Evidence of meeting #24 for Environment and Sustainable Development in the 39th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was chair.
A recording is available from Parliament.
6:05 p.m.
Bloc
Bernard Bigras Bloc Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC
Mr. Chairman, on a point of order.
I am perfectly prepared to listen, but I will not accept attacks on my political party.
Mr. Harvey is losing it. He is straying from the topic. I would ask you to rein him in and remind him that he has to focus on clause 10 of the bill. It is your duty to ask him to stay on the straight and narrow.
6:05 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Bob Mills
Thank you, Mr. Bigras.
Mr. Harvey, please stay on clause 10 as amended. Please stop the political comments to Mr. Bigras and his party and address me. Please stay on topic.
6:05 p.m.
Liberal
David McGuinty Liberal Ottawa South, ON
It is. Mr. Chair, you have to hear my point of order. You don't have that discretion.
6:05 p.m.
Liberal
David McGuinty Liberal Ottawa South, ON
I want to know if you have already put down and described the names of the new Conservative members here on the speaking list. Will they be speaking, sir? I want to know where we are on the speaking list.
6:05 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Bob Mills
Mr. Warawa will be after Mr. Harvey, and then Mr. Petit. At the end of that I will ask for anybody else who wants to go on that speaking list before we go to the vote.
6:05 p.m.
Liberal
David McGuinty Liberal Ottawa South, ON
I just wanted to know where we were. There are three new Conservative members, and I wanted to know if they were on the list already.
6:05 p.m.
Conservative
6:05 p.m.
Conservative
Luc Harvey Conservative Louis-Hébert, QC
Yes, Mr. Chairman.
I was talking about technology—nuclear technology, which the Opposition parties do not see as a solution, as they prefer to hide behind the so-called success of those European countries that are using this technology that results in very few CO2 emissions. In Canada, we have developed a technology based on heavy water reactors, whereas the Europeans—and particularly the French—use graphite to regulate and control atomic reactions inside the reactor.
In recent years, Canada and Canadians have decided not to move forward with nuclear technology. Indeed, that is the very reason why the technology used by Canada, with its CANDU reactors, has been left far behind in terms of international developments with respect to nuclear reactors.
There is another very promising technology, but which is not yet ready. I met with the President of a company by the name of CO2 Solution, which is located in the Quebec City area. That technology is relatively simple. CO2 Solution, using a chemical reaction based on a specific enzyme, has succeeded in turning CO2 into HCO3.
Once the HCO3 chemical reaction is completed, the result is a type of salt — a precipitate that can be re-used by the industry. Indeed, some industries need that molecule, which makes the process even more attractive. Unfortunately, using the CO2 Solution reactor means that to neutralize a ton of CO2 costs, at this time, anywhere from $120 to $150. So, this is a considerably higher cost for the manufacturing sector in Canada.
However, that technology has one very interesting advantage: it causes no restriction during the filtering process. For example, if you inject carbon into the ground, in a carbon sink, pressure will build inside the carbon sink. Whether we like it or not, positive pressure will build inside the sink, which will ultimately cause a restriction. Additional energy will be needed to compress the carbon inside the carbon sink.
The process developed by CO2 Solution causes no such restriction, however. No additional energy is required to filter or remove CO2 from gases emitted through the CO2 Solution chimneys or reactors.
We have heard a lot about wind energy technology. However, some sectors are not in favour of developing wind technology. Also, is it possible to base the development of an entire economy, region or country on wind energy?
Also, would wind energy have no effect whatsoever on the environment, on birds or even on residents living within several hundred meters of a wind farm or a wind tower? They are very likely to say that the noise and electromagnetic radiation created by wind turbines are problematic.
Furthermore, because of its lack of reliability, using wind energy will mean greater reliance on batteries, to ensure a constant power supply. A steady power supply is important for economic development. Personally, I have visited a number of African countries where a generator had to be set up next to a hotel, a house or a plant because, on a given day, the power had to be cut in a given area—or it had to be cut because there was insufficient water or other material to produce energy.
When you base your production capacity and industry on power produced by wind turbines, you have to use batteries. Batteries necessarily involve the use of nickel, lead or other materials which, while they may not emit CO2, have a definite impact on the environment.
Managing nickel is very complex…
6:10 p.m.
Bloc
Bernard Bigras Bloc Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC
Mr. Chairman, we're losing our Latin. We are really wondering who is currently representing the government.
Could I be told who the official representatives of the Conservative Party are? I see that there are now two, four, six, even seven name plates on the table over there. Could the table be cleared and could we be told exactly who is a member of this committee, if you don't mind?
6:15 p.m.
Conservative
Daniel Petit Conservative Charlesbourg—Haute-Saint-Charles, QC
Mr. Chairman, I have a point of order.
6:15 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Bob Mills
Mr. Harvey, Mr. Petit, Mr. Warawa, and Mr. Watson are the official members here. There are other people here to observe.
Thank you, Mr. Bigras.
Mr. Petit, do you have a point of order? Please don't go into the political part of it. Talk to me. I really want to let Mr. Harvey finish. He has the floor. You're interrupting your own member.
Mr. Petit.
6:15 p.m.
Conservative
Daniel Petit Conservative Charlesbourg—Haute-Saint-Charles, QC
When you introduce the government members, then they are the ones entitled to vote. I would just point out that we can have as many members as we like at the table and even around the table, without the Opposition or myself knowing who is on the other side. That's all I want to say. I just wanted to explain, so that things would be clear.
6:15 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Bob Mills
I've given you the list of who's here. The permanent members of the committee know who they are. I don't think we have to clarify that any further.
6:15 p.m.
Liberal
David McGuinty Liberal Ottawa South, ON
I just want to know who's on the list now. If we want to get on the list, who's on the list now?