb. 13th, 2023

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Okay.

Talking about communication, we also received a letter demanding that whatever the committee does and says must go to the lawyers representing them. You mentioned you've had communication with representatives of this company.

Would you please share that communication with us?

[Mala Khanna]

Do you mean the correspondence between the organization, the counsel and the department?

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Yes, it's on the request for the money back.

[Mala Khanna]

I want to just make sure there's no issue with sharing it. If we're able to share it, I will be very pleased to do that.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

This is not client confidentiality we're talking about here because he's demanding the information and communication we're doing. That's communication he's having with you. That's not client confidentiality.

I think it's important we know what's happening with the request for money and what they're communicating to you.

[Mala Khanna]

I will make best efforts to get you the information you're seeking. I understand the reason you would like it, and I will make best efforts to make sure we can provide it to the committee.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

One last time, you had mentioned that no one was released from their job because of this situation. Has there been disciplinary action for any staff over what happened here?

[Mala Khanna]

Thank you for the question.

Accountability is very important. I have spoken to the employees who were involved in this case. This was a situation where the process did not work to ensure we were able to catch this. This was not a situation where an individual employee.... There was no bad faith and there was not a situation where processes were not followed. Processes were followed in this case.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Would you suggest then that the process you had was absolutely negligent? What was in place before then?

[Mala Khanna]

I would not. I would say this was an opportunity for us to learn and do better. We have taken steps to do so.

The processes that were in place before were strong processes in terms of the review process. What we have done now strengthens it.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

That's why I'll be interested in your communication with other departments in the process that you're suggesting.

I have one other thing, following up from my colleague. He asked about who was involved in providing you with the training and information. You said you were going to be pursuing it with others, but you left out the others. What do you mean by the others that you're...?

[Mala Khanna]

In terms of training...?

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Yes.

[Mala Khanna]

We have had conversations with the Simon Wiesenthal Center.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

You mentioned that one already.

[Mala Khanna]

We had conversations with the Jewish Public Servants' Network.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

You mentioned that one.

[Mala Khanna]

It may be that there are other community groups that we have outreached to. We do outreach with many.... Those are the ones I am aware of.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

You made the statement, though, that you're going to pursue it with others. When you said you were going to pursue it with others, I assumed you had others in mind.

[Mala Khanna]

I was referring to the work that my team is doing and wanting to leave the option for them to consult with the relevant community partners.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

I think that's important.

Could you supply us with information on who you contacted to work with you and provide that support as you changed this process and training, and any others you will be in contact with? I think it's important for us to understand what you're doing to remedy this situation. As you said, it's a learning experience. We need to know and to see what that has created and who you talked to in order to do it.

Would you be able to provide us with that?

[Mala Khanna]

Yes.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Thank you.

I'll turn my time to my colleague Marilyn Gladu.

[Marilyn Gladu, Conservative, Sarnia—Lambton, ON]

Very good.

Quickly, I want to make sure that CMAC is not receiving funding from any other departments or ministries. When we see the scope of what they have gotten—

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

I'm sorry, but the time is well over, Marilyn.