Environment Committee on May 8th, 2007

[An hon. member]

Oh, is that a break week?

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Yes.

On May 31, we could begin with witnesses, and so on, for Bill C-377.

Now, that's just a rough proposal.

On June 5, four of us will be away at the G-8 plus five. I would propose cancelling that meeting because of members' being away.

That's kind of a rough, tentative schedule, if that helps at all.

Mr. Bigras, you're next.

[Bernard Bigras, Bloc, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I am inclined to support the motion of Mr. Cullen. I also like very much that of Mr. McGuinty.

You just threw out a whole bunch of things to do until June. I have not seen any document that clearly spells out a schedule of future business. We are used to discuss future business at a steering committee meeting. It might be a good idea to call a meeting of the steering committee, for example for tomorrow afternoon, in order to establish a work plan and avoid having to vote on motions which might be conflicting.

We have a number of deadlines imposed by the Standing Orders. We have 60 sitting days of the House to consider Bill C-377, but there are also other items that we should deal with. I believe a meeting of the steering committee would allow us to do a proper job.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Mr. Bigras, we did vote previously not to have a steering committee, because you sort of go through the arguments twice. But I would suggest that we could have a meeting. If Mr. Cullen, Mr. Bigras, Mr. McGuinty, Mr. Warawa, and I could get together in the next 24 hours, we could certainly look at that schedule and hopefully accommodate what both your motion and Mr. McGuinty's motion are attempting to accomplish.

Mr. McGuinty.

[David McGuinty, Liberal, Ottawa South, ON]

I'm not sure what we're debating or discussing. Are we debating Mr. Cullen's motion?

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

He is suggesting.... The two are interrelated. What has been suggested is that we have a meeting of all parties to decide on a schedule that would go from now until June 7.

[David McGuinty, Liberal, Ottawa South, ON]

I've tried to do that, Mr. Chair, in the motion that's been tabled here today. I've worked around deadlines, drop-dead dates, reporting times, estimate challenges, deadlines for Bill C-298, and so on. I've tried to weave most of this into the motion that's in play.

I know that, theoretically, we're only supposed to have five meetings left in May. There are strong rumours circulating that the government intends to have the House rise earlier than planned. What I'm saying is that I've tried to reflect most of this in a lot of thought that went into this motion before us today.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

We do have to find out if Mr. Cullen is going to put his motion. If he is, it's first on the agenda and we would have to vote on that. He has made a suggestion, on which I haven't heard agreement, that we get together to come up with that schedule.

Mr. Warawa.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

Thank you, Chair.

I have no problem with us making a decision to go to a steering committee. I think that would be helpful.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

I don't think that's the issue. It's a matter of whether we should have a meeting to decide that.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

Chair, that was the recommendation of Mr. Cullen, I believe, and Mr. Bigras has said yes.

You're quite right in that we did make a decision that we weren't going to have a steering committee, but that could be changed. If we feel at this time that it would be a wise decision, I have no problem with that, which is what you're suggesting in a friendly way, as long as the rules of the steering committee are that consensus must be reached, otherwise it comes back to the committee and is voted on.

There are a lot of issues on the table besides Bill C-377 specifically, but what do we do with all these other issues that Mr. McGuinty wants to speak to on his motion? I would think that a steering committee would be a better way to deal with it, considering that time is just about up.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

In order to have a steering committee, we would need a motion that we rescind the orders that we voted on earlier and that we establish a steering committee. Obviously that motion, if it's put, needs to be debated. I think all of us have expressed that.

My hope was that we could accomplish this just by sitting down and saying this is the schedule we agreed to. It seems to me it's not that difficult. We have very few meetings, and yes, we have witnesses already arranged. We obviously have deadlines of the minister appearing. We have a deadline on Bill C-377, but that's a little bit further out, and so on. But it would seem to me that we could come to a conclusion. It's not rocket science.

Mr. Warawa.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

About a week and a half or two weeks ago we had decided what we were going to do for the spring session. There was good debate and there were eight future business topics. We had decided that we were going to deal with coal-bed methane, which we discussed today. We decided on gasification of waste and carbon sequestration. Witnesses have been called. Now, at the 11th hour, at the 59th minute, we're changing this, which concerns me, because a decision has already been made.

So I think the most practical way of dealing with this and changing the agenda for the fall session would be, if we don't want to have a motion to have a steering committee, then we do it in practice. I am fine with meeting this afternoon or tomorrow, or whenever, so that this can be dealt with as quickly as possible.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

My first wish would be that we sit down together and come up with the agenda for the next three weeks, in that we've had those meetings, as Mr. Warawa has pointed out, we have agreed, we've called witnesses, and so on. Obviously the committee is in charge of the direction in which it goes. Changes can be made. But I would hope that we could sit down reasonably and come up with that conclusion. If you intend to put the motions, we'll proceed. I don't agree that that's the way to proceed, but certainly I'm at your mercy.

Mr. Cullen.

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

There are two quick things. I don't know if we need to do it formally. I think the informal process works, if we have enough agreement to do it in the next 24 hours.

The reason I want to do that is because I want to open up the docket and consider one or two extra meetings as well. It's not as simple as just saying yes, yes, yes, no. I think there's a little conversation we need. It saves committee time if we do it informally, with the four or five people you mentioned, and then if we get agreement, let's do it. And we can take care of Mr. McGuinty's motion today or tomorrow morning. That feels comfortable for me.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Would you agree to proceed that way?

[Bernard Bigras, Bloc, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

Yes, of course. Naturally, I want these meetings held in both official languages and I think it is possible. I do not want a meeting in your office, around a conference table. I will agree only if we have no other choice.

I was away for one afternoon meeting. The government's agenda was agreed to, essentially, since these seem to be the subjects that the government wanted us to consider. So I leave it up to the other members of the committee. This group could meet whenever you decide.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Mr. McGuinty has a comment.

[David McGuinty, Liberal, Ottawa South, ON]

I would second what I just heard from Monsieur Bigras. I was not present when the committee business you rhymed off, Mr. Chair, was discussed. I think a number of the subjects that are being foreseen are important, but they're just not as important as some of the other subjects we ought to be dealing with. What's changed between then and now, of course, is what is happening in this country on climate change, what is happening in this country now in terms of the debate on the response to climate change.

We have some really important drop-dead dates. Ms. Minna's bill, Bill C-298, has to be done by June 5. We have to report back to the House on the estimates by May 31. I would suggest that estimates are more important than coal-bed methane. I would suggest that estimates are more important than a garbage meeting. I would suggest that talking, as I put forward on this motion, about where we're going on climate change and about the analysis backstopping the government's plan is more important than some of the subjects that were chosen from a list, short or long.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

All members were here, Mr. McGuinty, except for yourself and I believe Mr. Cullen.

[David McGuinty, Liberal, Ottawa South, ON]

And Mr. Bigras.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

No, Mr. Bigras was here.

[David McGuinty, Liberal, Ottawa South, ON]

He just said he wasn't.

[Bernard Bigras, Bloc, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

I had been replaced on that day.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

That could be.