Evidence of meeting #30 for Environment and Sustainable Development in the 39th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was amendments.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS
Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Vaughan, could you give us your interpretation of the precautionary principle?
Commissioner of the Environment and Sustainable Development, Office of the Auditor General of Canada
Well, different legal definitions have been adopted in the United Nations and elsewhere.
Liberal
Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS
In your case, obviously your role now is as an advocate, in a sense, someone who holds the government to account on these things, and I'm thinking in that context.
Commissioner of the Environment and Sustainable Development, Office of the Auditor General of Canada
I'd be very happy--
Conservative
Mark Warawa Conservative Langley, BC
Chair, I hate to interrupt, but I just want to make sure you are aware there is a legal definition within Canada, within CEPA, and the Liberals now also have a bill, Bill-474, which attempts to change the definition. So I just want to make sure you are aware that this may be the reason the question was asked.
Liberal
Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS
I asked the question, and I'd like to hear Mr. Vaughan's answer.
Commissioner of the Environment and Sustainable Development, Office of the Auditor General of Canada
My understanding of the precautionary principle.... I think it was set out in the 1992 Earth Summit. It's contained in Agenda 21. It's contained in the Rio principles. I think there are different operational definitions for precautionary principle. I think one that's emerging now from an operational sense is to try to anticipate various levels of risk and to attempt to mitigate those risks prior to their opening into full-blown problems.
I'd be glad, sir, to follow this discussion, but as a first observation, that would be my answer.
Liberal
Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS
How do you interpret the role of the commissioner, and how do you intend to implement the duties of your role?
Commissioner of the Environment and Sustainable Development, Office of the Auditor General of Canada
Within the context of the precautionary principle or generally?
Commissioner of the Environment and Sustainable Development, Office of the Auditor General of Canada
I think the visions set out by the Auditor General as well as the recommendations contained in the green ribbon panel's report are ones I agree with, every one of them. I looked very closely at the green ribbon panel's report before having the discussion on moving into this post.
In terms of forward looking and backwards looking--that's what I think you're getting at--I think the main role of the commissioner's position, as I understand it, is on the audit side, and I think that was addressed directly in the green ribbon report. And I think a wealth of invaluable reports have come out from the commissioner's office, most recently the March status report.
If I understand your second point--can you then move forward from those audit reports--I think the auditing role plays an indispensable role in looking at, for example, advocacy and good management and good management of federal policies related to supporting environmental protection and sustainable development.
Liberal
Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS
Do you mean that you would be looking at how advocacy happens, or that you would act as an advocate?
Commissioner of the Environment and Sustainable Development, Office of the Auditor General of Canada
I would act as an advocate for good management.
Commissioner of the Environment and Sustainable Development, Office of the Auditor General of Canada
Yes, sir.
Liberal
Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS
An advocate for sustainable development would be a different matter, I presume?
Commissioner of the Environment and Sustainable Development, Office of the Auditor General of Canada
This is a complicated discussion. This being my second day on the job, I look forward to your advice, your interpretation, and your view of this matter.
I would go back to my observations on the sustainable development strategies together with those of my predecessors, including Mr. Thompson. As an advocate for sustainable development, I think that the sustainable development strategies and the concept of sustainable development has now lost its operational focus. If you're trying to be an advocate for sustainable development, this committee affords an opportunity to put some concrete parameters around how elected officials and parliamentarians view the operational implications of sustainable development and sustainability.
Once the policy is articulated, the role of the commissioner and the Auditor General's office will be to see that the policies are implemented in an accountable and credible way.
Liberal
John Godfrey Liberal Don Valley West, ON
The work that the committee is doing on Bill C-474, an excellent piece of legislation, in my own view, might be part of the guidance you are talking about. It could create an operational definition of sustainable development that would help you in your work.
Commissioner of the Environment and Sustainable Development, Office of the Auditor General of Canada
Viewing the testimony of my predecessor, Mr. Thompson, and also looking at the draft of Bill C-474, I think that the office has been clear that there is a need for an overarching federal vision of sustainable development. Operationally, the devil is going to be in the details, as Mr. Thompson said. The overarching context would provide some guidance as well as an operational division of labour among the different departments and agencies mandated to submit the SDS. I think the overarching articulation of this vision would be a positive contribution, but this is a personal opinion.
Bloc
Bernard Bigras Bloc Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
Mr. Vaughan, I would like to start by congratulating you on your appointment. I would also like to congratulate Ms. Fraser on her choice.
Two things struck me when I read your biography and learned of your professional background. To begin with, you are a former head of the Organization of American States, where you were a specialist in sustainable development matters. Among other things, that organization sees to it that there is some level of integration within the Americas.
You also worked at the North American Commission for Environmental Cooperation, which was created after the North American Free Trade Agreement was signed so as to provide for better environmental protection in international agreements such as, for example, those regarding north-south trade.
There is a lot debate on the subject of a partnership on North American security and prosperity. How does your past experience tie into the integration of the Americas and the increasing dialogue on a partnership on prosperity and security? Some people fear that there will be a streamlining of our environmental regulations and laws with the southern states and that there will be a lesser focus on the environment in these negotiations, including those which may take place between the north and the south on the topic of water.
Can you confirm that you will be an environmental policy watchdog at a time when there is an increased focus on discussions over the economic integration of the Americas?
