Evidence of meeting #110 for Environment and Sustainable Development in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was project.
A recording is available from Parliament.
11:55 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Deb Schulte
We're out of time, and we need to be careful about our language around the committee.
11:55 a.m.
An hon. member
Hear, hear!
11:55 a.m.
Some hon. members
Oh, oh!
11:55 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Deb Schulte
I still think that's probably not really what we want to be saying.
I want to thank the minister very much for coming back and giving us that chance to delve in a bit deeper on the work that we've been doing over the past couple of weeks. It's a big bill, a tough initiative and issue. There's a lot of finding the right balance, and we have many amendments that have come forward that we'll be working on next week and the week after as we delve through the clauses.
Thank you again.
Noon
Liberal
Catherine McKenna Liberal Ottawa Centre, ON
Once again I want to thank the members of the committee. Look, we're all in this together. We believe that we need to rebuild the trust of Canadians and we need to attract investment. I think this is the opportunity to get it right, so thank you for your hard work.
Noon
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Deb Schulte
Thank you.
I'm going to suspend to bring the departments up. Thank you.
12:05 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Deb Schulte
I'll resume.
Thank you very much to all the departments that have come to join us this afternoon until 1 p.m. to answer the questions we have. Again, I'd like the questions to be specific to the bill and maybe any amendments that people have brought forward. That would be helpful.
I also want to remind people—because I'm not sure everybody's aware—that the bill has been updated, so the page numbers are different. As we go into clause-by-clause next week, be aware that you should get a new version of the bill because the pages and the bill don't match anymore from the preliminary version that we had. Thank you for that.
I just want to introduce, from the Department of Natural Resources, Jeff Labonté, assistant deputy minister, major projects management office; and Terence Hubbard, director general, petroleum resources branch. We have, from the Canadian Environmental Assessment Agency, Christine Loth-Bown, vice-president, policy development sector; and Brent Parker, director, legislative and regulatory affairs division. From the Department of Transport we have Catherine Higgens, assistant deputy minister, programs; and Nancy Harris, executive director, regulatory stewardship and aboriginal affairs.
Thanks to all of you for being here. I understand that you're not making statements; we're just going to go straight into questions.
We'll start with Mr. Fisher, who did not get a chance as a result of the last session.
12:10 p.m.
Liberal
Darren Fisher Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
That's right, I didn't get a chance because I think Mr. Fast took all my time in the last session.
12:10 p.m.
Liberal
Darren Fisher Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
Thanks, Madam Chair.
Thanks, folks, for being here today. I will ask you some of the questions that I had organized for the minister. With Bill C-69,—and I'm talking about science—the proponents are in charge of doing their own science. What checks and balances will we have in place through the bill to ensure that we're working with actual, good science?
I'm looking at nobody in particular, just whoever feels they want to take that on.
May 3rd, 2018 / 12:10 p.m.
Christine Loth-Bown Vice-President, Policy Development Sector, Canadian Environmental Assessment Agency
I can start, and then my colleagues can chime in.
As the minister noted in her remarks, Bill C-69 is premised on ensuring that decisions that are taken under the legislation are evidence-based. Throughout the assessment process, we have a number of different factors and opportunities to ensure that takes place. In proposed section 22 we outline all the factors that need to be assessed in an impact assessment, and through early planning, we'll work with a proponent to develop impact statement guidelines. Those would be the guidelines that would outline the scientific studies and the issues that they need to address through the impact statement.
Throughout that early planning process we also have the opportunity to engage with others—the public stakeholders and indigenous groups—to ensure that those impact statement guidelines are comprehensive and tailored to the specific project. Then, within the legislation and the proposed amendments there's also the opportunity to do peer review of science on a case-by-case basis, should that be warranted—that may be for some projects but not for others—so that there could be a peer review of the science and evidence. Then of course there's the transparency of all the decisions and the rationale for those decisions.
12:10 p.m.
Liberal
Darren Fisher Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
The rationale for those decisions, is that going to be public?
12:10 p.m.
Vice-President, Policy Development Sector, Canadian Environmental Assessment Agency
Yes, the rationale for the minister's decisions will be public, and that is a significant change from the current CEAA 2012 legislation.
12:10 p.m.
Liberal
Darren Fisher Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
How will the public get that information? How will you disseminate that information to the public?
12:10 p.m.
Vice-President, Policy Development Sector, Canadian Environmental Assessment Agency
Included in the changes are also changes to the registry. Currently, the Canadian Environmental Assessment Agency has an online registry system. There are about 80 different components within the draft legislation that propose transparency elements to increase the amount of documentation and information that's available to the public on the registry site.
12:10 p.m.
Liberal
Darren Fisher Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
What does the bill mean for federal lands, for instance, ports? Will expansions to ports require an assessment?
12:10 p.m.
Vice-President, Policy Development Sector, Canadian Environmental Assessment Agency
There are federal land provisions within the legislation, specifically, and those have been enhanced since the current legislation. With respect to federal lands, there are increased requirements for specific criteria to be looked at by all federal authorities when conducting assessments. There's also an increased transparency for federal lands and federal authorities conducting assessments. They need to notify and post that when they are conducting an assessment or review, so that everyone is aware. They need to also post the rationale for their decisions.
In addition to that, the minister indicated that we are out right now consulting on a paper that looks at what the criteria would be for the establishment of the project list. Within that consultation, we are also looking at whether projects on federal lands need to go onto the project list. That will be part of that conversation as well.
12:10 p.m.
Liberal
Darren Fisher Liberal Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
Thank you.
Can you tell me how a collaborative approach would work between the agency, the CER, and the Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission?
12:10 p.m.
Vice-President, Policy Development Sector, Canadian Environmental Assessment Agency
Within the legislation, those are the proposed sections starting in the forties: 43 and 46. They're known as integrated reviews.
What we want to do through integrated reviews is to ensure that one assessment process can meet the requirements of the impact assessment legislation and the requirements of life-cycle regulators, such as the Canadian energy regulator, as proposed in the legislation, and the Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission.
The lead agency would be the impact assessment agency, but they would be working in co-operation with a life-cycle regulator, such as the CER or the Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission. That's to ensure that we are able to benefit from the knowledge and experience of those life-cycle regulators. It's important to note that they are the regulators over the life cycle of the project. They continue that relationship after an impact assessment has been conducted.
The Minister of Environment and Climate Change, though, will appoint the panel members. At least one of those panel members is to come from a roster that would be recommended by the commissioner or the president of the CER or the Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission.
12:15 p.m.
Liberal
12:15 p.m.
Vice-President, Policy Development Sector, Canadian Environmental Assessment Agency
As the minister noted, there are two sections within the legislation that specifically look at Canada's climate commitments and obligations: proposed subsection 22(1) and then proposed section 63, in the decision-making.
It's important to note that climate commitments and environmental obligations are looked at as to whether they contribute to or hinder a project. That's an important notation, just like the socio-economic and all the analysis we're going to do. This proposed legislation does propose to look at both positives and negatives and take that into the entire assessment.
As the minister noted, Environment and Climate Change Canada will soon be launching a strategic environmental assessment on climate. That will give us guidance on climate impacts on a project basis.
