Canadian Heritage Committee on April 17th, 2023

[Sébastien Lemire, Bloc, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

If you continue in French, Mr. Julian, you will have them.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

Thank you.

Ms. Lafrenière, you talked about the mental health crisis we are experiencing in this country. We know that young people are under tremendous pressure, particularly because of the pandemic and the socioeconomic crisis. These young people are people who are involved in sports programs.

What do you think the federal government should do to help coaches and sports associations across the country meet the needs of athletes who are experiencing these mental health crises?

[Lorraine Lafrenière]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

In reality, people who don't have the benefit of access to sports, sports clubs or mental health resources are much more affected. That's the reality and that's why we're trying to educate our coaches so that they have a greater understanding and knowledge of mental health issues to begin their reflection and to intervene with athletes and participants across the country.

For me, the priority is for the federal government, in partnership with the provinces and territories, to continue to discuss this topic across the country. We have the Red Deer declaration, which we could build on to continue this work in close collaboration with the entire sport system across the country. It's also a matter of having an honest discussion to identify gaps and problems.

Another aspect of the problem is that sport is becoming more expensive.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

Thank you for that.

I want to come back to the cost of sports in a moment, but I wanted to come back to your response to the question from Mr. Waugh around the issue of the screening of coaches. It has been decades since Sheldon Kennedy opened the door by speaking of the horrific treatment he had received. At that time, we thought that sports organizations were going to respond. The federal government had talked about putting in place requirements. We've found through the course of the hearings we've had with Hockey Canada and Canada Soccer that sports organizations haven't done this.

Is it your opinion and the opinion of your organization that putting in place a very rigid screening so that we can't have abusive people falling through the cracks or passing from one type of coaching to another, which creates more victims and undermines confidence for people in the sporting system...?

[Lorraine Lafrenière]

That's such a complex conversation. I've seen great progress, and I see waves of improvement. Then you lose a person in the organization who believes in safe sport and it goes for naught. It really is about how, through the Red Deer declaration, we codify what safe sport means. That means, what are the actions and what are the concrete steps that need to happen?

Screening, which is just one step in prevention, should be understood across the country in its value and its limitations. It is a component of safety that's critical, just like getting the right equipment is critical. I implore parents—being a mother myself—to think differently about how they register their kids in sport. Have those conversations and lean in collectively. Also, screening has to be standardized, because we need to understand that. It's one step in the safe sport journey.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

Thank you very much. The federal government has a key role to play, and I thank you for going deeper in your response to his question. This is very helpful.

You mentioned the issue of the cost of sports, and we're seeing this increasingly across Canada. There's a segregation of wealthier families and poorer families, with poor families simply not being able to participate in sports. Their kids have not been given the opportunity because of the cost of sports.

What are the recommendations that you can give to us about that? Having been through the sport system myself, I know that it is such a terrific benefit in so many ways. How can we make it more accessible—and safer, of course—and more accessible to kids, even those from lower-income families?

[Lorraine Lafrenière]

I think we need to partner better with organizations like KidSport and Canadian Tire Jumpstart. Corporate Canada can play a very meaningful role in offsetting costs.

I mean, I respect the very demanding priorities of governments across this country in maintaining our economy in the current crisis that we find ourselves in, but I do think that governments have a role in setting and establishing a standard and a commitment to affordable sport and to drive policy across the country in helping sport organizations to do that more effectively. It's not an easy answer, and I think that national sport federations, as you know, we just talked about Hockey Canada, need to do a better job of sharing the wealth to deliver sports and—dare I say?—across sports.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you very much, Ms. Lafrenière. Thank you, Peter.

We're going to go to the second round now. However, I don't think we can do a full second round. We have a very important business meeting to have, and it takes time to get in camera, etc.

What we're going to do is the first part of the second round. I will begin with the Conservatives.

I have no idea who will begin for the Conservatives, but you have five minutes, please.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

It's Mr. Shields.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Go ahead, Mr. Shields, for five minutes.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Yes, thank you. I appreciate the witnesses' being here today.

I have a piece here. We look at organizations...and I think that's one of the recommendations: We'll look at whether the sports organizations have policies and procedures in place.

I'm going to go to the parents on this one.

A provincial-national organization in Canada—not naming it—has it clearly defined. If you, as a parent or parents, have concerns about a coach, you go to this organization, they appoint a third party—independent—to review to see if it's worth going ahead. In this case that I know of, they did go ahead. They appointed a board person to do this. Then, the coach found out, and the coach contacted parents with emails that a parent took to the police. The coach was charged. Now that parent is in front of a commission to throw this concern out because the parent broke the confidentiality, even though the police ruled this as criminal.

Where do we protect the parents in this? The parents are being left out.

When you say they need to take an active role, it is very difficult. This is not the only case I've run across where the parents are at risk. Most of the parents in this group have backed away from it. There's one parent left. The coach may be out of this one, but they'll coach somewhere else.

What is your response to how we solve it for the parents?

[Lorraine Lafrenière]

That's a complicated issue.

I would suggest that part of sport was built in the absence of sport being delivered in the school system, and I think it's still in its infancy in safe sport policies and processes. You know, you drop your child off at school and you think the school system is there and it will protect your child. We kind of apply that to the sport systems, and it's not there.

You're right. The parent can be very vulnerable, and the worry about retribution on their child or themselves is absolutely a cause. That's why unity with parents—and I'm sad for this story—is so important.

It's going to be bumpy. This is going to be a bumpy few years while this system is implemented and governments across the country grapple with safe sport.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Does it drive the costs up to make it unaffordable if we do this? That's the other side of this. When you're putting in bureaucracy, you're driving costs.

[Lorraine Lafrenière]

I understand absolutely what you're saying. I think we need to partner better with the Canadian Centre for Child Protection, for instance. We try to partner with them. We partner with Kids Help Phone. We partner with military welfare. That's the only way we can do our jobs. We haven't had an increase in funding in 10 years.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

In the outside communities when I grew up, the coaches alternated who umped the games. We had the community take care of that. We didn't have these issues because the volunteers did it themselves. We didn't have to have professional people doing it. We played all of these outdoor sports outside of the school. I did it. It was there before. We've lost that.

Ms. Gassewitz, do you have any opinion on what I just asked?

[Debra Gassewitz]

Thank you so much.

One piece you identified is the role of the parents. We did hear a lot of.... The parents have so much to learn and they play such a critical role. Your parents will decide if you're going forward, if you are participating or not.

One of the other things really speaks to education of the parents. When we're talking about safe sport, what we're seeing in some of the processes is being able to recognize what actually is bullying: What is harassment? What is chirping? What are things that people need to be aware of?

I think, to your point, including parents in the solution is a complex issue, but including parents in our education, saying we all need to learn, that we all need to be aware of it, is so important.

Thank you for raising the role of the parents, because, as a parent as well, what don't we know? I agree. We want to learn more.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

You have 30 seconds.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

I have one last question.

Should Hockey Canada, with $100 million, have its money reinstated federally?

Go ahead, Ms. Gassewitz.

[Debra Gassewitz]

I'm not the one.... That's a whole, complex question dealing with a lot of pieces that I'm not aware of. Unfortunately, I'm going to have to leave that one to go where it goes.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Go ahead, Ms. Lafrenière.

[Lorraine Lafrenière]

I think it's early days. I think the minister's commitment to monitoring it is important. As mentioned, if only six of the recommendations are done, I think it's the ongoing vigilance to make sure that all of them are implemented....

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you very much. The time is up.

I'm going to go to the second group, which is the Liberals, and Lisa Hepfner.

Lisa, you have five minutes, please.

[Lisa Hepfner, Liberal, Hamilton Mountain, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

I would like to reiterate the thanks to our witnesses for being here and for sharing such important information. It's a really interesting conversation this morning.

I think this whole conversation around safe sport has been galvanizing across the country. In my riding, in Hamilton, a couple of soccer athletes were speaking out about their hope now that they will achieve pay equity and gender equity in their sport. What I'm hearing from them, and what I heard from you, Ms. Lafrenière, is that diversity is key to safe sport.

Can you help us make that connection a little more clearly?