Evidence of meeting #56 for Environment and Sustainable Development in the 39th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was well.
A recording is available from Parliament.
12:35 p.m.
Conservative
Mark Warawa Conservative Langley, BC
Thank you.
I had a couple of other questions. Mr. Schwartz mentioned in his presentation that half a million wells are being proposed. Is that correct?
12:35 p.m.
Director, Pine Lake Surface Rights Action Group
That is my presentation that was translated, is that correct?
12:40 p.m.
Director, Pine Lake Surface Rights Action Group
Okay. Since then, I've been made aware of the past AEUB president's statement--I think it was at the CSUG conference--where he made the statement that there would be anywhere from 25 to 50 times more CBM wells drilled in the province than conventional oil and gas wells. If you extrapolate that out from 320,000 currently conventional wells in the province, that works out to anywhere between 8 million and 16 million CBM wells.
12:40 p.m.
Conservative
Mark Warawa Conservative Langley, BC
Okay, so it's substantially more even than what you were presenting.
12:40 p.m.
Conservative
12:40 p.m.
Vice-President, Western Canada Operations, Canadian Association of Petroleum Producers
I guess Mr. Cline commented before that we do not see that number of wells going forward. I'm not familiar with Mr. McCrank's statement. It may have been a multiplier on the number of actual operating wells, not the number of wells that are drilled. But I'm speculating on that without the benefit of seeing the statement.
Cam, do you want to add?
12:40 p.m.
Engineer, Canadian Society for Unconventional Gas
Regarding the expectation, at least for the Horseshoe Canyon coal-bed methane, if it was entirely developed—and I think I mentioned this earlier—there's some talk with numbers as high as 35,000 to 50,000 wells.
Certainly no one is anticipating millions of wells for coal-bed methane. It does not seem feasible to me, and certainly to all the members of CSUG. I have never heard anyone talk about numbers that large.
12:40 p.m.
Conservative
Mark Warawa Conservative Langley, BC
My next question is regarding complaints. We heard some complaints from Ms. Ernst and Mr. Schwartz. How many complaints are received? I imagine you would have to deal with some of those complaints, but can anybody comment on the number of complaints lodged annually for coal-bed methane?
12:40 p.m.
Engineer, Canadian Society for Unconventional Gas
Do you specifically mean water well complaints?
12:40 p.m.
Engineer, Canadian Society for Unconventional Gas
I'd be extrapolating on the basis of the information I have, but it would probably be between 100 and 200.
12:40 p.m.
Engineer, Canadian Society for Unconventional Gas
That would be in the last five years, so it would be somewhere in the neighbourhood of 20 per year.
12:40 p.m.
Director, Pine Lake Surface Rights Action Group
I'd like to make a comment on the number of complaints. When you make a complaint about a water well, you make your complaint to Alberta Environment. As a landowner, there's an awful lot of risk involved in making a complaint to Alberta Environment, because if they come out and see a contamination in your well, it might be benzene, which does not, nor could not, occur naturally in your water. It has to come from industry; there's no other way around it. You make that complaint in peril, because if Alberta Environment sees that you have benzene in your water, you get an environmental work order on your land that makes it untransferable.
So maybe the number of complaints is not reflective of the number of issues. I'd like to make the committee aware of this.
12:40 p.m.
Vice-President, Western Canada Operations, Canadian Association of Petroleum Producers
Could we comment on the benzene piece? Would that be acceptable?
12:40 p.m.
Mark Dubord Hydrogeologist, Canadian Society for Unconventional Gas
With the water well complaints that have been investigated to date, the vast majority related to well construction, maintenance, and use. With respect to contaminants specifically, the most common source for benzene in a water well is an above-ground or leaky fuel storage tank. It's very rare to see any kind of impact on the shallow groundwater from a CBM well. You just wouldn't see it; you wouldn't expect it.
12:40 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Bob Mills
I wonder if Mr. Bigras and Mr. Lussier would let Mr. Cullen go next. He has some pertinent questions.
It is your turn, unless you want to pass to Mr. Cullen.
Agreed. Thank you.
Mr. Cullen.
12:40 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
I would like first of all to thank the members of the Bloc québécois.
I have a couple of quick questions. It's unfortunate that we don't have any representatives here from British Columbia, because that seems to be the next sort of vanguard of this action. There are a lot of questions that B.C. residents have about this.
I have a quick question for Mr. Pryce. The Oil and Gas Commission in British Columbia is industry funded. Its source of revenue comes from the industry itself. Does that put it in some sort of conflict of interest, in terms of setting up the regulations around an industry activity?
12:45 p.m.
Vice-President, Western Canada Operations, Canadian Association of Petroleum Producers
That's a comment we've heard in the past, and quite honestly, we would prefer not to be the funders of a regulatory process. Nevertheless, it is the case, and the funding is funnelled indirectly through licence fees and other levy kinds of processes. So it's not directly funded by the companies.
It is administered by a board of government folks. Industry is not involved in that, so there is a separation.
12:45 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
I have an important question for a lot of our rural constituents about well density. Are there any restrictions on well density in any of the proposed projects?
12:45 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
Sorry. I wanted to be particular to British Columbia for a moment. Do we know?