Evidence of meeting #37 for Environment and Sustainable Development in the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was sahtu.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Rob Prosper  Vice-President, Protected Areas Establishment and Conservation, Parks Canada
Kevin McNamee  Director, Parks Establishment, Parks Canada
Rocky Norwegian  President, Tulita Renewable Resources Council
Ethel Blondin-Andrew  Chairperson, Sahtu Secretariat Incorporated

3:30 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Harold Albrecht

I'd like to call our meeting to order.

This is meeting number 37 of the Standing Committee on Environment and Sustainable Development.

We have with us today, appearing as a witness, the Honourable Leona Aglukkaq, the Minister of the Environment.

We welcome as witnesses as well the staff from Parks Canada: Rob Prosper, vice-president, protected areas establishment and conservation; Kevin McNamee, director of parks establishment; and Darlene Pearson, director of policy, legislative and cabinet affairs branch, strategy and plan directorate.

Welcome, Minister. We welcome your opening comments, followed by questions from our committee members.

November 17th, 2014 / 3:30 p.m.

Nunavut Nunavut

Conservative

Leona Aglukkaq ConservativeMinister of the Environment

Thank you, Mr. Chair and honourable members. Thank you again for the opportunity to appear before this committee to speak to Bill S-5, the Nááts’ihch’oh national park reserve act.

This is important legislation to protect the lands and water of the nationally significant landscape in the Northwest Territories. Protecting the Nááts’ihch’oh national park reserve is a commitment that we had made in the 2013 Speech from the Throne, to protect the wilderness land of the Nááts’ihch’oh by 2015.

Creating this new national park reserve delivers on Canada's national conservation plan announced by the Prime Minister in May 2014. This park will help conserve our country's natural environment, restore ecosystems, and connect Canadians to nature.

We are creating this national park reserve in collaboration with aboriginal people in the Tulita district of the Sahtu settlement area. The park is subject to the provisions of the Sahtu Dene and Metis Comprehensive Land Claim Agreement. This agreement requires Parks Canada to enter into an impact and benefit agreement with the Sahtu Dene and Métis prior to establishing a national park reserve in their settlement area.

Signed in March 2012, the Nááts’ihch’oh impact and benefit plan covers cooperative management, the continuation of traditional harvesting rights, and economic opportunities.

Under the plan the community of Tulita will be the administrative centre for the Nááts’ihch’oh. This will involve the development of office space, a visitor centre, staff housing. Construction and maintenance of these facilities will employ local trades people in the community of Tulita.

Traditional use of land within the national park reserve by the Sahtu Dene, and Métis will continue as a right under the land claim agreement. They will continue to harvest wildlife and plants on parklands, including gathering plant materials for food, medicine, cultural and other personal purposes.

Mr. Chair, I will now turn to the specifics of this bill itself.

The main purpose is to establish the park under the protection of the Canada National Parks Act.

Clause 6 of Bill S-5 amends the act by adding the boundary description of the national park reserve. The boundary achieves key conservation gains, including protection of the upper reaches of the South Nahanni River, as well as the habitat for woodland caribou and grizzly bears.

The boundary in Bill S-5 is slightly different from the one announced by the Prime Minister in 2012. An area of about 20 square kilometres extending to the south shore of O'Grady Lake was added at the request of the Sahtu Dene and Métis. This addition will serve as a gateway to the park to make it easier for visitors to access.

An ecological site on one square kilometre was removed at the request of the Northwest Territories government.

We are taking steps to ensure the new national park reserve will not only protect the environment, but make meaningful contributions to the social and economic well-being of the community.

The park provides for conservation values and visitor experience without blocking access to significant areas with high mineral potential. The bill before us will continue to allow the mining industry to use several specific mineral access roads in order to access their existing mineral claims.

Finally, Mr. Chair, I would like to summarize the steps our government is taking to establish, develop, and operate this national park reserve.

Our government has provided Parks Canada with an annual operating budget of $1.4 million for the Nááts’ihch’oh. This is in addition to the $3 million in capital investment in the community of Tulita. We have established a management committee that will provide advice on the development of the park management plan, employment, training, and economic opportunities for Sahtu members.

Parks Canada has opened a temporary office in Tulita until a new one is constructed. Parks Canada has started discussions with first nations on the supply office, a visitor centre, a warehouse, and housing units.

Parks Canada has also initiated the staffing of positions in Tulita, including a site superintendent. Parks Canada is advertising positions locally in the community and is consulting with the Sahtu on how best to attract Sahtu beneficiaries.

We are committed to fulfilling the terms of our agreement with the Sahtu Dene and Metis Comprehensive Land Claim Agreement and have moved to immediately implement it.

The Nááts'ihch'oh national park reserve has received overwhelming support from stakeholder groups, leadership and community members, and local regional governments in the area. All first nations and Métis as well as stakeholder groups were invited to consultations. Meetings with the leadership and community members from several communities in the Northwest Territories and Yukon were also conducted. Of the over 1,600 individuals who participated in the consultation process, more than 96% support the creation of this park.

The Government of the Northwest Territories applauds this bill. Mr. Peter Vician, the GNWT deputy minister of the Department of Industry, Tourism and Investment, told a Senate committee on June 4, 2014, “The Government of the Northwest Territories supports the establishment of the proposed park as set out in this legislation.”

This legislation is being passed less than a year after Canada and the Northwest Territories reached a historic devolution agreement on the transfer of the administration and control of land and resources to the territorial government. Once it is established, I am confident that both governments will continue to collaborate to ensure that any development on the land outside the park will not have an impact on the national park values that we are seeking to protect through Bill S-5.

The bill delivers on our government's northern strategy. It promotes responsible approaches to northern development that balance environmental protection with socio-economic development while empowering northerners and exercising Canada's sovereignty in the north. Northerners have shaped the federal boundary and negotiated terms of the establishment of the park.

In closing, Mr. Chairman, I urge this committee to not just think of Bill S-5 as establishing Canada's 44th national park but rather to consider the larger achievement here. Globally this is among the most significant national park expansions ever. With Bill S-5, our government has expanded by sevenfold the nearly 5,000 square kilometres of the Nahanni National Park Reserve to the point where the Nahanni/Nááts'ihch'oh national parks complex is the third largest in Canada at 35,000 square kilometres. Together Nahanni and Nááts'ihch'oh parks protect 86% of the entire South Nahanni River watershed. The two parks jointly provide habitat for up to 600 grizzly bears, nine times the number of grizzly bears within Banff National Park, Canada's first national park.

Mr. Chair, Bill S-5 is part of this Parliament's legacy to future generations.

I wish you well in your deliberations.

I would be happy to take questions.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

3:35 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Harold Albrecht

Thank you very much. I appreciate your comments, and I appreciate your keeping well within your 10-minute time limit for your opening statement.

We're going to proceed now to questions from members.

We'll start with Mr. Carrie.

3:35 p.m.

Conservative

Colin Carrie Conservative Oshawa, ON

I want to thank the minister for coming to committee again. It seems as though you were here only yesterday, and I know everybody here appreciates your presence.

To begin, could you please explain to the committee why this area is being designated as a national park reserve?

3:40 p.m.

Conservative

Leona Aglukkaq Conservative Nunavut, NU

The size of the Parks Canada protected network was just over 277 square kilometres. Our government will protect an additional 149,000 square kilometres, an area almost eight times the size of Lake Ontario. Within this total, our government has established six new protected areas since 2006, protecting just over 49,000 square kilometres.

This park is being established as part of our commitment to a number of parks which we announced in the throne speech and so on. We are proceeding on those commitments and building on the legacy of the initiatives that we have undertaken since 2006. This is one of the commitments we made through the Speech from the Throne regarding working in partnership with a number of stakeholders in the Northwest Territories.

3:40 p.m.

Conservative

Colin Carrie Conservative Oshawa, ON

Minister, we all know that you come from the north and you know first-hand the pristine, natural beauty that surrounds us in Canada's north. I was wondering if you could please describe to the committee what this new national park will serve to protect.

3:40 p.m.

Conservative

Leona Aglukkaq Conservative Nunavut, NU

Nááts’ihch’oh national park reserve protects 70% of South Nahanni watershed that lies within the Sahtu settlement area. I believe you also have received a map of the area that we're proceeding in protecting. It protects more than wildlife management, from mountain woodland caribou, to grizzly bears, Dall sheep, mountain goats, and trumpeter swans. The Nááts’ihch’oh protects habitats of 82 grizzly bears and 63% of the summer range of the Nahanni caribou herd within the Sahtu settlement area.

The park also protects the land that has been travelled and valued for its traditional harvesting purposes and its spiritual importance to the Mountain Dene in the Tulita district area. The mountain after which the national park reserve takes its name has been a pilgrimage site for the Sahtu Dene and Métis people from time immemorial. The park also protects places such as Moose Ponds, the south shore of O'Grady Lake, and much of the course of the South Nahanni River used by canoeists and whitewater enthusiasts.

3:40 p.m.

Conservative

Colin Carrie Conservative Oshawa, ON

That's great.

Minister, you know that the committee just studied the Rouge, and we've heard the term “ecological integrity” quite a bit lately. I was wondering if you could let the committee know how the ecological integrity of Nááts’ihch’oh national park reserve will be protected now and for generations to come.

3:40 p.m.

Conservative

Leona Aglukkaq Conservative Nunavut, NU

The establishment of the Nááts’ihch’oh completes the ongoing work to significantly expand the Nahanni National Park Reserve. It also helps to conserve a significant portion of the world-class South Nahanni River watershed. Our government has expanded the original Nahanni boundaries sevenfold making it the third largest national park complex in Canada. Globally, this is among the most significant national park expansions.

The connection to the expanding Nahanni National Park Reserve is important to the ecological integrity of this park. Together, Nahanni and Nááts’ihch’oh protect about 86% of the entire South Nahanni River watershed. The two parks jointly provide habitats for up to 600 grizzly bears. This is nine times greater than the number of grizzly bears protected within Banff National Park. The establishment agreements are government signed with the Sahtu Dene as well as the Métis, and commits both parties to sustain the ecological integrity of the South Nahanni watershed.

3:40 p.m.

Conservative

Colin Carrie Conservative Oshawa, ON

Minister, we got a map with our handout. I was wondering if you could comment on how the lands adjacent to this world-class national park reserve will be managed to ensure the protection of the natural surroundings.

3:40 p.m.

Conservative

Leona Aglukkaq Conservative Nunavut, NU

The land outside the park will be subject to all the laws of general application, particularly the Mackenzie Valley Resource Management Act. The Sahtu Land Use Plan recognizes the entire watershed as regards proposed conservation initiatives and will provide guidance on its development. When and where appropriate, Parks Canada will work with land managers and responsible authorities on land adjacent to the national park just as it does with other national parks across Canada to ensure a collaborative approach to resource management.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Colin Carrie Conservative Oshawa, ON

Minister, it's critical to consult with local stakeholders prior to making decisions that will affect them. Can you please tell the committee who was consulted on the proposed boundary for Nááts’ihch’oh and where these consultations took place?

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Leona Aglukkaq Conservative Nunavut, NU

The creation of this park has been years in the making. It involved consultation with communities, aboriginal groups, industry, and the Government of the Northwest Territories. Parks Canada also conducted public consultations on the three boundary options in Yellowknife, Whitehorse, Calgary, and Ottawa. All first nations and Métis with settled or asserted claims in the areas were also invited. Consultations were also conducted with the leadership and community members of Norman Wells, Tulita, Fort Good Hope, Fort Simpson, Nahanni Butte, and Fort Liard.

When Parks Canada released its three boundary options for comments in 2010, it was very clear that it was not a vote; it was a discussion. The agency affirmed it was unlikely that the final boundary would look exactly like any of the three options, so consideration was given to the views of the Government of the Northwest Territories as a result of the mineral and energy resource assessment and the strategic value of the minerals in the area. Northerners also played a key role in setting the park boundaries and negotiating the terms of those establishments.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Harold Albrecht

Thank you, Mr. Carrie.

Thank you, Minister.

We'll now move to Mr. Bevington for seven minutes.

3:45 p.m.

NDP

Dennis Bevington NDP Northwest Territories, NT

Thanks, Madam Minister, for your presence here today on this very important subject for my constituents, the Nááts’ihch’oh national park reserve.

It has been a process that I think has had a conclusion which in some respects doesn't match up with what many of the people who were involved in the consultation had asked for, so that's something we have concerns about. We generally support the bill because it is a step forward. It may not be what all people want in the region. It may not be a complete protection for the ecosystem, and that's very evident because the upper reaches of the Nahanni watershed are not protected and can be subject to mineral development.

Having lived next to a national park, Wood Buffalo, for many years, I understand the impacts that resource development around a park can have on the watershed, on the very integrity of that particular park. Of course, when you have a river that flows directly through the park and is essential to the park, when it is the essential feature of the park.... In the words of my constituents, water is the most significant feature on the land. They like to say “water is life”, in that water must be protected at all costs. That's the attitude of people in the Sahtu region.

In the process of not choosing the larger boundaries, which would have excluded some mineral and resource development from taking place because it would have been within the park boundary, you've made some deliberate choices that didn't really stand up to the opinions of the public. Can you explain why you chose to go with the smaller boundary for the park and exclude these potential developments that if allowed to go ahead would likely have impacts on the pristine nature of the park and of the river system?

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

Leona Aglukkaq Conservative Nunavut, NU

I'll speak to the consultations on the boundary issue again, as a follow-up to the comments in my opening remarks. As the member knows well, the creation of the park has been years in the making, involving a number of consultations with communities, aboriginal groups, and industry, as well as the Government of the Northwest Territories. Of the 1,603 individual submissions and comments, 65 did not support our proposal, so that's not the majority of people related to the boundaries question.

3:50 p.m.

NDP

Dennis Bevington NDP Northwest Territories, NT

How many of those spoke to the boundary question?

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

Leona Aglukkaq Conservative Nunavut, NU

Sixty of the 1,603.

3:50 p.m.

NDP

Dennis Bevington NDP Northwest Territories, NT

How many of the 1,600 spoke to the boundary issue?

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

Leona Aglukkaq Conservative Nunavut, NU

The 60 did not support our proposal. They didn't comment on—

3:50 p.m.

NDP

Dennis Bevington NDP Northwest Territories, NT

How many of the 1,600 actually spoke to the boundary issue and said that the boundary was adequate?

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

Leona Aglukkaq Conservative Nunavut, NU

Sixty spoke against.

3:50 p.m.

NDP

Dennis Bevington NDP Northwest Territories, NT

How many spoke for that particular boundary?

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

Leona Aglukkaq Conservative Nunavut, NU

The silent majority was in support of it.

3:50 p.m.

NDP

Dennis Bevington NDP Northwest Territories, NT

Okay.